Does this team have what it takes?

[Examiner]

I'll confess, I've never believed in this team, and God knows I've tried. In 2013, that team had greatness stamped on it from opening day. Right away you knew, there was something different. This team? I've never been able to figure out, and every time I've ever had that in my life with my teams in any sport I've followed, they have not won. Every time I start to believe they've settled in, they pull what they've pulled the last two days, every time this year without fail. I could see this team falling completely out of the playoffs, winning the whole thing or anything in between, you just can't tell. And usually when you can't tell, you lose. Anyone else feel this way, or am I just a gloom and doomer?

[Bellhorn04]

I just want to make the playoffs. Once you do that the AL is pretty much up for grabs, I think. There aren't any really scary teams in the AL. There are good ones, though.

[Examiner]

Yeah, I was thinking the other day that there was no one I was afraid of. I'd like home field though, at least in the divisional round. Don't like our chances of passing Texas, so someone would have to beat them if we can get past Cleveland (and hang on to the East?)

[Kimmi]

You're just a doom and gloomer.

[Examiner]

LOL...what bugs me about this team is not its potential or its talent, it's just the consistency. You just never know what you're going to get from night to night. And the other thing is the lack of late comeback wins (2013 was vintage as it should be) and the inability to win consistently in close games. Those are both huge red flags when it comes to the postseason. I don't have hard numbers, but I'd be willing to bet that in 3/4 of Red Sox games, whoever scores first wins--no matter which team it is. Too many of their wins are by blowout, and too many losses are close games.

[Kimmi]

LOL...what bugs me about this team is not its potential or its talent, it's just the consistency. You just never know what you're going to get from night to night. And the other thing is the lack of late comeback wins (2013 was vintage as it should be) and the inability to win consistently in close games. Those are both huge red flags when it comes to the postseason. I don't have hard numbers, but I'd be willing to bet that in 3/4 of Red Sox games, whoever scores first wins--no matter which team it is. Too many of their wins are by blowout, and too many losses are close games.

 

I have not looked at the numbers, but I tend to agree that it seems like this team rarely has a late comeback win. I can't remember too many walk off wins this season either.

 

However, the statement that I bolded, as frustrating as it is to watch, is actually a sign of a good team.

[Examiner]

As far as I can remember, there has only been one walk off win. It was on a Sunday in May I think. It was the game where Papi tied it with a double to center in the 9th, and then hit almost an exact duplicate double to win it in the tenth or eleventh. I can't think of any other. By this time in 2013, there were what, 11? Or was it 8? Either way it was a lot.

[harmony]

As far as I can remember, there has only been one walk off win. It was on a Sunday in May I think. It was the game where Papi tied it with a double to center in the 9th, and then hit almost an exact duplicate double to win it in the tenth or eleventh. I can't think of any other. By this time in 2013, there were what, 11? Or was it 8? Either way it was a lot.

The Red Sox had walk-off wins on May 15 and June 23 and walk-off losses on May 28, June 12, July 28, August 24 and September 4:

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/BOS/2016-schedule-scores.shtml

[moonslav59]

Does Toronto "have what it takes"?

 

Does any other AL team?

 

Stay tuned.

[Jasonbay44]

This has been one of the stranger seasons as a baseball fan, especially in the AL. I really have no idea who will make world series in AL, and wouldn't be on any team.

[a700hitter]

If Showalter or Girardi managed the Red Sox we would be leading the Division by 5 games.

[Examiner]

The Red Sox had walk-off wins on May 15 and June 23 and walk-off losses on May 28, June 12, July 28, August 24 and September 4:

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/BOS/2016-schedule-scores.shtml

 

Yeah, the May one I remember, don't the other one. But we are -3 in walk offs.

[Examiner]

Does Toronto "have what it takes"?

 

Does any other AL team?

 

Stay tuned.

 

As I said above, no one scares me except the Red Sox themselves. This team has the sense of an underachiever.

[moonslav59]

As I said above, no one scares me except the Red Sox themselves. This team has the sense of an underachiever.

 

Imagine being a Jays fan. Talk about looking rotten.

 

The Yanks and O's are the only two teams playing above their expectations.

 

They don't scare me much.

[Maxbialystock]

Sadly, moonslav's OP has a point. A week ago I was saying this team is in great position, but now they seem to be on the verge of collapse. Three starters have collapsed and a fourth pitched a great game only to lose 1-0. As moonslav pointed out on another thread, the Sox outscored the Orioles by 6 runs and lost the series 2-1.

 

Last night the Sox got 4 singles and 0 runs, tonight so far it's a double, 2 singles, and 1 run in 4 innings.

[Examiner]

Sadly, moonslav's OP has a point. A week ago I was saying this team is in great position, but now they seem to be on the verge of collapse. Three starters have collapsed and a fourth pitched a great game only to lose 1-0. As moonslav pointed out on another thread, the Sox outscored the Orioles by 6 runs and lost the series 2-1.

 

Last night the Sox got 4 singles and 0 runs, tonight so far it's a double, 2 singles, and 1 run in 4 innings.

 

And again, righ on cue it's the same tired story. They fall behind in the early to mid innings, and never come back. Whoever scores first in a Sox game wins, that's about it.

[moonslav59]

Sadly, moonslav's OP has a point. A week ago I was saying this team is in great position, but now they seem to be on the verge of collapse. Three starters have collapsed and a fourth pitched a great game only to lose 1-0. As moonslav pointed out on another thread, the Sox outscored the Orioles by 6 runs and lost the series 2-1.

 

Last night the Sox got 4 singles and 0 runs, tonight so far it's a double, 2 singles, and 1 run in 4 innings.

 

The whole AL is a crap shoot in more ways than one. I said it before the season started. Every AL team has serious weak links. Ours seemed to be less in numbers, aand we appeared to have more options off the bench to patch those weaknesses.

 

Wright patched one hole in the rotation (plus Porcello stepped up).

Leon solved the "blackhole" catcher offense issue.

Young has been great off the bench and Beni has looked promising in a limited time.

Shaw surprised many by winning Pablo's job and doing well for a few months.

 

We still have holes. The rotation was not going to continue their month long streak.

 

We are bound to slump, and we will get hot again.

 

I still think we have less holes than other AL teams. It's going to be about who is playing well when it counts. Right now, we look down. The hottest teams int he AL, Seatlle (9-1) and the Yanks (7-3) probably have the worst looking teams on paper out of all the AL serious contenders. The "best" AL teams area ll flat right now:

 

BAL 6-4

BOS 5-5

CLE 5-5

TEX 5-5

DET 4-6

TOR 3-7

 

Nobody is looking like a "winner", so why giveu p on our chances, is what I say!

 

[Examiner]

Hahaha....now THAT is the kind of thing I want to see. Now show me some consistency and I might beleive. That was a much needed win tonight.

[southpaw777]

Sadly, moonslav's OP has a point. A week ago I was saying this team is in great position, but now they seem to be on the verge of collapse. Three starters have collapsed and a fourth pitched a great game only to lose 1-0. As moonslav pointed out on another thread, the Sox outscored the Orioles by 6 runs and lost the series 2-1.

 

Last night the Sox got 4 singles and 0 runs, tonight so far it's a double, 2 singles, and 1 run in 4 innings.

 

collapse...lol, now THATS doom and gloom. they are in first place and had a couple rough starts...collapse?

walk of win by Hanley last night opening the divison lead... DESPITE Farrell once again thinking he HAS to hit a RH vs a LHP and vice versa.... Girardi schooled Farrell last night to get his matchup with Young. unfortunately for NY Young was HBP. Benni has good numbers vs LHP. there was no need to PH for him., Maybe Young for JBJ that way Girardi either has to switch to is RHP vs Young allowing Benni to hit vs RHP or let him pitch to Young and Benni... Hill strikes fear in no pitcher, LH or RH. Young does vs LHP. so OBVIOUSLY you PH young for JBJ first to make Girardi switch pitcher and giving benni a RHP or having Girardi make yet another move for a lesser LHP for Benni... Farrell hasnt a clue. he got lucky Betences was off his game.

believe me, Im ecstatic they won, but I still want Farrell GONE after the season...Overall, the guys a tool when it comes to managing a game....

Edited September 16, 2016 by southpaw777

[Slasher9]

If Showalter or Girardi managed the Red Sox we would be leading the Division by 5 games.

yeah...because girardi showed how great of an in game manager he was last night.

[southpaw777]

yeah...because girardi showed how great of an in game manager he was last night.

 

this isnt a comparison Slash...I dont like the way Farrell manages a game...although I do think Girardi is overall a better in game manager...every manager makes some bonehead moves, but Farrell takes it to a new level.Ive never complained this much about any manager

[Dojji]

Not really that concerned about the playoffs TBH. I'm already satisfied with the performance of this team in DD's first season. His job was to make the Red Sox relevant. Even if we're one-and-done in the playoffs, I still consider that mission accomplished -- FOR THIS SEASON. Next season the expectations will increase. And of course whenever we are eliminated, it's going to be disappointing, but I think it's vital not to lose perspective. For now, I'm just happy the team is in the hunt again. Edited September 16, 2016 by Dojji

[Slasher9]

this isnt a comparison Slash...I dont like the way Farrell manages a game...although I do think Girardi is overall a better in game manager...every manager makes some bonehead moves, but Farrell takes it to a new level.Ive never complained this much about any manager

 

i hear ya lefty. i was only relaying that to the poster that pins every loss on JF. i know you have been frustrated by him for awhile and i will def buy you a beer when the day comes that he gets the ax.

[moonslav59]

...Girardi schooled Farrell last night to get his matchup with Young. unfortunately for NY Young was HBP...

 

Farrell may have foreseen, if that's possible, the expected switch and match-up an still preferred that one to the previous one.

[sk7326]

If Showalter or Girardi managed the Red Sox we would be leading the Division by 5 games.

 

Like how Girardi put Betances out there for the third game in a row (coming off of a 36 pitch outing) to blow a 3 run lead?

 

Showalter is one of those managers who is good in a lot of ways, but somehow did not get credit for Baltimore being 17 games worse than 2014 despite similar personnel.

 

Farrell is not perfect, but it is hard to see where this team has actually underachieved. Indeed, you look at his bullpen choices in a lot of these games, and he has made the choices most sentient adults would have made.

[a700hitter]

Like how Girardi put Betances out there for the third game in a row (coming off of a 36 pitch outing) to blow a 3 run lead?

 

Showalter is one of those managers who is good in a lot of ways, but somehow did not get credit for Baltimore being 17 games worse than 2014 despite similar personnel.

 

Farrell is not perfect, but it is hard to see where this team has actually underachieved. Indeed, you look at his bullpen choices in a lot of these games, and he has made the choices most sentient adults would have made.

I am glad that you are happy with him as the manager. I think he is a below average game manager.

[sk7326]

I am glad that you are happy with him as the manager. I think he is a below average game manager.

 

I do not think he is an amazing game manager - although his tendency to undermanage is fine (if you are going to err, that's the right direction). I think the Red Sox have been about - or slightly better than - what I expected given the roster.

[a700hitter]

I do not think he is an amazing game manager - although his tendency to undermanage is fine (if you are going to err, that's the right direction). I think the Red Sox have been about - or slightly better than - what I expected given the roster.

I think we would have won more games with another manager.

[Youk Of The Nation]

If you think you are disappointed in Farrell, you should check out some NYY message boards, or even just talk to some Yankees fans around town. All of the ones I know personally are wondering why he hasn't been fired yet, and the ones online are basically calling for the guy to be drawn and quartered. I don't think anyone ever really likes the manager of their favorite team. Every loss hurts, even if you know intellectually that a team can't go 162-0, and there's always going to be the temptation to blame it on the boss.

[Bellhorn04]

If you think you are disappointed in Farrell, you should check out some NYY message boards, or even just talk to some Yankees fans around town. All of the ones I know personally are wondering why he hasn't been fired yet, and the ones online are basically calling for the guy to be drawn and quartered. I don't think anyone ever really likes the manager of their favorite team. Every loss hurts, even if you know intellectually that a team can't go 162-0, and there's always going to be the temptation to blame it on the boss.

 

I think you're right.

 

And as I always point out, Francona took an extraordinary amount of abuse even with his admirable record.