A Realistic View at 2018: Part I

[moonslav59]

Keith Moreland signing was insurance move.

 

You mean Mitch.

 

Quit being Monday morning quarterbacks. DD wanted to bring back last year's team as the 'floor'. Nunez deal took longer because of his health. Note that Sox was in constanct contact with Nunez camp.

 

Quit Monday morning myt Monday morningin'

 

 

It was better to approach JD Martinez deal with the team pretty well set.

 

If Moreland's presence keep s Hanley from vesting then basically we signed Moreland for nothing.

 

Morrison & Duda could have done the same.

 

This board is all about giving opinions.

[moonslav59]

As you know, last year we might have signed EE if it wasn't for the mandate to reset the tax rate.

 

We could have signed him and stayed under the limit had we traded Young and not signed Moreland and Holt.

[sk7326]

We could have signed him and stayed under the limit had we traded Young and not signed Moreland and Holt.

 

With Encarnacion the fear was the years ... I suspect if the Sox knew Cleveland was going to get such a sweetheart deal they might have reconsidered

[mvp 78]

We could have signed him and stayed under the limit had we traded Young and not signed Moreland and Holt.

 

Holt was a FA last year?

[moonslav59]

Holt was a FA last year?

 

No, but we chose to go to arb with him rather than trade or DFA him.

 

There were several options fo4r reducing salary to accommodate EE. One, we could have trade HRam after he had a pretty decent season. We would not have saved $22M, but we might have saved $10M. Here's more.... (mix & match)

 

$6-10M HRam

 

$6.5M Young

 

$5.5M Moreland

 

$2M Abad

 

$2M Holt

[moonslav59]

With Encarnacion the fear was the years ... I suspect if the Sox knew Cleveland was going to get such a sweetheart deal they might have reconsidered

 

I was not for signing EE. I'm just saying we could have, if we wanted to do so.

[Bellhorn04]

We could have signed him and stayed under the limit had we traded Young and not signed Moreland and Holt.

 

Under the assumption someone was willing to pick up Young's tab.

[mvp 78]

Chris Sale is a clubhouse cancer! Despicable!

 

http://www.masslive.com/redsox/index.ssf/2018/03/jason_groome_chris_sale_pushed.html#incart_river_index

 

When Red Sox top pitching prospect Jason Groome got a text from an unknown number last winter claiming to be from Chris Sale, he thought one of his friends was pulling a prank on him.

 

Groome checked with a mutual friend. The number did indeed belong to Boston's ace starter.

 

Sale, who lives in Naples, found out that Groome was living on his own in Fort Myers and figured he could use a workout partner.

 

"It's not like I'm going to teach him anything profound," Sale said. "Just like hey this is your first year down here and in the organization, I live down here, and I've got a guy I work out with and kind of show him what it's like to put work in in the offseason."

 

Sale has worked out for years at a Naples gym called Beyond Motion where part of his training includes Pilates. The core strength and flexibility that Pilates promotes is a nice compliment to the rest of Sale's offseason work. He thought it might work for Groome, too.

 

The 19-year-old lefty had never done Pilates before, but was willing to try anything Sale suggested despite being a little nervous at first.

 

"I grew up watching him and he asked me to work out so I was really pumped up that he even went out of his way to arrange that," Groome said. "It was just so cool to be a part of his offseason."

 

Groome worked out at JetBlue Park on Mondays and Tuesdays and then spent Wednesdays doing Pilates at Beyond Motion with Sale and sometimes Rick Porcello. Thursdays and Fridays were back to lifting sometimes at Beyond Motion and other times at the park.

 

Groome was well accustomed to the Red Sox strength program, but Pilates was something completely different and harder than he imagined.

 

"The first couple sessions I guess it didn't live up to the hype and I guess in my head I was like 'Oh that isn't too bad,'" Groome said. "But then after the first two it really, it hurts but it works in a very good way. I noticed it because I would go in there some days sore after squatting the day before, and I would wake up the next morning and not be nearly as sore as I was on Tuesday morning."

 

Having Groome as a workout partner also pushed the competitor in Sale. While both are 6-foot-6 lefties, Groome has about 40 pounds on Sale.

 

"It's always nice for me to have someone to work out with pushing you and keeping you in check," Sale said. "He's a lot stronger than I am. You've got a guy 10 years younger than you, lifting twice as much, it'll stroke your ego and motivate you a little bit, too, so it was fun though. I think we both got something out of it."

 

The offseason workouts with Sale put Groome in a good position for a healthy 2018 season. Last year, his first full year in professional baseball, Groome missed a large chunk of time due to two separate injuries.

 

In his first start of the year for Single-A Greenville he suffered a mild lat strain and missed a month and a half. When he returned in June, he made three starts in Short-Season Lowell and 10 starts in Greenville before a forearm strain ended his season.

 

Groome had been receiving regular treatment on his arm and elbow from the training staff, but after a start in late August, he didn't feel right the following day. He told the training staff and with just a month left in the season, they opted to shut him down.

 

Despite the injuries and a 5.69 ERA over 14 starts, Groome, Boston's 2016 first-round pick, still ranked as a top 100 prospect in baseball and the top overall prospect in the Boston system in all the preseason projections.

 

Groome took three months off from throwing following the forearm strain and didn't pick up a ball again until December. But over the past three months, he's been on a regular schedule and hasn't felt any issues with his arm or lat muscle.

 

"Besides being hurt, I just look at that season as a big learning season for me," he said. "Just going into my full season and just finding my routine once I got back to being healthy but just learning was the biggest thing for me last year and especially with my body. Knowing when my body has had too much and when to take off. It wasn't an unsuccessful season last year, I can say that."

 

An offseason working out with Sale helped put the injury-riddled 2017 season behind him.

 

"I put in a lot of work this offseason so I feel like my body is right where it needs to be at," Groome said. "I'm just ready to get after it this year."

[Nick]

I had a dream....

 

Red Sox signed Stanton to play left field. Cora said that Beni would move to right and Betts agreed to play 2B. Just money, no players lost.

 

Red Sox signed JD Martinez to DH. Just money, no players lost.

 

Red Sox signed Nunez as super utility guy. Just money, no players lost.

 

Red Sox then traded for Votto. Gave up some young ones but no one on the 25 man roster.

 

Betts

Votto

Martinez

Stanton

Devers

Xander

Beni

Vazquez

JBJ

 

Our Luxury Tax payroll was now $280M. Henry said no sweat. The break even point was $350M.

 

I came here and everyone was complaining about our pitching staff.

 

Kimmi was posting about impending cliff because the entire team had opt out clause in two years. Our farm was so bad Sox Prospect didn't even have a top 20 ranking. Our ranking started at 21.

 

Moon was making a case for signing Machado and Harper after 2018 season and still keeping the payroll below $350M. He said getting rid of Holt would save the Sox $2.5M.

 

Jacksonianmarch insisted Yankees still had better offense.

Edited March 1, 2018 by Nick

[mvp 78]

Moving Betts to 2b and putting Beni in RF is legitimately a nightmare scenario.

 

Betts can move to 2b when he hits his mid 30's.

[Bellhorn04]

I had a dream....

 

Red Sox signed Stanton to play left field. Cora said that Beni would move to right and Betts agreed to play 2B. Just money, no players lost.

 

Red Sox signed JD Martinez to DH. Just money, no players lost.

 

Red Sox signed Nunez as super utility guy. Just money, no players lost.

 

Red Sox then traded for Votto. Gave up some young ones but no one on the 25 man roster.

 

Betts

Votto

Martinez

Stanton

Devers

Xander

Beni

Vazquez

JBJ

 

Our Luxury Tax payroll was now $280M. Henry said no sweat. The break even point was $350M.

 

I came here and everyone was complaining about our pitching staff.

 

Kimmi was posting about impending cliff because the entire team had opt out clause in two years. Our farm was so bad Sox Prospect didn't even have a top 20 ranking. Our ranking started at 21.

 

Moon was making a case for signing Machado and Harper after 2018 season and still keeping the payroll below $350M. He said getting rid of Holt would save the Sox $2.5M.

 

Jacksonianmarch insisted Yankees still had better offense.

 

The only thing that's inaccurate is that Jackso would probably have conceded we had the better offense.

[mvp 78]

The only thing that's inaccurate is that Jackso would probably have conceded we had the better offense.

 

It would have came with the qualifier that JD and Stanton are injury risks and can't be counted on.

[Nick]

Little humor boys......

[moonslav59]

Under the assumption someone was willing to pick up Young's tab.

 

Or, most of it. Remember, he was coming off a nice 2016 season.

[Bellhorn04]

Little humor boys......

 

I certainly took it as such.

[mvp 78]

I certainly took it as such.

 

People take this place seriously?

[Bellhorn04]

People take this place seriously?

 

It varies.

[Jack Flap]

Chris Sale is a clubhouse cancer! Despicable!

 

http://www.masslive.com/redsox/index.ssf/2018/03/jason_groome_chris_sale_pushed.html#incart_river_index

 

When Red Sox top pitching prospect Jason Groome got a text from an unknown number last winter claiming to be from Chris Sale, he thought one of his friends was pulling a prank on him.

 

Groome checked with a mutual friend. The number did indeed belong to Boston's ace starter.

 

Sale, who lives in Naples, found out that Groome was living on his own in Fort Myers and figured he could use a workout partner.

 

"It's not like I'm going to teach him anything profound," Sale said. "Just like hey this is your first year down here and in the organization, I live down here, and I've got a guy I work out with and kind of show him what it's like to put work in in the offseason."

 

Sale has worked out for years at a Naples gym called Beyond Motion where part of his training includes Pilates. The core strength and flexibility that Pilates promotes is a nice compliment to the rest of Sale's offseason work. He thought it might work for Groome, too.

 

The 19-year-old lefty had never done Pilates before, but was willing to try anything Sale suggested despite being a little nervous at first.

 

"I grew up watching him and he asked me to work out so I was really pumped up that he even went out of his way to arrange that," Groome said. "It was just so cool to be a part of his offseason."

 

Groome worked out at JetBlue Park on Mondays and Tuesdays and then spent Wednesdays doing Pilates at Beyond Motion with Sale and sometimes Rick Porcello. Thursdays and Fridays were back to lifting sometimes at Beyond Motion and other times at the park.

 

Groome was well accustomed to the Red Sox strength program, but Pilates was something completely different and harder than he imagined.

 

"The first couple sessions I guess it didn't live up to the hype and I guess in my head I was like 'Oh that isn't too bad,'" Groome said. "But then after the first two it really, it hurts but it works in a very good way. I noticed it because I would go in there some days sore after squatting the day before, and I would wake up the next morning and not be nearly as sore as I was on Tuesday morning."

 

Having Groome as a workout partner also pushed the competitor in Sale. While both are 6-foot-6 lefties, Groome has about 40 pounds on Sale.

 

"It's always nice for me to have someone to work out with pushing you and keeping you in check," Sale said. "He's a lot stronger than I am. You've got a guy 10 years younger than you, lifting twice as much, it'll stroke your ego and motivate you a little bit, too, so it was fun though. I think we both got something out of it."

 

The offseason workouts with Sale put Groome in a good position for a healthy 2018 season. Last year, his first full year in professional baseball, Groome missed a large chunk of time due to two separate injuries.

 

In his first start of the year for Single-A Greenville he suffered a mild lat strain and missed a month and a half. When he returned in June, he made three starts in Short-Season Lowell and 10 starts in Greenville before a forearm strain ended his season.

 

Groome had been receiving regular treatment on his arm and elbow from the training staff, but after a start in late August, he didn't feel right the following day. He told the training staff and with just a month left in the season, they opted to shut him down.

 

Despite the injuries and a 5.69 ERA over 14 starts, Groome, Boston's 2016 first-round pick, still ranked as a top 100 prospect in baseball and the top overall prospect in the Boston system in all the preseason projections.

 

Groome took three months off from throwing following the forearm strain and didn't pick up a ball again until December. But over the past three months, he's been on a regular schedule and hasn't felt any issues with his arm or lat muscle.

 

"Besides being hurt, I just look at that season as a big learning season for me," he said. "Just going into my full season and just finding my routine once I got back to being healthy but just learning was the biggest thing for me last year and especially with my body. Knowing when my body has had too much and when to take off. It wasn't an unsuccessful season last year, I can say that."

 

An offseason working out with Sale helped put the injury-riddled 2017 season behind him.

 

"I put in a lot of work this offseason so I feel like my body is right where it needs to be at," Groome said. "I'm just ready to get after it this year."

 

 

It's tough to think of someone better to take Groome under his wing.

[mvp 78]

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/juiced-baseballs/

 

Dingers for everyone!

[moonslav59]

It's tough to think of someone better to take Groome under his wing.

 

Maybe, finally, one of our prospect starting pitchers can actually develop into something special.

[moonslav59]

soxprospects.com...

 

On Swihart's defense.... https://www.overthemonster.com/2018/3/1/17065230/blake-swihart-spring-training-defense

 

On Chavis.... Michael Chavis has battled injuries throughout his professional career, including missing time the last two seasons with hand and arm injuries. On Sunday, Chad Jennings of the Boston Herald reporting that Chavis was shut down this spring with an oblique injury and there was no timetable for his return. One hopes the Red Sox are being overly cautious here, but with his history, it does raise some concern.

 

On the 5th starter... Red Sox manager Alex Cora has said that the team is approaching the year assuming neither Steven Wright nor Eduardo Rodriguez will be ready to start the season as they recover from knee injuries. That opens up opportunities for others, and the Boston Globe's Peter Abraham writes that Brian Johnson is making his case to be one of the benefactors.

 

On our catchers.... Cora has already stated definitively that Sandy Leon and Christian Vazquez are his catchers to begin the 2018 season, but that did not stop Matt Collins at Over the Monster from naming Swihart one of his five breakout candidates for this season....

 

Blake Swihart

The Red Sox haven’t even had a week’s worth of spring training games, but one player has already taken camp by storm. This is an enormous spring for Swihart as he is fighting for a role on the roster and to prove that he was still a player to be excited about a couple years removed from being a top prospect. He’s been on fire at the plate already, and while it is extemely early in spring training and the competition is not much to write home about, he is showing that there may be some of that old magic left from his prospect days. Swihart is starting from a relatively low position in terms of perceived value, but we could be back to looking at him as one of the best young catchers in the game if everything goes absolutely perfectly. I wouldn’t bet on him climbing quite this high, or even to take over as the top catcher on the roster as some are predicting, but it is admittedly getting hard to not let this hot start in spring influence me even if I know it’s not the logical thing to do.

 

On Marco's injury... infielder Marco Hernandez was sent back to Boston when he continued to experience discomfort in his surgically repaired left shoulder. He had a second procedure to "remove some hardware" Cora told reporters, and will miss all of spring training as a result.

[Kimmi]

Same thing happened last year with EE and others.

 

Two years now. Will he hold off next year?

 

Well, he did hold off on JD, and got him for cheaper than anyone projected.

 

I'm interested to see what happens with next year's free agents.

[Kimmi]

There's also Jake Peavy.

 

I would go with Buchholz and Peavy, for old times' sake.

 

I'm in.

[Spudboy]

I'm in.

 

I am against Buch JUST BECAUSE but brining him and or Peavey in on a minors contract would not seem to be a bad idea.

[moonslav59]

I am against Buch JUST BECAUSE but brining him and or Peavey in on a minors contract would not seem to be a bad idea.

 

Agreed.

 

Just say BUCH NO!

[Spudboy]

Agreed.

 

Just say BUCH NO!

 

lol

[SoxnCycles]

Well, he did hold off on JD, and got him for cheaper than anyone projected.

 

I'm interested to see what happens with next year's free agents.

 

If free agent contracts are down again next year, you can bet a strike is coming in 2020 or '21.

[jacksonianmarch]

Everyone will be in on next years FAs except for Boston. The market will explode again. The Dodgers and Yankees will drive the market

[Bellhorn04]

Everyone will be in on next years FAs except for Boston. The market will explode again. The Dodgers and Yankees will drive the market

 

Everyone will be in?

 

No doubt there are going to be some big deals signed by the elite players. But I think some of the trends we saw this year aren't going away, ever, like the extreme reluctance to give out big contracts to non-elite players.

[moonslav59]

If free agent contracts are down again next year, you can bet a strike is coming in 2020 or '21.

 

Depends if mid range contracts are up.

 

The players should stop bargaining for top pay for a couple dozen players and seek higher pay for the rest and a quicker path to free agency.