Wade Miley: Not bad actually

[a700hitter]

His philosophy of building a team with a strong offense and a mediocre pitching staff should have worked. When all areas of the team underperform significantly for the first half of the season, it's hard to blame the GM.

We disagree. Good pitching is the way to produce consistent success, imo, especially since offense does slump.

[Bellhorn04]

His philosophy of building a team with a strong offense and a mediocre pitching staff should have worked. When all areas of the team underperform significantly for the first half of the season, it's hard to blame the GM.

 

Unfortunately for Ben, his biggest, most expensive acquisitions, Porcello, Hanley, Panda and Castillo, basically underperformed throughout the whole season except for a few good stretches.

 

The team has invested about 350 million in those 4 players.

[Kimmi]

We disagree. Good pitching is the way to produce consistent success, imo, especially since offense does slump.

 

I have said many times that my preference in building a team would be to have strong pitching and a mediocre offense versus a strong offense and mediocre pitching. I am a strong proponent of the 'pitching and defense' mantra.

 

Regardless of what my preference is, the philosophy of having a strong offense and pitching that should have been good enough to keep the team in most games should have worked. It may not be the choice or preference of most, but it should have worked.

 

The Jays are living proof of this. Their pitching was mediocre until they brought in reinforcements at the deadline.

[Kimmi]

Unfortunately for Ben, his biggest, most expensive acquisitions, Porcello, Hanley, Panda and Castillo, basically underperformed throughout the whole season except for a few good stretches.

 

The team has invested about 350 million in those 4 players.

 

Yes, I understand that. That's my point. They all underperformed. The offense, Hanley and Panda aside, did perform up to expectations the last couple of months, but as a whole, they underperformed by a good bit the first half.

 

No one could have predicted Porcello, Hanley, and Panda all performing as badly as they did.

 

It really is an enigma. One that makes me shudder when I think about it.

[User Name]

I like Miley. Always have.

[Bellhorn04]

I like Miley. Always have.

 

He is a maestro of mediocrity.

 

Welcome back.

[GomesBeard]

Miley can certainly be the #4 or #5 guy, behind , E-Rod, Porcello, Buchholz/Kelly/Owens...

[cp176]

Miley can certainly be the #4 or #5 guy, behind , E-Rod, Porcello, Buchholz/Kelly/Owens...

 

I'm really hoping that they go for two real pitchers. Not the kind that have potential. The real deals this time. One through free agency and one through a trade.

[Spudboy]

I'm with you cp176.

 

But how will we all react if DD comes up short and or fails to build a good BP?

[cp176]

I'm with you cp176.

 

But how will we all react if DD comes up short and or fails to build a good BP?

 

He's got his hands full. If he doesn't trade some of our wanna be starters, I guess I would like to see some of them recycled to the bullpen. Kelly would go to the pen first for me. I don't hate Buchholz, but I am sick of hearing how good he could be. I want gritty and tough from at least most of our starters.

[Dojji]

Buchholz to the pen is an option that intrigues me in that it might be one way to manage him so he stays healthy all year.

[SoxnCycles]

Buchholz to the pen is an option that intrigues me in that it might be one way to manage him so he stays healthy all year.

 

The problem is, if he's healthy, Buchholz is a waste of talent in the pen.

Run him out there every 5th day and if he can't finish the majority of the season without an injury, cut him loose at the end of the year.

[jacksonianmarch]

Buchholz will not be in anybody's pen. Buchholz is an intriguing option for teams looking to deal for him. When he is healthy, which is rare, he can be a top level starter. The problem is, he isn't healthy often. If he tries to pitch through an itty bitty injury, he sucks, so it isn't like he can just grind through until he feels better.

[mvp 78]

The problem is, if he's healthy, Buchholz is a waste of talent in the pen.

Run him out there every 5th day and if he can't finish the majority of the season without an injury, cut him loose at the end of the year.

 

Isn't it a foregone conclusion that he will not finish the season? His track record of durability and performance leaves him as a mediocre option at best.

[Kimmi]

Isn't it a foregone conclusion that he will not finish the season? His track record of durability and performance leaves him as a mediocre option at best.

 

While it's very likely that Clay will not finish the season, it's not a foregone conclusion. Having him on the team offers the team some depth and flexibility. IMO, he's a mediocre option at worst. At best, he's an ace caliber pitcher.

[mvp 78]

2014 for Clay was worse than mediocre.

[SoxnCycles]

2014 for Clay was worse than mediocre.

 

In 2013 he pitched like an ace for half the season.

So what, for either season.

It's not 2013 or 2014 any longer.

[sk7326]

$13M is a solid price for mediocre - and a pretty good value for better than that. It does not exempt looking for better pitching - but it helps.

[mvp 78]

In 2013 he pitched like an ace for half the season.

So what, for either season.

It's not 2013 or 2014 any longer.

 

The quote was "mediocre at worst." Recent history shows us that he can be worse than mediocre.

 

Honestly, he's a wild card. You just don't know what he'll give you. He's an injury risk each year who could put up CY numbers or be absolute garbage.

[SoxnCycles]

The quote was "mediocre at worst." Recent history shows us that he can be worse than mediocre.

 

Honestly, he's a wild card. You just don't know what he'll give you. He's an injury risk each year who could put up CY numbers or be absolute garbage.

 

Which makes the 13 mil a reasonable risk and makes him a tradeable commodity.

[mvp 78]

I can see that POV. I'd rather trade and move on. To me, moving on from Buchholz could provide more stability to this rotation. Buchholz has all the talent in the world, but his health is too much of a question mark for me.

[Bellhorn04]

All I can say is I hope they gave him a really good physical.

[Palodios]

Half the time Buchholz is hurt.

Half the time healthy Buchholz is ineffective.

 

If you look at his streaks, he's an ace roughly 25% of the time. This would be fine if they could get him ready for the playoffs, but he's usually banged up by then -- We've never seen "Ace Buchholz" in the playoffs.

 

Maybe they should give him the month of July off every year BEFORE he gets the annual injury.

[mvp 78]

Except that his 2013 injury occurred while napping at home.

[Kimmi]

The quote was "mediocre at worst." Recent history shows us that he can be worse than mediocre.

 

Honestly, he's a wild card. You just don't know what he'll give you. He's an injury risk each year who could put up CY numbers or be absolute garbage.

 

Fair enough. My "mediocre at worst" was in reaction to your "mediocre at best" statement. Recent history also shows that he can be much better than mediocre. He is a wild card, but IMO, he is very much worth the risk of $13 mil.

[Kimmi]

$13M is a solid price for mediocre - and a pretty good value for better than that. It does not exempt looking for better pitching - but it helps.

 

Exactly Thank you for making the point that I was trying to make, and being able to do it so succinctly.

[a700hitter]

I can see that POV. I'd rather trade and move on. To me, moving on from Buchholz could provide more stability to this rotation. Buchholz has all the talent in the world, but his health is too much of a question mark for me.

He's a box of chocolates that is finished by the end of June every year.

[jacksonianmarch]

And the only years he makes it past June, he sucks ass.

[a700hitter]

And the only years he makes it past June, he sucks ass.

$13 million for a half season of excellent to mediocre or a full season of sucks ass -- either way he's a bargain.

[mvp 78]

Fair enough. My "mediocre at worst" was in reaction to your "mediocre at best" statement. Recent history also shows that he can be much better than mediocre. He is a wild card, but IMO, he is very much worth the risk of $13 mil.

 

2013 and 2015 were both cut in half by injuries. That's a mediocre year to me.