On second thought...

[dustcover]

There's an old saying, "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again!"

 

Acknowledging that the Sox once before tried to make Bogaerts into a third-baseman while inserting Drew at SS, and it did not work out so well for Bogaerts.

 

If Sandoval flounders, what's the chance of Bogaerts willingly moving over to 3B opening up the SS position for Hernandez? This kid strikes me as being the real deal.

[notin]

There's an old saying, "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again!"

 

Acknowledging that the Sox once before tried to make Bogaerts into a third-baseman while inserting Drew at SS, and it did not work out so well for Bogaerts.

 

If Sandoval flounders, what's the chance of Bogaerts willingly moving over to 3B opening jjaair up the SS position for Hernandez? This kid strikes me as being the real deal.

 

Why not just insert Hernandez at third? Bogaerts has worked hard at his shortstop defense and made immense improvements and was flat out uncomfortable at third. Why penalize him (and the team) for his hard work?

[moonslav59]

I'd think about it, if Hernandez was a plus defender at SS.

 

I don't think he is.

[mvp 78]

There's an old saying, "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again!"

 

Acknowledging that the Sox once before tried to make Bogaerts into a third-baseman while inserting Drew at SS, and it did not work out so well for Bogaerts.

 

If Sandoval flounders, what's the chance of Bogaerts willingly moving over to 3B opening up the SS position for Hernandez? This kid strikes me as being the real deal.

 

Nope. Hernandez would just be the 3b.

[cp176]

There's an old saying, "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again!"

 

Acknowledging that the Sox once before tried to make Bogaerts into a third-baseman while inserting Drew at SS, and it did not work out so well for Bogaerts.

 

If Sandoval flounders, what's the chance of Bogaerts willingly moving over to 3B opening up the SS position for Hernandez? This kid strikes me as being the real deal.

 

He very likely might be be a better shortstop than XB. Hernandez is a 2b/ss first. It probably will not happen but would be a rational logical move.

[mvp 78]

He very likely might be be a better shortstop than XB. Hernandez is a 2b/ss first. It probably will not happen but would be a rational logical move.

 

Moving your AS SS for a AAAA guy isn't rational, imo. Unless he had an otherworldly glove, there is no reason to put Marco at SS.

[mvp 78]

Per Sox Prospects:

 

Arm: Solid-average arm strength plays at shortstop, but doesn’t stand out. Has had some issues with throwing accuracy at times.

 

Field: Good actions at shortstop, though long term value at position is still to be determined. Moves well and has solid range. Hands are a little rough and footwork can get sloppy. Should be able to play shortstop in a backup role, but is not everyday quality defender. Defensive tools will play at second base.

[cp176]

Per Sox Prospects:

 

Arm: Solid-average arm strength plays at shortstop, but doesn’t stand out. Has had some issues with throwing accuracy at times.

 

Field: Good actions at shortstop, though long term value at position is still to be determined. Moves well and has solid range. Hands are a little rough and footwork can get sloppy. Should be able to play shortstop in a backup role, but is not everyday quality defender. Defensive tools will play at second base.

 

It is what it is according to them. I have felt all along that he is a better fit at second than anywhere else. Is it possible that he exceeds the expectations of the scouting reports? Is it even possible that he already has. I'm not saying that this kid is the next gift but It would take a hell of a lot more than Josh Rutledge for me to keep him off our roster. It is a good situation for the Red Sox to be in I guess.

[moonslav59]

Here's my positional depth chart:

 

3B:

vs RHPs: 1) Pablo 2) Hernandez 3) Holt

vs LHPs: 1) Rutledge 2T) Hernandez & Holt

 

SS: 1) Bogey 2) Hernandez 3) Holt

 

2B: 1) Pedey 2T) Hernandez & Holt

 

1B: 1) Moreland/Ramirez 2) Travis 3) Holt (maybe Swihart after some practice)

 

LF: 1) Beni 2) Young 3T) Selsky & Holt (Moreland in a pinch)

 

CF/RF: Move Beni to position and Young to LF, 3T) Selsky/Holt in LF

 

Once again, as I've brought up several times over the last few months, why not trade the guy with some nice trade value- Brock Holt?

 

Rutledge and Hernandez start the season on the 25 man roster. Selsky and Marrero are extended depth with a positional move by Swihart to 3B or 1B remaining as an option or emergency plan C.

 

 

 

[moonslav59]

Per Sox Prospects:

 

Arm: Solid-average arm strength plays at shortstop, but doesn’t stand out. Has had some issues with throwing accuracy at times.

 

Field: Good actions at shortstop, though long term value at position is still to be determined. Moves well and has solid range. Hands are a little rough and footwork can get sloppy. Should be able to play shortstop in a backup role, but is not everyday quality defender. Defensive tools will play at second base.

 

This from SB Nation... 12/2016

 

6) Marco Hernandez, INF, Grade B-: Age 24, originally signed by Cubs out of Dominican Republic, traded to Red Sox in 2014; hit .309/.343/.444 in 223 at-bats in Triple-A then .294/.357.373 in 51 major league at-bats spread over five separate recalls in ’16; has hit very well for two years, with a .305/.330/.454 mark in Double-A/Triple-A in ’15; line drive hitter with doubles power can surprise with his pop; tools fit best at second base but workable at other positions; projects as super-utility type with better-than-normal bat in the role; doesn’t get as much attention as other Boston prospects but should not be under-estimated. ETA 2017.

[cp176]

This from SB Nation... 12/2016

 

6) Marco Hernandez, INF, Grade B-: Age 24, originally signed by Cubs out of Dominican Republic, traded to Red Sox in 2014; hit .309/.343/.444 in 223 at-bats in Triple-A then .294/.357.373 in 51 major league at-bats spread over five separate recalls in ’16; has hit very well for two years, with a .305/.330/.454 mark in Double-A/Triple-A in ’15; line drive hitter with doubles power can surprise with his pop; tools fit best at second base but workable at other positions; projects as super-utility type with better-than-normal bat in the role; doesn’t get as much attention as other Boston prospects but should not be under-estimated. ETA 2017.

 

When i first saw him play, he was playing ss for Portland. he was clearly their best player but yet physically he really didn't look to be anything special. He has worked hard on his overall fitness. He is clearly stronger and faster than he was back in the day. Many people have said since day 1 that he projects as a very good utility player on a team like Boston. I think he has a good chance of showing that the projectors are wrong.

[Fisk]

When i first saw him play, he was playing ss for Portland. he was clearly their best player but yet physically he really didn't look to be anything special. He has worked hard on his overall fitness. He is clearly stronger and faster than he was back in the day. Many people have said since day 1 that he projects as a very good utility player on a team like Boston. I think he has a good chance of showing that the projectors are wrong.

 

Bill James said I believe last October he wouldn't trade Marco for Josh Donaldson, Machado oo Arrenado straight up. That is crazy, and probably not true, but shows that he is viewed quite highly.

[Fisk]

By the way I got that on the Sons of Sam Horn forum under the Marco Hernandez thread.

[cp176]

By the way I got that on the Sons of Sam Horn forum under the Marco Hernandez thread.

 

thanks for that - checking it out.

[moonslav59]

It's nice to see all the love pouring out for Marco. I've always been very high on this kid. I had hoped his SS defense would improve more than it has, since 2B is locked up longer than SS and 3B.

[mvp 78]

Bill James: Josh Donaldson is 30, turns 31 in December. Not young. I know you will think this is crazy, but I am not sure I would trade the Red Sox' Marco Hernandez for any of those guys. I have been waiting since the opening day of spring training for Marco Hernandez to do something I wasn't impressed with, and I'm still waiting. He is way faster than any of those guys. May not have the arm to play third every day; I haven't seen enough of him at third to be sure. But everything else is good."

 

Someone must have slipped something into his coffee.

[mvp 78]

Bill James projections for 2017 Marco:

 

Marco Hernandez: 94 games, 245 at-bats, 73 hits, 12 doubles, 2 triples, 5 home runs, 27 RBI, 30 runs, .298 batting average, .331 OBP, .424 slugging, .755 OPS, 34 runs created, 5.08 runs created per 27 outs, 12 walks, 49 strikeouts, 4 stolen bases, 2 caught stealing, 67 stolen base percentage.

[Wade Boggs]

Bill James projections for 2017 Marco:

 

Marco Hernandez: 94 games, 245 at-bats, 73 hits, 12 doubles, 2 triples, 5 home runs, 27 RBI, 30 runs, .298 batting average, .331 OBP, .424 slugging, .755 OPS, 34 runs created, 5.08 runs created per 27 outs, 12 walks, 49 strikeouts, 4 stolen bases, 2 caught stealing, 67 stolen base percentage.

 

If that is what James projects , Hernandez should and will make it. The only problem is if Panda can't hit LHP, He may use Rutledge @ third. Of course they can carry both of them along with Holt, and break camp with the 4 starters Farrell is hinting about. That might open up a spot for him. I have a hunch about this kid. The board members on this board know more about him. IMO he might be a useful piece.

[mvp 78]

If that is what James projects , Hernandez should and will make it. The only problem is if Panda can't hit LHP, He may use Rutledge @ third. Of course they can carry both of them along with Holt, and break camp with the 4 starters Farrell is hinting about. That might open up a spot for him. I have a hunch about this kid. The board members on this board know more about him. IMO he might be a useful piece.

 

I like Marco. I think he can be a useful MLB guy. However, I don't think he's good enough to move Xander off position.

[Nick]

Here's my positional depth chart:

 

3B:

vs RHPs: 1) Pablo 2) Hernandez 3) Holt

vs LHPs: 1) Rutledge 2T) Hernandez & Holt

 

SS: 1) Bogey 2) Hernandez 3) Holt

 

2B: 1) Pedey 2T) Hernandez & Holt

 

1B: 1) Moreland/Ramirez 2) Travis 3) Holt (maybe Swihart after some practice)

 

LF: 1) Beni 2) Young 3T) Selsky & Holt (Moreland in a pinch)

 

CF/RF: Move Beni to position and Young to LF, 3T) Selsky/Holt in LF

 

Once again, as I've brought up several times over the last few months, why not trade the guy with some nice trade value- Brock Holt?

 

Rutledge and Hernandez start the season on the 25 man roster. Selsky and Marrero are extended depth with a positional move by Swihart to 3B or 1B remaining as an option or emergency plan C.

 

 

 

 

You've said all along Holt may NOT be our 2nd option at any position. I agree. I would also contend that I may want Selsky at 1B before Holt also. Hell maybe even at 3B. He started out as a 3B.

[mvp 78]

You've said all along Holt may NOT be our 2nd option at any position. I agree. I would also contend that I may want Selsky at 1B before Holt also. Hell maybe even at 3B. He started out as a 3B.

 

RotoWire News: Selsky, who has played outfield and first base during his career, will get some playing time at third base, Peter Abraham of The Boston Globe reports. (3/18/2017)

[mvp 78]

http://www.masslive.com/redsox/index.ssf/2017/03/steve_selsky_boston_red_sox_ro.html

 

Article that mentions Selsky potentially playing 3rd.

[mvp 78]

And another: http://boston.locals.baseballprospectus.com/2017/03/20/steve-selsky-man-of-mystery/

 

What’s the catch?

 

– He’s had 54 major league plate appearances since getting drafted six years ago. Fifty-four. If he was a sure bet to even reach his relatively low ceiling, you’d think he’d be closer to reaching it by now.

 

– Sure, he’s had some good years. But he also hit .181/.281/.205 over 32 games at Double-A in 2013 and .240/.259/.339 over 55 games in Triple-A in 2014. He’s had some clunkers.

 

– He strikes out a LOT. Like, a lotttttttttt. His career K% hovers around 20 percent, and over 54 games with the Reds, that number shot up to 40 percent. I don’t care about your small sample size caveats; that’s so many strikeouts. You might even say it’s a lot with extra Ts.

 

– For being someone who supposedly brings some power potential, he doesn’t have that much power. After hitting 15 homers in 2012 and 13 in 2013, Selsky hasn’t reached double-digit home run totals since. In fact, outside of 2016, when he had nine homers (which is actually good news for Red Sox fans but we’re already past the good news part of this article), he hasn’t had more than two in a season since 2013.

 

– Even his major league numbers are misleading. .314/.340/.471 over 24 games is just enough time to be optimistically intrigued, but those numbers were never going to last. Over that time period, besides striking out 40 percent of the time, he also has an absurd .519 BABIP. He also only posted a 3.7 percent BB%. To recap: he was striking out half the time, never walking, and was abnormally lucky.

[Thunder]

How well has Xander played at third in the WBC? I haven't seen too much of it, especially the Dutch team. It's worth having this conversation if he's been a standout, but I think moving him will mess a lot of this team's mojo and chemistry.

[dustcover]

Here's my positional depth chart:

 

3B:

vs RHPs: 1) Pablo 2) Hernandez 3) Holt

vs LHPs: 1) Rutledge 2T) Hernandez & Holt

 

Am I correct in assuming that you have no confidence in Sandoval, a switch-hitter, batting from the right side versus LHP's, giving precedence to Rutledge, and even Hernandez & Holt, both batting from the left side.

 

Care to elaborate?

[dustcover]

How well has Xander played at third in the WBC? I haven't seen too much of it, especially the Dutch team. It's worth having this conversation if he's been a standout, but I think moving him will mess a lot of this team's mojo and chemistry.

 

Do note however the intentional use of the word "willingly" in my original post. If Bogaerts supports the move wholeheartedly, the team might very well follow the lead of his 'team first' attitude and thus create a positive mojo and increase team chemistry, particularly if the move creates a dynamic winning environment. Just speculating!

[moonslav59]

Am I correct in assuming that you have no confidence in Sandoval, a switch-hitter, batting from the right side versus LHP's, giving precedence to Rutledge, and even Hernandez & Holt, both batting from the left side.

 

Care to elaborate?

 

Pablo sucks vs LHPs. I've showed the numbers over the last 3-4 years. He's the league's worst hitter vs LHPs in some sample scenarios and bottom 5 in about all of them.

 

Holt actually hasd a better OPS vs LHPs over his career.

 

Rutledge bats RH'd and I have him above Holt & Hernandez.

 

Hernandez has been over .700 vs LHPs in recent years in the minors.

 

Pablo should not start vs a LH'd starter.

 

Is that enough?

[FredLynn]

Do note however the intentional use of the word "willingly" in my original post. If Bogaerts supports the move wholeheartedly, the team might very well follow the lead of his 'team first' attitude and thus create a positive mojo and increase team chemistry, particularly if the move creates a dynamic winning environment. Just speculating!

 

There is no way Bogaerts should move to 3B. Last season he made huge strides defensively at SS. There is no need to mess with that.

[Nick]

Pablo sucks vs LHPs. I've showed the numbers over the last 3-4 years. He's the league's worst hitter vs LHPs in some sample scenarios and bottom 5 in about all of them.

 

Holt actually hasd a better OPS vs LHPs over his career.

 

Rutledge bats RH'd and I have him above Holt & Hernandez.

 

Hernandez has been over .700 vs LHPs in recent years in the minors.

 

Pablo should not start vs a LH'd starter.

 

Is that enough?

 

YEP.....We're stuck with his salary no matter what. Put your best team out there. If that means platooning Pablo, I have no problems with it. We owe him NOTHING. Well we owe him $19M and that's being paid.

[moonslav59]

YEP.....We're stuck with his salary no matter what. Put your best team out there. If that means platooning Pablo, I have no problems with it. We owe him NOTHING. Well we owe him $19M and that's being paid.

 

We benched him last spring, so I don't think a platoon would be a big slap in his face, besides, he knows he sucks vs lefties. Why else would he try to tinker with giving up switch-hitting?