2015 Red Sox Trade Deadline Thread

[Palodios]

What kind of starters, though, 1 - 5?

 

I have heard mid-rotation potential for two, and back of the rotation for the other.

[Northern Star]

Send Papi back to Minnesota for an emotional reunion. They can give us Sano to clear a spot for him.

[User Name]

Sano can't pitch.

[reYoukilis]

If this is Cheringtons doing he needs to be fired. Big "if". I say that because some of the decisions could be coming from ownership. If not, he should be fired for not sticking to his guns he started getting rid of A Gon and Beckett. It was a great and ballsy move that led to a WS win. After that, not so good, but it doesn't make sense to give up on a plan and return to the way things were after only one bad year. One bad year does not make for a failed plan. How many times have we seen a player not do well the first year only to find it the next? My theory is that Cheri is not being allowed to fail before he succeeds and the result is a split plan that isn't winning nor is it having a future to look foward to. Its half assing. Its band aiding. Its going against the wisdom of every WS winner of the last decade.

[cp176]

If this is Cheringtons doing he needs to be fired. Big "if". I say that because some of the decisions could be coming from ownership. If not, he should be fired for not sticking to his guns he started getting rid of A Gon and Beckett. It was a great and ballsy move that led to a WS win. After that, not so good, but it doesn't make sense to give up on a plan and return to the way things were after only one bad year. One bad year does not make for a failed plan. How many times have we seen a player not do well the first year only to find it the next? My theory is that Cheri is not being allowed to fail before he succeeds and the result is a split plan that isn't winning nor is it having a future to look foward to. Its half assing. Its band aiding. Its going against the wisdom of every WS winner of the last decade.

 

 

 

Plan?

[Kimmi]

If this is Cheringtons doing he needs to be fired. Big "if". I say that because some of the decisions could be coming from ownership. If not, he should be fired for not sticking to his guns he started getting rid of A Gon and Beckett. It was a great and ballsy move that led to a WS win. After that, not so good, but it doesn't make sense to give up on a plan and return to the way things were after only one bad year. One bad year does not make for a failed plan. How many times have we seen a player not do well the first year only to find it the next? My theory is that Cheri is not being allowed to fail before he succeeds and the result is a split plan that isn't winning nor is it having a future to look foward to. Its half assing. Its band aiding. Its going against the wisdom of every WS winner of the last decade.

 

The good news is that a badly as the plan has failed this year, Ben did not sacrifice the future of the team. He stuck to his guns in terms of not giving up his prized prospects, and we still have those players for years to come. The team is also in decent shape financially.

 

I know most people hate the Hanley, Pablo, and Porcello contracts. However, none of those contracts are outrageous. Pablo's was the only one out of the three that I didn't like, but even his is salvageable. None of those contracts have put a strap on the team where they can't go out and get the pitching that they need.

 

If those players continue to perform like they did this year, then yes, they will become a burden. But like you said, players can have bad years and then turn it around the following year. I expect better performances from all three going forward.

[jacksonianmarch]

Put the Pom poms away kimmi. You're saddled with over $60 mil AAV of contracts for the next 4 years with players who are producing 0WAR in year 1. That isn't a small amount of cash to be dragging your team down. You have no pitching to choose from aside from ERod and he is still a rook. And while you haven't dealt away your chips, you haven't had the opportunity because your team sucked. The dismantling of your rotation will end up being your downfall and quite possibly impossible to replace with the current mandate from above Edited July 29, 2015 by jacksonianmarch

[Elktonnick]

Put the Pom poms away kimmi. You're saddled with over $60 mil AAV of contracts for the next 4 years with players who are producing 0WAR in year 1. That isn't a small amount of cash to be dragging your team down. You have no pitching to choose from aside from ERod and he is still a rook. And while you haven't dealt away your chips, you haven't had the opportunity because your team sucked. The dismantling of your rotation will end up being your downfall and quite possibly impossible to replace with the current mandate from above

 

Right you are. The absolute disaster that Cherrington created will take years to repair regardless of the budget especially if Henry's absurd restriction remains in force. Buchholtz will be yet another year older next year. Red Sox fans have only seen only brief instants of Buchholtz living up to his promise and talent. As he ages the likelihood that he'll live up to that promise will only diminish. In fact there is greater probability that he will spend more time on the DL. That leaves only ERod who has yet a long road to travel before he can be counted on to be a reliable consistent starter.

 

In all honesty one should be surprised to see a 500 ball club in 2016. The hole is that deep.

[sk7326]

Send Papi back to Minnesota for an emotional reunion. They can give us Sano to clear a spot for him.

 

since cheap controllable corner power can be had for a pure DH who is past 35 ...

[Bellhorn04]

Put the Pom poms away kimmi. You're saddled with over $60 mil AAV of contracts for the next 4 years with players who are producing 0WAR in year 1.

 

Although, as Yankee fans should readily agree this year, sometimes guys who appear to be a lot of dead money can have big turnarounds.

[reYoukilis]

The good news is that a badly as the plan has failed this year, Ben did not sacrifice the future of the team. He stuck to his guns in terms of not giving up his prized prospects, and we still have those players for years to come. The team is also in decent shape financially.

 

I know most people hate the Hanley, Pablo, and Porcello contracts. However, none of those contracts are outrageous. Pablo's was the only one out of the three that I didn't like, but even his is salvageable. None of those contracts have put a strap on the team where they can't go out and get the pitching that they need.

 

If those players continue to perform like they did this year, then yes, they will become a burden. But like you said, players can have bad years and then turn it around the following year. I expect better performances from all three going forward.

Not keeping Lester was the ultimate s*** move and someone should've been fired just for that. That move alone makes hoping a hard thing to do. Getting Hanley and Sandoval reinforced this thinking for me. Yes they are good players but they represent winning now wheras all your other moves represent building for the future, not now. They get rid of Lester but acquire Sandoval, Hanley and Porcello. Huh? Not only does it not make sense but you get rid of a beloved figure who has been as steady a player as can be, doesn't get injured, was willing to take a home town cut and had plenty of years on him. Instead we get a player who we already kicked off the team years before in Hanley and Sandoval who talked s*** to his ex team the Giants. Hanley can't play D which I thought was a priority. The whole thing just makes no sense.

[Northern Star]

since cheap controllable corner power can be had for a pure DH who is past 35 ...

 

You really though I wasn't joking? Aw, you're adorable.

[Northern Star]

The good news is that a badly as the plan has failed this year, Ben did not sacrifice the future of the team. He stuck to his guns in terms of not giving up his prized prospects, and we still have those players for years to come. The team is also in decent shape financially.

 

I know most people hate the Hanley, Pablo, and Porcello contracts. However, none of those contracts are outrageous. Pablo's was the only one out of the three that I didn't like, but even his is salvageable. None of those contracts have put a strap on the team where they can't go out and get the pitching that they need.

 

If those players continue to perform like they did this year, then yes, they will become a burden. But like you said, players can have bad years and then turn it around the following year. I expect better performances from all three going forward.

 

Except that he's now getting hounded for holding onto those prospects too long and they've lost their luster as a result. The worst contract might turn out to be Castillo. OF wasn't a pressing need, and that would have been half or so of a contract to a frontline starting pitcher.

[cp176]

Except that he's now getting hounded for holding onto those prospects too long and they've lost their luster as a result. The worst contract might turn out to be Castillo. OF wasn't a pressing need, and that would have been half or so of a contract to a frontline starting pitcher.

 

Come on - I see no plan. Keep all prospects and sign mid rotation (at best pitchers) and players that will bolster your minor league rosters. What is the plan? Does anybody truly have a clue?

[Spudboy]

You really though I wasn't joking? Aw, you're adorable.

 

At least you could have let him have the last word. That's all he wants.

 

Jeez.

[Spudboy]

Except that he's now getting hounded for holding onto those prospects too long and they've lost their luster as a result. The worst contract might turn out to be Castillo. OF wasn't a pressing need, and that would have been half or so of a contract to a frontline starting pitcher.

 

You've got it all wrong.

 

The Sox want to corner the market on High Twitch Muscles.

 

72 mil is not much for that. Is it?

[Northern Star]

Not keeping Lester was the ultimate s*** move and someone should've been fired just for that. That move alone makes hoping a hard thing to do. Getting Hanley and Sandoval reinforced this thinking for me. Yes they are good players but they represent winning now wheras all your other moves represent building for the future, not now. They get rid of Lester but acquire Sandoval, Hanley and Porcello. Huh? Not only does it not make sense but you get rid of a beloved figure who has been as steady a player as can be, doesn't get injured, was willing to take a home town cut and had plenty of years on him. Instead we get a player who we already kicked off the team years before in Hanley and Sandoval who talked s*** to his ex team the Giants. Hanley can't play D which I thought was a priority. The whole thing just makes no sense.

 

Henry's not gonna fire himself if indeed it was ownership dictating no longterm deals for a player of Lester's age. They need to wake the f*** up, though.

[Northern Star]

Come on - I see no plan. Keep all prospects and sign mid rotation (at best pitchers) and players that will bolster your minor league rosters. What is the plan? Does anybody truly have a clue?

 

I'm not disagreeing with that, but that has little bearing on what I said - the media has been hounding Ben recently for holding onto Owens and Cecchini and not selling when their value was higher than it is now. Whether they're right to hound him is debatable. I would rather a team hold onto the prospects than trade them for an over the hill veteran, but in that case, those prospects HAVE to turn out. The Sox might be number one in farm system on people's lists but their track record of converting into top MLB talent is very sketchy of late.

[Elktonnick]

I'm not disagreeing with that, but that has little bearing on what I said - the media has been hounding Ben recently for holding onto Owens and Cecchini and not selling when their value was higher than it is now. Whether they're right to hound him is debatable. I would rather a team hold onto the prospects than trade them for an over the hill veteran, but in that case, those prospects HAVE to turn out. The Sox might be number one in farm system on people's lists but their track record of converting into top MLB talent is very sketchy of late.

 

That sums it up. What that really means is their farm system is either overrated or they have traded away their good prospects.

[cp176]

I'm not disagreeing with that, but that has little bearing on what I said - the media has been hounding Ben recently for holding onto Owens and Cecchini and not selling when their value was higher than it is now. Whether they're right to hound him is debatable. I would rather a team hold onto the prospects than trade them for an over the hill veteran, but in that case, those prospects HAVE to turn out. The Sox might be number one in farm system on people's lists but their track record of converting into top MLB talent is very sketchy of late.

 

I should not have hit the reply with quote button. I really wasn't responding to your comment. I will say though that once again, I do not think that there is a "plan". Abandon fing ship would be a good one for Cherington right now. Outside of the players whom we have already seen debut, nothing makes me that the talent that we have in our double A and or triple A programs is much better than anyone elses. Probably everybody else just sucks too I guess.

[cp176]

Based on their performance alone, Hernandez and Travis are two of our best prospects. I say trade them now while they are still worth something. Oh wait, not exactly common names? i am a bitter man.

[BigPapi]

It's gonna be interesting to see next years rotation. Barring any unlikely trade, e-rod will take up a spot. Clay will have a spot. With the money they invested in Rick, that piece of s*** will take up a spot. Although I would rather have Miley in the rotation next year instead of Porcello because at least he can keep his fastball down in the zone much more often, they can't afford to waste another spot with Miley. He will either have to be put in the pen to start next year as a long reliever and a backup starter, or the sox will have to move him this deadline since they sure as hell can't trade porcello. With no Miley in the rotation to start next year, that would leave the last two spots to hopefully a free agent ace and Henry Owens. Whatever ends up happening, it will be interesting to see what management throws out on the field starting pitching wise in 2016.

[dupree]

Cole Hamels is heading to the Rangers.

Now what?

 

Wait for it...

Yep User Name is about to say "f*** Yeah now he's not coming here!!!"

[Spudboy]

Good for the Rangers.

 

Now they can pay for dead contracts too.

[dupree]

The Dodgers are making moves and are still in the hunt for more pitching... the Yankees are said to be in on Price too... I see no matter who gets him unless it's the Cubs because I'd say that's where he goes in the offseason.

[sk7326]

I'm not disagreeing with that, but that has little bearing on what I said - the media has been hounding Ben recently for holding onto Owens and Cecchini and not selling when their value was higher than it is now. Whether they're right to hound him is debatable. I would rather a team hold onto the prospects than trade them for an over the hill veteran, but in that case, those prospects HAVE to turn out. The Sox might be number one in farm system on people's lists but their track record of converting into top MLB talent is very sketchy of late.

 

They converted it into a mid-rotation starter and two up the middle ones. If you think that is a low percentage, you don't follow baseball that closely.

[sk7326]

You really though I wasn't joking? Aw, you're adorable.

 

Given other quips, one can't be too sure

[sk7326]

If this is Cheringtons doing he needs to be fired. Big "if". I say that because some of the decisions could be coming from ownership. If not, he should be fired for not sticking to his guns he started getting rid of A Gon and Beckett. It was a great and ballsy move that led to a WS win. After that, not so good, but it doesn't make sense to give up on a plan and return to the way things were after only one bad year. One bad year does not make for a failed plan. How many times have we seen a player not do well the first year only to find it the next? My theory is that Cheri is not being allowed to fail before he succeeds and the result is a split plan that isn't winning nor is it having a future to look foward to. Its half assing. Its band aiding. Its going against the wisdom of every WS winner of the last decade.

 

This is one of the few posts which makes sense. Now the TRADE did not lead to anything. It cleared a lot of payroll - but payroll has always been a choice for the ownership. (so from that perspective it made the outlays on the Red Sox in line with what Henry wants to spend for his playthings) Beckett's body fell apart, and as it turns out Adrian Gonzalez is a good player (not one who will inspire folk songs). A miraculous season from Victorino and a distinct lack of injuries were bigger drivers.

 

Now I do think there is always the tension between the Sox as a baseball team and one as a TV network. When the latter wins, things don't work as well - or at least the moves are shortsighted (like say, let's just sign the top two position players in the FA class without thinking about it). There is some naivete that 7 Top 100 prospects = 7 starters or 7 all-stars. But the recent upticks in the farm have produced 3 guys who are starters who look like distinct parts of the future. That is pretty good. You are right - there is some dissonance going on at the top, which needs to be resolved.

[cp176]

The Pawtucket Red Sox are currently 20 games below .500. The Portland Sea Dogs are currently 27 games below .500. Everyone knows that the farm systems are there to produce players not titles but in this case I know that I have been inclined to think that our farm system is in a lot better shape than it actually is. Without major moves, the Red Sox are a long ways away.

[reYoukilis]

Come on - I see no plan. Keep all prospects and sign mid rotation (at best pitchers) and players that will bolster your minor league rosters. What is the plan? Does anybody truly have a clue?

I think the plan is the same as 2013 which is to build through the farm and bolster with veterans. Unlike 2013 though they didn't bolster it with quality character guys that would make for a good locker room. They also didn't get any pitchers like Lackey.

 

I must also say that the WS win is screwing us a little right now. If we didn't have that we would still have Iglesias, which would have XB at third and Iglesias at SS.

 

However we totally fd ourselves by not signing Lester. With Lester and Buch things would be so different.