Is the actual rotation the worst in the last 10 Y?

[mvp 78]

Rich Porcello's grandfather was Sam Dente. The epitome of journeyman. He did get an MVP vote one year for some unknown reason. I'm sure one of the silverbacks in here may remember him.

[User Name]

The problem here is that what you point it is usually either made-up stuff (like the Lester said he' d take a hometown discount part) or idiocy like pretty much everything else. And still, you have a right to voice your usually stupid opinion, but you don't get to make an insulting remark towards me personally without expecting some in return. You're still a little bitch by the way, and your English is terrible.

 

This post is regarding iortiz obviously.

[mvp 78]

That's Fellowship of the Miserable.

 

Pedro Martinez isn't walking through that door! Curt Schilling and Jason Varitek aren't walking through that door!

[User Name]

That's Fellowship of the Miserable.

 

I like brotherhood of misery better personally. And you can see here a perfect example of how i'm the ******* around here.

[iortiz]

What? How did the Sox underestimate his value? They applied their own value to him and did not pay more than whatever that figure was.

 

When did Lester say that he would take "125 mil"??????? I never heard this. Maybe I was in a coma.

 

I think that the Sox misplayed this matter by not offering a reasonable 5 year deal PRIOR to spring training 2014. The 70 mil offer was a joke. However I never saw a quote from Lester saying that he was insulted. That is an idea put forth by the media and fans. I'm not saying 70 was a good place to start, by the way. I would have started at about 4/96 -5/110 and made a full court press at near those figures topping out at about 5/125 and made it clear that that would be the cap.

 

It makes no difference. He is gone!!!!!

 

Yeah they put a pathetic 70 M offer at the time. At the end they put a135 M offer. Please explain me how a pitcher raise his value to the double in a couple of months. It was dumb. As I said, you would have signed him at 120M but they shitted the bed big time trying to cheat him.

[Spudboy]

Yeah, it was strange. That's why I said I think they screwed up. I'm sure they knew they were starting low with the $70 mil offer, but I think they underestimated exactly how low they were starting. IMO, they put a little too much faith in Lester's willingness to take a home team discount.

 

Does not topping the highest bidder mean that the team really didn't want the player in the first place? Of course not. That's the thing about free agency though. There's almost always going to be a team that will be willing to give out the crazy contract for a certain player.

 

I may be completely wrong about this. None of us knows for sure. Personally, I think it's Lucchino's fault.

 

No. You are not completely wrong. As you have pointed out, none of us know for sure. All we can do is speculate.

 

Last summer I suggested that the Sox may not have wanted to resign Lester and my supposition fell upon deaf ears here. I still think that this is a possibility.

 

The Sox have stated their "policy" concerning signing players / pitchers north of 30 long term. I think that given this backdrop, the FO pretty much knew that the price tag for Lester was going to go well beyond whatever figure $ value they had applied to Lester. Certainly this is possible once Detroit made their initial offer to Scherzer.

 

I have sated that I believe that they should have tried to sign Lester prior to the 2014 season. Maybe even before the Detroit offer.

 

That baseline or starting point of 70 was certainly curious. Especially since they had already made larger deals with Becket and horse face.

 

The 135 offer could represent a final offer that the Sox figured that they could live with if Lester was to take a "hometown discount". Or, it could have been an effort to appease the fans. They could now say "we tried" when they knew or suspected that someone would offer significantly more than the Sox were willing to pay.

 

 

Ultimately Kimmi, you are correct. We just do not know.

[iortiz]

They had Cespedes, but only for one year before he hits free agency.

 

I would have kept him since I do not like Porcello at all and in that scenario you wouldn't need him anyways.

[mvp 78]

This board is full of negativity and it sucks!

 

http://m.golocalworcester.com/sports/bob-lobel-fellowship-of-the-miserable

[iortiz]

The problem here is that what you point it is usually either made-up stuff (like the Lester said he' d take a hometown discount part) or idiocy like pretty much everything else. And still, you have a right to voice your usually stupid opinion, but you don't get to make an insulting remark towards me personally without expecting some in return. You're still a little bitch by the way, and your English is terrible.

 

This post is regarding iortiz obviously.

 

At least I'm not a pink hat like you who will always suck whatever decision the FOs make.

[Spudboy]

I would have used that money in Lester and Shields, would you? Even if that had meant not landing Panda and HR... Hell you already had Cespedes.

 

Signing both Lester and Shields was probably never in the cards. The Sox trading Lester was another indication that the Sox may have known that he was gone anyway.

 

It makes no sense to say that they would have had Cespedes in stead of the two that they signed. They needed to address a weak offense and a void at 3rd base.

 

Cespedes was not a bag of chips anyway. He has declining numbers and is a hack defensively. And a ceiling of 20-25 HR was not exactly Sultan of Swat stuff.

 

The Lester trade netted Porcello. A younger and most likely cheaper pitcher with upside.

[mvp 78]

Older players that signed elsewhere:

Damon

Pedro

Lowe

Manny (forced his way out of town)

Youk

 

The only people who are missed are short term rentals like Beltre and VMart. This team typically knows when to cut bait with a player.

[mvp 78]

At least I'm not a pink hat like you who will always suck whatever decision the FOs make.

 

Pink hat? Did you dnjoy jumping on board the bandwagon during 04? Don't go falling off if they go more than 5 years without winning a WS!

[Kimmi]

Not finding excuses? Look what he said regarding Lester. Tons of examples are out there Kim.

 

Thing is that sometimes there are not simply rationale explications which could support some of their modus operandi (look what happened with Lester), I will point it out.

 

 

There is a rational explanation for why they do what they do. You might not know what it is, but I am confident that the vast majority of the decisions that they make are well thought out and well researched. That doesn't mean that the decisions are always right or that you have to agree with their rationale, but it's there.

 

I've said before that I know that I do not know as much as the FO does. Hence, while I may question a move, I will give them the benefit of the doubt. They're the experts and professionals, with a multitude of data and information driving their decisions. I'm just a fan on a message board.

[Kimmi]

No. You are not completely wrong. As you have pointed out, none of us know for sure. All we can do is speculate.

 

Last summer I suggested that the Sox may not have wanted to resign Lester and my supposition fell upon deaf ears here. I still think that this is a possibility.

 

The Sox have stated their "policy" concerning signing players / pitchers north of 30 long term. I think that given this backdrop, the FO pretty much knew that the price tag for Lester was going to go well beyond whatever figure $ value they had applied to Lester. Certainly this is possible once Detroit made their initial offer to Scherzer.

 

I have sated that I believe that they should have tried to sign Lester prior to the 2014 season. Maybe even before the Detroit offer.

 

That baseline or starting point of 70 was certainly curious. Especially since they had already made larger deals with Becket and horse face.

 

The 135 offer could represent a final offer that the Sox figured that they could live with if Lester was to take a "hometown discount". Or, it could have been an effort to appease the fans. They could now say "we tried" when they knew or suspected that someone would offer significantly more than the Sox were willing to pay.

 

Ultimately Kimmi, you are correct. We just do not know.

 

 

I don't disagree with any of that Spudboy. I think they should have signed Lester before the 2014 season also, and I think at that time they could have signed him for that $135 mil or less. It's quite possible that they didn't offer more than $70 mil for a reason. It's also quite possible that I just don't want to believe that the Sox wouldn't want Lester back.

[Kimmi]

This board is full of negativity and it sucks!

 

http://m.golocalworcester.com/sports/bob-lobel-fellowship-of-the-miserable

 

 

Once upon a time, I used to participate in game threads. I had to stop doing that because they were doing nothing but bringing me down from all the negativity.

 

Do I dare bring my pom poms to the game threads on this site?

[mvp 78]

Once upon a time, I used to participate in game threads. I had to stop doing that because they were doing nothing but bringing me down from all the negativity.

 

Do I dare bring my pom poms to the game threads on this site?

 

Depends on the game and who is posting! Weekends are usually bad.

[User Name]

At least I'm not a pink hat like you who will always suck whatever decision the FOs make.

 

You're not smart enough to know what a pink hat is, so i'll give you a pass. You're still an idiot and a little bitch though.

[Kimmi]

Older players that signed elsewhere:

Damon

Pedro

Lowe

Manny (forced his way out of town)

Youk

 

The only people who are missed are short term rentals like Beltre and VMart. This team typically knows when to cut bait with a player.

 

 

Bingo. I wanted all of those players back and was upset when they signed elsewhere. Same thing with Lester.

 

But the FO has gotten it right more often than not.

[User Name]

Once upon a time, I used to participate in game threads. I had to stop doing that because they were doing nothing but bringing me down from all the negativity.

 

Do I dare bring my pom poms to the game threads on this site?

 

Oh God no. Do you like John Farrell? Anyone who plays for the Red Sox? If you do, save yourself the misery of joining the Gamethreads here.

[User Name]

Older players that signed elsewhere:

Damon

Pedro

Lowe

Manny (forced his way out of town)

Youk

 

The only people who are missed are short term rentals like Beltre and VMart. This team typically knows when to cut bait with a player.

 

Youk and Pedro are especially good examples. In both cases, the FO thought their bodies wouldn't hold up, and in both cases, they were very much right.

[mvp 78]

Bingo. I wanted all of those players back and was upset when they signed elsewhere. Same thing with Lester.

 

But the FO has gotten it right more often than not.

 

Why didn't they re-sign Jason Bay?!?

[mvp 78]

Oh God no. Do you like John Farrell? Anyone who plays for the Red Sox? If you do, save yourself the misery of joining the Gamethreads here.

 

Maybe we can pick one night a week to takeover the game threads?

[Spudboy]

There is a rational explanation for why they do what they do. You might not know what it is, but I am confident that the vast majority of the decisions that they make are well thought out and well researched. That doesn't mean that the decisions are always right or that you have to agree with their rationale, but it's there.

 

I've said before that I know that I do not know as much as the FO does. Hence, while I may question a move, I will give them the benefit of the doubt. They're the experts and professionals, with a multitude of data and information driving their decisions. I'm just a fan on a message board.

 

Excellent post.

[Kimmi]

Oh God no. Do you like John Farrell? Anyone who plays for the Red Sox? If you do, save yourself the misery of joining the Gamethreads here.

 

 

LOL I think I will take your advice.

 

I tend to record the games anyway, and start watching about 30 - 60 minutes after start time, so I can FF through all the commercials.

 

I think I'll go back and read some of the old game threads, just for fun.

[User Name]

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/red_sox_mlb/boston_red_sox/2015/01/red_sox_forecast_looking_bright

 

Tomase on the projections for the 2015 Red Sox. It's a good read.

[User Name]

Maybe we can pick one night a week to takeover the game threads?

 

I'd be up for that.

[Bellhorn04]

Game threads are fun if the Sox are winning comfortably. If they're losing you're just going to read stuff like 'WTF _____?' 'f*** you _____' '______ sucks' and 'Farrell is an idiot. Can we fire him now please?'

[Spudboy]

Once upon a time, I used to participate in game threads. I had to stop doing that because they were doing nothing but bringing me down from all the negativity.

 

Do I dare bring my pom poms to the game threads on this site?

 

I can see no reason for you not to participate in game threads. As long as you can stomach the usual reactionary, emotional, not thought out posts!

 

Game threads on Talksox used to be a lot of fun. If more reasonable, informed, and intelligent people like yourself post in game threads, they can become enjoyable once more.

[mvp 78]

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/red_sox_mlb/boston_red_sox/2015/01/red_sox_forecast_looking_bright

 

Tomase on the projections for the 2015 Red Sox. It's a good read.

How that fat bastard has a job in this town is beyond me.

[cp176]

This board is full of negativity and it sucks!

 

http://m.golocalworcester.com/sports/bob-lobel-fellowship-of-the-miserable

 

One of Rick Pitino's finest moments