2016 Red Sox Hot Stove Discussion Thread

[jacksonianmarch]

Your hot stove has to start with the cleaning house of your FO and coaching staff. Ben, Farrell, Lovullo, et al all need to go. The culture needs to change again.

[iortiz]

Your hot stove has to start with the cleaning house of your FO and coaching staff. Ben, Farrell, Lovullo, et al all need to go. The culture needs to change again.

 

Well, it is what I said few weeks ago. Yes, they have to go.

[mvp 78]

f*** Dipoto.

[a700hitter]

Red Sox Hire Jerry Dipoto For Interim Front Office Position

By Mark Polishuk [August 12, 2015 at 1:20pm CDT]

The Red Sox have hired former Angels GM Jerry Dipoto on a interim basis to assist in the team’s offseason moves, Peter Gammons of GammonsDaily.com reports (hat tip to Nick Cafardo of the Boston Globe).

 

Dipoto has longstanding ties to the Red Sox organization, as he worked as a scout for the club in 2003-2004. It’s yet unknown as to what Dipoto’s specific role or title (if any) will be within the front office, or if this job could be a precursor to Dipoto being hired on a full-time basis by the Sox if things go well this winter.

it looks like Ben will not get to clean up his own mess.

[Kimmi]

it looks like Ben will not get to clean up his own mess.

 

I read that Cherington is the one that hired him, so it looks like he will be given the chance to clean up his mess.

 

It will thrill some to know that Dipoto is a numbers guy, not an old school guy. That said, it sounds like maybe the Sox want him for his scouting ability since they seem to think that's where their weakness lies.

[sk7326]

I read that Cherington is the one that hired him, so it looks like he will be given the chance to clean up his mess.

 

It will thrill some to know that Dipoto is a numbers guy, not an old school guy. That said, it sounds like maybe the Sox want him for his scouting ability since they seem to think that's where their weakness lies.

 

The front office has lost a ton of muscle - so getting some help makes sense. DiPoto lost a power struggle to Scioscia - there is some dysfunction in Anaheim on that front. The team has had a lot of former GMs around helping (Baird, LaJoie) at various times, so more of that doesn't hurt. That they would hire a guy with some understanding of analytics makes sense. Sox clearly are big on that stuff (and given some of the in-house defensive stuff, based on actual decisions, it might not hurt to have a different set of eyes) and obviously not having that puts you way behind the industry.

[waltr]

The FO has to take a lot of heat for the boondoggle the last years. They need to throw out that computer, and get some scouts who know talent when they see it.

[waltr]

Stupid statistics: WHIP, WAR, BOPS. Who caame up with this nonsense? Agents looking to make their client seem better than he is. The most ridiculous is a "SAVE". I'm 71 yo and have been to and seen beaucoup games in my lifetime. I've never NEVER never seen a guy get a game-tying or winning hit from the on deck circle

[cp176]

I read that Cherington is the one that hired him, so it looks like he will be given the chance to clean up his mess.

 

It will thrill some to know that Dipoto is a numbers guy, not an old school guy. That said, it sounds like maybe the Sox want him for his scouting ability since they seem to think that's where their weakness lies.

 

If you are simply one or the other, you are a fool. There is no place for someone who knows virtually nothing about the game other than what the stats tell them. There is no place in the game for someone who refuses to use all available tools to build a roster.

[cp176]

Stupid statistics: WHIP, WAR, BOPS. Who caame up with this nonsense? Agents looking to make their client seem better than he is. The most ridiculous is a "SAVE". I'm 71 yo and have been to and seen beaucoup games in my lifetime. I've never NEVER never seen a guy get a game-tying or winning hit from the on deck circle

 

 

Amen brother . I'll drink to that - here's to you.

[waltr]

The kid is gonna have whiplash watching all those shots to the outfield

[waltr]

Cherington compensating for all those big contracts. He picks up somebody like Machi and Cook for minimum money . Doesn't realize they are getting treleased because they have ERAs that are highr than a TD and FG

[mvp 78]

Stupid statistics: WHIP, WAR, BOPS. Who caame up with this nonsense? Agents looking to make their client seem better than he is. The most ridiculous is a "SAVE". I'm 71 yo and have been to and seen beaucoup games in my lifetime. I've never NEVER never seen a guy get a game-tying or winning hit from the on deck circle

 

WHIP is really great. It lets you know how many baserunners are allowed per inning.

[reYoukilis]

Your hot stove has to start with the cleaning house of your FO and coaching staff. Ben, Farrell, Lovullo, et al all need to go. The culture needs to change again.

I'm not sure about that. I wonder if it was Cheringtons choice to get Sandoval or Ramirez at all. For a guy that did all that salary dumping, to splurge on them doesn't make sense.

 

I'm still of the belief that Cherington is the architect of 2013 and needs a full chance to see his vision through of a team built from within. At least know its a failure before throwing it all away.

[waltr]

Breslow comes in with bases loaded and gives up the grand salami, finished the inning and pitches two more, giving up one more hit. 2.1 innings, 2 hits. WHIP is less than 1.00. It'a NOT how many hits you give up, it's when you give them up. WHIP don't mean diddley.

[sk7326]

Stupid statistics: WHIP, WAR, BOPS. Who caame up with this nonsense? Agents looking to make their client seem better than he is. The most ridiculous is a "SAVE". I'm 71 yo and have been to and seen beaucoup games in my lifetime. I've never NEVER never seen a guy get a game-tying or winning hit from the on deck circle

 

WAR is good, although for pitching there is much debate about which flavor is better (and it is good the info is out there). WHIP is a good idea but uses the wrong denominator (if you want to get picky) - % of batters gets you where you want to go. But WHIP gives some good information within those limits.

 

Saves, RBIs, pitcher wins, batting average all are useless to a degree (and the former three are much more "made up" than WAR for instance).

[cp176]

Useless seems like too strong a word. If I am looking for a hitter and the only infomation that I have to go on is a high batting average and lots of RBI's, my guess would be that that player looks like a pretty good hitter.

[mvp 78]

Breslow comes in with bases loaded and gives up the grand salami, finished the inning and pitches two more, giving up one more hit. 2.1 innings, 2 hits. WHIP is less than 1.00. It'a NOT how many hits you give up, it's when you give them up. WHIP don't mean diddley.

 

Your made up situation is stupid. Breslow has a 1.47 WHIP and has only allowed 2 inherited runners to score.

[mvp 78]

You can't take the results of one game and extrapolate it over 162. It's horrible methodology.

 

If a pitcher has a WHIP under 1, he's one of your most reliable guys no matter what.

[SoxnCycles]

"If you are simply one or the other, you are a fool."

 

Amen brother . I'll drink to that - here's to you.

 

LOL So picking picking stats over scouting (although no team does that) is foolish.

But, rejecting additional information out of hand isn't?

 

Too funny...

[a700hitter]

Useless seems like too strong a word. If I am looking for a hitter and the only infomation that I have to go on is a high batting average and lots of RBI's, my guess would be that that player looks like a pretty good hitter.

Each stat is an indicator and if a player performs consistently in each category, it is gives a reliable picture of the player. If performance among statistical categories is inconsistent it is more difficult to figure out what you have in a player. That is when scouting is really important. There is no single stat or even 2 stats are that are definitive. I am not a big believer in WAR.

 

I don't think scouting is the best tool, but it is also the most labor intensive and expensive. Sabremetrics is in many ways a cost effective replacement, but an imperfect one.

[User Name]

Stupid statistics: WHIP, WAR, BOPS. Who caame up with this nonsense? Agents looking to make their client seem better than he is. The most ridiculous is a "SAVE". I'm 71 yo and have been to and seen beaucoup games in my lifetime. I've never NEVER never seen a guy get a game-tying or winning hit from the on deck circle

 

Oh, you're one of THOSE guys.

 

"Get off my lawn with your goddamn computers and your math, get me an old-timer to do some scoutin', grrrrrr"

 

Get with the times.

[Bellhorn04]

One thing's for sure - it doesn't matter what statistics or method you use to evaluate our 2015 pitching staff. They take any possible confusion out of the picture.

[mvp 78]

You need stats AND scouts to have the most informed opinion. This isn't rocket science, people.

[User Name]

You need stats AND scouts to have the most informed opinion. This isn't rocket science, people.

 

I should sig this.

[mvp 78]

I should sig this.

 

All my posts are sig worthy.

[Elktonnick]

It doesn't take statistics to know the bullpen sucks. Tazawa is fried. It is likely that Koji's wrist injury requires a prudent FO to seriously look for a closer for 2016. In short there isn't much to salvage and keep from this year's bullpen. So in addition to at least two starters the club will need a totally revamped bullpen to be competitive in 2016.

[User Name]

All my posts are sig worthy.

 

You're truly the "must-read material" poster 'round these here parts.

[cp176]

"If you are simply one or the other, you are a fool."

 

 

 

LOL So picking picking stats over scouting (although no team does that) is foolish.

But, rejecting additional information out of hand isn't?

 

Too funny...

 

 

? What - I don't get what you are saying. Should I have said - If you are simply a stat geek then you are a fool + If you are just a scout trusting geek you are a foo? Or was your comment directed toward my slightly hypocritical "Amen brother"?

 

I'll try to be a little clearer. I do get a kick out of you though.

[a700hitter]

You need stats AND scouts to have the most informed opinion. This isn't rocket science, people.

Stats are needed because you can't get enough coverage with scouts and the consistency and quality of the scouts would vary too much. Ideally, you would clone your best scout about 50 times and send him to every major and minor league game and high school and college too. Lol. You might need to clone him 200 times. Lol! You can't clone your best scouts so you need the stats to target the efforts of your limited scouting resources.

 

I don't think an organization needs to do a lot of advanced metrics on their own players. If they don't know more about their own players from watching them day in and day out than the stats could possibly tell them, there is something wrong with the organization. Stats are necessary part of the whole process, because there are hundreds of games going on at various levels-- college, minors, independent leagues and international.

Edited August 13, 2015 by a700hitter