9/4 toronto in beantown

[Bellhorn04]

Another pile of LOBsters tonight.

[jacksonianmarch]

The book is out on Mookie and he has gone from MVP candidate to choke artisst. Wow, he has been getting dispatched easily for someone with his talent

[d-money]

This team's playing like they're 10 games ahead in the division. Where the f***'s the urgency? All these games count now.

[oldtimer]

Shame they couldn't get him in from second with one our and two of our leadoff men up. A run there would have made it tight. Their pitcher was throwing 97 MPH sinking fastballs so he wasn't easy to hit.

[illinoisredsox]

How many 4.6+ ERA pitchers have more Ws than Ls? And how many 4.6+ ERA pitchers have more Ls than Ws? ... in MLB history?

 

That's kind of the point.

 

 

You said good pitchers don't lose 20 games. I listed several good (and in a few cases great) pitchers who did.

 

Porcello has not been good this year, there is no disputing that point. His record is where it should be. He's lost a few where he pitched well but got no run support; he's also won a couple where he didn't pitch too well but got good run support that day.

[Maxbialystock]

How many 4.6+ ERA pitchers have more Ws than Ls? And how many 4.6+ ERA pitchers have more Ls than Ws? ... in MLB history?

 

That's kind of the point.

 

Frankly not impressed with the list of guys who lost lots of games. Porcello isn't lousy because he lost 16 games. He's just lousy this year. He has a hard time keeping the ball low and his command stinks. Going into this game his pitching WAR was .3, and it's sure to be lower now.

Edited September 5, 2017 by Maxbialystock

[Bellhorn04]

Yeah, I can't defend Porcello any more. He's hurting us this year, plain and simple.

[OH FOY]

That was Smoaked Edited September 5, 2017 by OH FOY!

[iortiz]

You said good pitchers don't lose 20 games. I listed several good (and in a few cases great) pitchers who did.

 

Porcello has not been good this year, there is no disputing that point. His record is where it should be. He's lost a few where he pitched well but got no run support; he's also won a couple where he didn't pitch too well but got good run support that day.

 

I meant in a large sample. Those and other examples are the exception of the rule. Not the rule.

[oldtimer]

That was Smaoked

 

Yes, Barnes left it up and down the middle. Smoak is too good to miss one of those.

[OH FOY]

Stanton with #53

[d-money]

The s*** show continues. It will be only two games in the loss column. That series really let the air out of the balloon. This team needs to find itself quickly.

[d-money]

Barnes just another POS on this team.

[OH FOY]

Can we Trade Barnes to the Yanks, what you say Jackson. haha

[S5Dewey]

Is it just my imagination, or does OB sound like he's sick of this game too?

[bowman]

Why bring that up, we don't need him. We can't give up any of our studs for him... Then again, f.... it, lets do it..........

[Maxbialystock]

Early day tomorrow, time to hit the sack, but not before saying this one is squarely on Farrell. His starter had already given up 4 runs and 2 dingers in 5 innings. In the 6th Porcello was throwing everything in the middle of the zone, and unsurprisingly the Jays were hitting him. During all that Farrell didn't even signal Vazquez to talk to this pitcher, nor did he send out the pitching coach. No doubt he wanted to save his bullpen, but ended up having to use them anyway only with the game now pretty much out of reach. Barnes giving up 2 in the 9th doesn't count because, had Farrell acted sooner, Kimbrel would be pitching in the 9th.

 

On top of everything else, leaving Porcello in like that signaled to the lineup that their manager was not taking this game seriously despite the oncoming Yankees and just 25 games to go. Indeed, Farrell gave every sign he thought we were back in April. I mean that's the April rule (also May, June, and even July): the starter stays until 7 runs or 100 pitches or whatever.

[iortiz]

Frankly not impressed with the list of guys who lost lots of games. Porcello isn't lousy because he lost 16 games. He's just lousy this year. He has a hard time keeping the ball low and his command stinks. Going into this game his pitching WAR was .3, and it's sure to be lower now.

 

As I said, you don't need stats to figure out that he sucks. His ERA, FIP, SiERA, HR/FB and even his W-R record, simply reflects what he is... a bum.

[oldtimer]

Can we Trade Barnes to the Yanks, what you say Jackson. haha

 

I wouldn't have him on my roster in the post season. Since we are going to lose this game anyway, at least we have learned that he shouldn't be on our PO roster.

[FredLynn]

Yeah, I can't defend Porcello any more. He's hurting us this year, plain and simple.

 

There is no more time. He needs to get a phantom injury and Johnson has to be given a chance to start. No more time....

[a700hitter]

Frankly not impressed with the list of guys who lost lots of games. Porcello isn't lousy because he lost 16 games. He's just lousy this year. He has a hard time keeping the ball low and his command stinks. Going into this game his pitching WAR was .3, and it's sure to be lower now.

I agree with you that Porcello isn't lousy because he has lost 16 games. He has lost 16 games, because he has been lousy.

[Maxbialystock]

One last tiny thought. If the Fenway fans haven't booed yet tonight, they are sheep. They pay a steep price for seats, parking, food, etc, and the players paid a ridiculous amount of money. And the ones over 30 with the long range contracts don't even have to play to get paid a ton. Look what the fans are paying Sandoval not to play for us. Price and Porcello between them are together getting paid $50M this year for basically hurting the team. How much is $50M? Billionaire Michael Dell just gave $36M for the victims of Harvey and is being lionized. Half of $50M is enough to live on comfortably for a lifetime and raise a family and send kids to college. And it's just one year and, this year, not even earned.

[Station 13]

Toronto hits a bunch of homers. We get base runners on EVERY inning and must SCRATCH and CLAWS for a run. That is the entire year.

[illinoisredsox]

As I said, you don't need stats to figure out that he sucks. His ERA, FIP, SiERA, HR/FB and even his W-R record, simply reflects what he is... a bum.

 

The thing is, this isn't that far below his career norms:

 

Starting from his rookie year in 2009 -

 

ERA 3.96, 4.92, 4.75, 4.59, 4.32, 3.43, 4.92, 3.15, 4.67

WHIP 1.336, 1.389, 1.407, 1.531, 1.282, 1.231, 1.360, 1.009, 1.401

HR/9 1.2, 1.0, 0.9, 0.8, 0.9, 0.8, 1.3, 0.9, 1.7

 

The W-L and HR/9 are way out of norm, but a lot of his stats are fairly average for him.

 

He's a low #3, #4 type pitcher. Last year was the outlier.

[a700hitter]

The thing is, this isn't that far below his career norms:

 

Starting from his rookie year in 2009 -

 

ERA 3.96, 4.92, 4.75, 4.59, 4.32, 3.43, 4.92, 3.15, 4.67

WHIP 1.336, 1.389, 1.407, 1.531, 1.282, 1.231, 1.360, 1.009, 1.401

HR/9 1.2, 1.0, 0.9, 0.8, 0.9, 0.8, 1.3, 0.9, 1.7

 

The W-L and HR/9 are way out of norm, but a lot of his stats are fairly average for him.

 

He's a low #3, #4 type pitcher. Last year was the outlier.

I agree with this. Last year was the outlier. He is a #4 innings eater with a 4.25 ERA. Coming off that outlier year, the FO was fooling itself thinking that they had 3 aces in the rotation and could get by with less runs. Porcello has always needed a lot of run support. Even in his Cy Young season, he got a ton of run support.

[moonslav59]

HR/9 1.2, 1.0, 0.9, 0.8, 0.9, 0.8, 1.3, 0.9, 1.7

 

I'm not disagreeing with the idea that 2016 was an outlier, but that 1.7 looks way out of wack as well.

[Maxbialystock]

HR/9 1.2, 1.0, 0.9, 0.8, 0.9, 0.8, 1.3, 0.9, 1.7

 

I'm not disagreeing with the idea that 2016 was an outlier, but that 1.7 looks way out of wack as well.

 

It's out of whack because of the way he is pitching. There is no great mystery, at least not to opposing lineups. In a normal start this year, Porcello keeps the ball up in the zone. Last night there were times when he could keep it low, but in the 6th everything was up--in the middle, actually. This is in an era when those shifts have optimized keeping the ball low.

[Spudboy]

Good pitchers don't lose 16 games. That's what this rudimentary stat says compadre. As you said, he sucks, you don't need to look at stats to figure out.

 

Then again a really god pitcher, Tommy Archer, lost about 20 games last season.

 

Now that was a head scratcher because almost everybody knows that kid has the stuff and is good.

 

I have liked Porcello since he plunked Youk and then threw him to the ground.

 

But he is sucking major donkey dick right now.

 

Just awful.

[Spudboy]

We didn't beat them last year without Carrasco and they have also added Encarnacion.

 

And Brantley ( sp ) is back as well.

 

The Guardians are the best team in the AL. They also have a good manager.

[Spudboy]

Need a Dinger, maybe this crowd will stop drinking their lattes.

 

Lulz.