Referendum on John Farrell

[Bellhorn04]

IMO, the ability to manage the players is more important than in game managing. For the most part, the in game decisions are really not that difficult.

 

Personally I think it's a pretty demanding job, and that in game managing can be a very significant part of it. Certainly there are many games when the in game decisions are straightforward, but if the game is close in the late innings the manager really has to be on top of the situation and making the correct moves.

[FredLynn]

IMO, the ability to manage the players is more important than in game managing. For the most part, the in game decisions are really not that difficult. At this point, Farrell seems to be doing a good job with the off field managing, regardless of his head scratching in game decisions. At any rate, 3 weeks into the season is too soon to make any kind of full assessment on Farrell or any of the players.

 

They are both important in my opinion. While its certainly important to treat players with respect (eg: Valentine ) and protect them from undue criticism, in game decision that do not put the players in the best position to win, thats also important. When, for example, Farrell kept ph'ing a slumping Chris Young for Travis Shaw, who is on a tear and in fact hits LHP better than RHP, I think thats not smart. There are many other examples. Furthermore, Farrell's head scratchers are not limited to three weeks this year. He has been team manager for many years, and his style has not improved.

[Maxbialystock]

They are both important in my opinion. While its certainly important to treat players with respect (eg: Valentine ) and protect them from undue criticism, in game decision that do not put the players in the best position to win, thats also important. When, for example, Farrell kept ph'ing a slumping Chris Young for Travis Shaw, who is on a tear and in fact hits LHP better than RHP, I think thats not smart. There are many other examples. Furthermore, Farrell's head scratchers are not limited to three weeks this year. He has been team manager for many years, and his style has not improved.

 

A couple of minor points--

 

First and foremost, Chris Young is far away from being a problem. Why? Because the team is hitting and scoring up a storm even when he plays. They lead the AL in runs scored. He's a righty bat and good outfielder (probably better than Holt) who last year played 140 games for the Yankees with a .773 OPS.

 

Second, Farrell made the decision to start Shaw over Sandoval, a much, much, much more important decision--and the right one--than inserting Young into the lineup now and then.

[a700hitter]

A couple of minor points--

 

First and foremost, Chris Young is far away from being a problem. Why? Because the team is hitting and scoring up a storm even when he plays. They lead the AL in runs scored. He's a righty bat and good outfielder (probably better than Holt) who last year played 140 games for the Yankees with a .773 OPS.

 

Second, Farrell made the decision to start Shaw over Sandoval, a much, much, much more important decision--and the right one--than inserting Young into the lineup now and then.

And what is the team record and run production in games that he plays vs games that he doesn't play?

[User Name]

Young is an auto-out against righties. You can't justify an incorrect decision based on the production from the rest of the team. We get it, you like Farrell, but be objective.

[devildavid]

A couple of minor points--

 

First and foremost, Chris Young is far away from being a problem. Why? Because the team is hitting and scoring up a storm even when he plays. They lead the AL in runs scored. He's a righty bat and good outfielder (probably better than Holt) who last year played 140 games for the Yankees with a .773 OPS.

 

Second, Farrell made the decision to start Shaw over Sandoval, a much, much, much more important decision--and the right one--than inserting Young into the lineup now and then.

 

And what is the team record and run production in games that he plays vs games that he doesn't play?

 

If you are talking about Young, he has only been utilized as a part time player so far, only playing two complete games. Do you think his impact is really that significant on run production and wins/losses?

[Maxbialystock]

Young is an auto-out against righties. You can't justify an incorrect decision based on the production from the rest of the team. We get it, you like Farrell, but be objective.

 

Actually, I think you are not being objective when you gloss over a very good and important decision Farrell made--to bench Sandoval even though he is paid a lot of money to ride the pine. You are also painting Young as a loser when in fact he played in 140 games last year with an OPS of .773 and this year has had all of 26 at bats. FWIW, I would have been fine with a decision to fire Farrell last year, but some hard-headed baseball executives, the same ones who had no problem firing Francona and Valentine, decided to bring him back. I respect their judgment. You apparently don't.

Edited April 29, 2016 by Maxbialystock

[User Name]

Actually, I think you are not being objective when you gloss over a very good and important decision Farrell made--to bench Sandoval even though he is paid a lot of money to ride the pine. You are also painting Young as a loser when in fact he played in 140 games last year with an OPS of .773 and this year has had all of 26 at bats. FWIW, I would have been fine with a decision to fire Farrell last year, but some hard-headed baseball executives, the same ones who had no problem firing Francona and Valentine, decided to bring him back. I respect their judgment. You apparently don't.

 

What are you even talking about? I have not glossed over anything. First off, you have not been on this board long enough to know my opinion on any of these issues. I have been a defender of Farrell on this board ever since he got on board. The fact that I defend him doesn't make me look over when he makes stupid decisions. Starting Young against RHP is a stupid decision, full stop.

 

I've wondered out loud if Lovullo isn't a better option given the team's overpay to keep him around, but I haven't asked for Farrell's head (I say a lot of stupid s*** in GT's, but we all do) with a clear head. Stop trying to tell me what I think.

[Dojji]

Young's career line against RHH .224/.292/.410/.702.

 

that's not terrible for a backup outfielder. It's not as good as his numbers against LHP by any means but it's not so very, very, very bad that he should absolutely never under any circumstances ever show up against a pitcher with a glove on his left hand.

 

Yes he had a particularly bad year against RHP last year. That's not as important as people are making it out to be. For his career, he is highly mediocre against RHP but not bad enough to be worth getting the torches and pitchforks out when he plays against them occasionally during a stretch where the team encounters exactly 2 LH starters.

[Slasher9]

idk....he's got kind of a big contract. seems like a bad signing by DD to me. who were we bidding against??

2016 Boston Red Sox $6,500,000

2017 Boston Red Sox $6,500,000

 

(he made 2.5MM with the MFY last year)....

[User Name]

Young's career line against RHH .224/.292/.410/.702.

 

that's not terrible for a backup outfielder. It's not as good as his numbers against LHP by any means but it's not so very, very, very bad that he should absolutely never under any circumstances ever show up against a pitcher with a glove on his left hand.

 

Yes he had a particularly bad year against RHP last year. That's not as important as people are making it out to be. For his career, he is highly mediocre against RHP but not bad enough to be worth getting the torches and pitchforks out when he plays against them occasionally during a stretch where the team encounters exactly 2 LH starters.

 

It's skill erosion, not a "particularly bad year". And he has been allowed to take several important at bats in game defining moments against tough right-handers, including relievers. Stop making excuses for bad managing. It is what it is.

[Kingface]

If Farrell wasn't the Manager, Young would be a better hitter than Cabrera.........

[User Name]

Sarcasm isn't your strong suit. The point is that he can't hit righties, so he should see as little AB's against them as possible. Is that incorrect?

[Dojji]

The point is that "he can't hit righties" is only based on last year which may be an outlier. Not saying it definitely is an outlier, but we sure as hell don't know it isn't based on 20-something plate appearances.

[User Name]

The point is that "he can't hit righties" is only based on last year which may be an outlier.

 

Chris Young OPS vs righthanders:

2011: .694

2012: .707

2013: .614

2014: .720

2015: .585

 

He has sucked against righties since 2011, with his big "year" in 2014 resulting in a .720 OPS, (and looking like the actual outlier). There is a clear regression trend there. Check the numbers before you make the statements.

[Dojji]

If you don't see the outlier in those numbers, I don't know what to tell you.

[User Name]

Dojji, you are employing a level of logical fallacy that makes me seriously doubt your cognitive abilities.

 

Let me put it this way: He has had an OPS+ below league average, and has had OBP's below .300 against righties every year since 2011. He cannot hit righties. It is a fact. Deal with it.

[Dojji]

No one's saying he's the next Rogers Hornsby, but there's a difference in degrees. Before 2015, he was at "doesn't do any good" levels of offense against righties, bad enough, but probably at or around replacement level, where in 2015 he was in 'actively causes harm" levels. That was the first and so far only year he was solidly below replacement level against RHP.

[User Name]

He's been below replacement level offensively every single year since 2011 against righties. If your OPS and wRC+ are below replacement level while you are playing a corner position, that is the definition of "actively doing harm". It was passable while he played CF, but it isn't while he's playing LF, and even less if he's being allowed to hit in game-defining situations. There are like seven layers of wrong there.

[Spudboy]

Lol.

[SinceYaz]

idk....he's got kind of a big contract. seems like a bad signing by DD to me. who were we bidding against??

2016 Boston Red Sox $6,500,000

2017 Boston Red Sox $6,500,000

 

(he made 2.5MM with the MFY last year)....

 

 

Which leads me to state clearly what we already knew ... It is way better being a Red Sox than a Yanqui!!!

[Hugh2]

Chris Young OPS vs righthanders:

2011: .694

2012: .707

2013: .614

2014: .720

2015: .585

 

He has sucked against righties since 2011, with his big "year" in 2014 resulting in a .720 OPS, (and looking like the actual outlier). There is a clear regression trend there. Check the numbers before you make the statements.

 

Well conversely you could look at those numbers and say he's only really had 2 bad years over the last 5 vs RHP, and consider he's a platoon/utility type now. I'd still entertain the thought he's in decline however.

 

To me the real issue is the fact that his bad numbers vs. RHP has coincided with diminishing skills in other such as base running, speed and his ability to play defense. If he could play good D in all 3 outfield positions and swipe a few bags he'd be a good utility player and a great 4th outfield option who can hit lefties and has a little pop. But the whole package right now seems pretty bad but we've also only seen him in a very small sample size too.

[Kimmi]

Personally I think it's a pretty demanding job, and that in game managing can be a very significant part of it. Certainly there are many games when the in game decisions are straightforward, but if the game is close in the late innings the manager really has to be on top of the situation and making the correct moves.

 

Managing is most definitely a demanding job. Fair point, there are some situations where a manager's in game decision can be crucial. Knowing the players well is a big key to making the correct in game decisions.

[User Name]

Well conversely you could look at those numbers and say he's only really had 2 bad years over the last 5 vs RHP, and consider he's a platoon/utility type now. I'd still entertain the thought he's in decline however.

 

To me the real issue is the fact that his bad numbers vs. RHP has coincided with diminishing skills in other such as base running, speed and his ability to play defense. If he could play good D in all 3 outfield positions and swipe a few bags he'd be a good utility player and a great 4th outfield option who can hit lefties and has a little pop. But the whole package right now seems pretty bad but we've also only seen him in a very small sample size too.

 

He's fine as a lefty masher and defensive replacement. I am no way, shape or form saying he was a bad signing, I am saying he has not been deployed correctly.

[Kimmi]

They are both important in my opinion. While its certainly important to treat players with respect (eg: Valentine ) and protect them from undue criticism, in game decision that do not put the players in the best position to win, thats also important. When, for example, Farrell kept ph'ing a slumping Chris Young for Travis Shaw, who is on a tear and in fact hits LHP better than RHP, I think thats not smart. There are many other examples. Furthermore, Farrell's head scratchers are not limited to three weeks this year. He has been team manager for many years, and his style has not improved.

 

I'm not saying that in game managing is not important. I just feel that the managing that takes place off the field is more important. Valentine is a great example of how badly things can go if a manager does not know how to manage his players and the media.

 

My biggest gripe with Farrell in the past has been his use, or rather his misuse, of the sac bunt. I've been tracking that this year and am happy to say that he has only called for one sac bunt so far this season. It was the correct call and the outcome was successful.

[Kimmi]

A couple of minor points--

 

First and foremost, Chris Young is far away from being a problem. Why? Because the team is hitting and scoring up a storm even when he plays. They lead the AL in runs scored. He's a righty bat and good outfielder (probably better than Holt) who last year played 140 games for the Yankees with a .773 OPS.

 

Second, Farrell made the decision to start Shaw over Sandoval, a much, much, much more important decision--and the right one--than inserting Young into the lineup now and then.

 

Young in and of himself is not a problem. Our bench, on the whole, may be.

[Hugh2]

He's fine as a lefty masher and defensive replacement. I am no way, shape or form saying he was a bad signing, I am saying he has not been deployed correctly.

 

Well I don't exactly disagree but allow me to play devils advocate. How many platoon players ever get all their at bats vs. LHP or RHP??? almost every guy I've seen gets his fair share of starts and at bats against pitchers that you think they have no business being in the lineup against. Doing that with a player is a bit unrealistic despite the fact that us fans talk about doing it all the time.

 

Still, it seems a bit weird to me that he has more at bats VS RHP than he does against LHP. I would expect a bit more out of him though for what they are paying him. A .600 OPS and fringe defense in LF is worth the league minimum.

 

Perhaps if they deploy him a bit more strategically as you said they will get a bit more out of him this season, and after all we've only seen a very small sample size out of him.

Edited April 30, 2016 by A Red Sox fan named Hugh

[Palodios]

He's fine as a lefty masher and defensive replacement. I am no way, shape or form saying he was a bad signing, I am saying he has not been deployed correctly.

 

Young has 28 PA to Holt's 72.

 

The Red Sox just happened to face a lot of RHP in the first few weeks of the season. I would have to spotcheck the numbers to confirm, but the Toronto announcers that the Red Sox didn't face any lefties for the first two weeks of season.

 

Farrell is trying to keep Young engaged despite the matchups. I'm looking at these trends, and it appears that Young has been starting against lefties, and for some Buchholz and Wright starts. Maybe Farrell prefer's Young's defense and is expecting more flyballs against those two?

[a700hitter]

I didn't understand the Young signing. I would still like to know our record when he plays vs when he doesn't and our run production when he plays vs when he doesn't play.

[Bellhorn04]

I didn't understand the Young signing. I would still like to know our record when he plays vs when he doesn't and our run production when he plays vs when he doesn't play.

 

We are 0-6 in his starts, 5-10 in his appearances. So not too good so far.