Sox Pitching Staff Discussion

[User Name]

Buchholz was so coveted, that the Sox tried hard to pawn him on the Mariners instead of Miley, and had to call back because the Mariners hung up the phone.

[Emp9]

If he hits his ceiling, his salary will be a huge bargain. No kidding... You could say that about almost anyone. That does not make him a rare commodity.

 

He has never pitched a full season at a high level. It has never happened. The past rumors that were speculated were just as much BS as my previous post. He was healthy in 2014 when Ben unloaded Lester and Lackey. You know why Buchholz wasn't traded then? Because he flat out sucked that year. If they received any real interest, he would have been out the door.

 

1) You're preaching to the choir about Buch's failures 2) It's been long established that Buchholz's seasons can go 50/50 either way or 50/50 Ace-like/Hurt. 3) If he turns his season around and puts up respectable #'s, even for half the season, I guarantee you his 2017 option of $13.5M will be pick-ed up again. Don't kid yourself. He would have to totally bomb for that not to happen. With his ceiling it'd still be questionable (at that price).

[Emp9]

Buchholz was so coveted, that the Sox tried hard to pawn him on the Mariners instead of Miley, and had to call back because the Mariners hung up the phone.

 

Never heard that rumor. But I already established that he was hurt. Was ithis before or after his negative MRI?

[Emp9]

Miley was a still a way cheaper get and fits well at Safeco field w/ his GB%. Eats more innings. This argument is little moot because I think the Sox are contendets now btw. If Buch was healthy last trade deadlne, he was a strong trade candidate coming from a last place team... to a playoff team of course.

[Spudboy]

Another situation where having Buchholz wasted an opportunity to upgrade the rotation for reals.

 

Bingo.

 

Now say that to Kimmi.

[Spudboy]

I just don't ever understand this reasoning. You either like having Buchholz as a part of the rotation and think he can succeed or you don't pick him up.

 

I agree.

 

Have his short spurts of dominance been so intoxicating that people look past his lousy overall record?

[Emp9]

I agree.

 

Have his short spurts of dominance been so intoxicating that people look past his lousy overall record?

 

You mean his 75-54 (W-L% .581) overall winning record?

[southpaw777]

I agree.

 

Have his short spurts of dominance been so intoxicating that people look past his lousy overall record?

 

Might wan to have a look...

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/buchhcl01.shtml

[mvp 78]

You mean his 75-54 (W-L% .581) overall winning record?

 

W/L%? Is this 1985?!?

[mvp 78]

Might wan to have a look...

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/buchhcl01.shtml

 

3 years above 120 innings. Pathetic.

[NativeBostonian]

I hardly think it's panic time yet.

 

Price is going to be fine.

Porcello just had his first really bad start since coming off the DL last August. He'll be fine.

Wright is at least a #4/5, possibly better.

Buchholz is admittedly not looking good, but we've seen this from him before and we've also seen him turn it around.

Kelly looks ready based on AAA results...let's see what he's got.

 

There is cause for concern, but not for desperation...not yet.

 

I think the Red Sox pitching problems is depth. Once they get past Price, Wright, and Porcello, they're screwed. They need one more quality pitcher and that is what E-Rod was going to bring. Now that he might be out for a while, they need to go grab another pitcher.

[Emp9]

W/L%? Is this 1985?!?

 

I'm not the one who brought his record up. Don't act like it's my main argument when it's a simple retort.

[Spudboy]

You mean his 75-54 (W-L% .581) overall winning record?

 

Troll someone else bud. I have no interest in reiterating the obvious.

[Spudboy]

I'm not the one who brought his record up. Don't act like it's my main argument when it's a simple retort.

 

Overall as in everything he has done. Including being a failure as a starting pitcher.

 

 

I bet that you delighted in watching Dice-K too.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Spudboy

[Slasher9]

Troll someone else bud. I have no interest in reiterating the obvious.

 

I'm pretty sure you "trolled" him first. Regardless he isn't trolling you. He is responding to your argument. You brought up clays record...he didn't. Let me guess. Clay sucks because he gave up 4 runs (3 earned) last night, right? If only he could give up 0 runs every start like every other pitcher on a 1 year /$13mm contract.....

Edited May 21, 2016 by Slasher9

[Slasher9]

Buchholz was so coveted, that the Sox tried hard to pawn him on the Mariners instead of Miley, and had to call back because the Mariners hung up the phone.

Link?

[Spudboy]

I'm pretty sure you "trolled" him first. Regardless he isn't trolling you. He is responding to your argument. You brought up clays record...he didn't. Let me guess. Clay sucks because he gave up 4 runs last night, right? If only he could give up 0 runs every start like every other pitcher on a 1 year /$13mm contract.....

 

I made a reactionary post. I did not single any one member out. I am frustrated by Buch's inability to make a clean start and am very tired of him coming up short for what, seven years. I think that overall he just sucks and that the Sox should have gone in another direction if possible.

 

The Sox rotation is the Achilles heel on this team. He is one of the weak components. I'm certainly not alone in my views, either.

[Bellhorn04]

Link?

 

I have read this as well. I would add that User Name does not make statements like that unless he has good support for them.

[Slasher9]

I made a reactionary post. I did not single any one member out. I am frustrated by Buch's inability to make a clean start and am very tired of him coming up short for what, seven years. I think that overall he just sucks and that the Sox should have gone in another direction if possible.

 

The Sox rotation is the Achilles heel on this team. He is one of the weak components. I'm certainly not alone in my views, either.

 

3 earned in 6 ip = weak? You admitted on the game thread that you only watched the last 2 innings of the game. So how can you comment on clays performance when you didn't see even 1 pitch he threw?

So did emp make a "reactionary post" or was he "trolling" you??

[mvp 78]

I guess I can't comment on Matt Harvey having a s***** year since I don't watch the Mets.

 

Makes no sense...

[mvp 78]

Overall as in everything he has done. Including being a failure as a starting pitcher.

 

 

I bet that you delighted in watching Dice-K too.

 

I call BS. You clearly didn't know what you meant when you posted originally...

[User Name]

http://www.overthemonster.com/2015/12/7/9865028/red-sox-trade-rumors-wade-miley-clay-buchholz-mariners

 

Links-a-plentiful. Rosenthal was first to report that the negotiations were centered around either Miley or Buch, and the M's chose Miley even though the Sox pushed for Buchholz.

 

I don't understand the insistence on making excuses for the guy. He is what he is.

[harmony]

http://www.overthemonster.com/2015/12/7/9865028/red-sox-trade-rumors-wade-miley-clay-buchholz-mariners

 

Links-a-plentiful. Rosenthal was first to report that the negotiations were centered around either Miley or Buch, and the M's chose Miley even though the Sox pushed for Buchholz.

 

I don't understand the insistence on making excuses for the guy. He is what he is.

 

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/12/mariners-buchholz-miley-trade-redsox.html

[mvp 78]

I don't understand the insistence on making excuses for the guy. He is what he is.

 

A waste of a rotation spot.

[Spudboy]

I call BS. You clearly didn't know what you meant when you posted originally...

 

Yeah I'm pretty stupid.

[Spudboy]

http://www.overthemonster.com/2015/12/7/9865028/red-sox-trade-rumors-wade-miley-clay-buchholz-mariners

 

Links-a-plentiful. Rosenthal was first to report that the negotiations were centered around either Miley or Buch, and the M's chose Miley even though the Sox pushed for Buchholz.

 

I don't understand the insistence on making excuses for the guy. He is what he is.

 

Preach!

[Spudboy]

A waste of a rotation spot.

 

What do you mean? He had a quality start!!!!!!

[Emp9]

You fellas can trash Buch all you want. Why not? I have too. I'm sure we'll have all of this season and the 2017 season to hate on him.

[Emp9]

Buchholz was so coveted, that the Sox tried hard to pawn him on the Mariners instead of Miley, and had to call back because the Mariners hung up the phone.

 

I'm still failing to see how this proves some major point? The 2015 Last place Red Sox had a better record than the Mariners. I was talking about the Sox trading Buch to a Playoff contender for the '15 trade deadline (if healthy, I'm sure it would have happened). As reasonable as Buch's contract is, Miley's contract was not only reasonable, it's a downright bargain in comparison to most. Taking Miley was clearly the better deal for a losing team. This hardly proves anything.

[Kimmi]

Another situation where having Buchholz wasted an opportunity to upgrade the rotation for reals.

 

I don't get this at all. How did Buchholz, and his $13 mil contract for one year, keep the Sox from upgrading the rotation with another pitcher? If the right deal had come along during the offseason, be it FA or trade, the Sox would have made the deal. Picking up Buchholz' option did not preclude obtaining another top starting pitcher. The fact that the Sox didn't acquire another top pitcher tells me that the cost was too high.

 

This is a situation where having Buchholz allowed the team not to have to grossly overpay for another starter.

 

Obviously, it's not working out right now. But don't blame Buchholz for the team not having a "real" #2 or #3.