2014 Offseason Thread

[cp176]

Hi Pruneface. While I would definitely like to see another starter, and I think the Sox should add one, I don't think it's a necessity. I like the team as currently constructed and think they are legitimate contenders. I can see the rationale for waiting until midseason as well, but I'm still hopeful they pick up another starter this offseason.

 

A little redundant on my part but I think that a Sherzer signing, although painful monetarily, could secure this team's future for a number of years. A fairly young talented pitching staff with some good young arms having time to develop.

[Kimmi]

A little redundant on my part but I think that a Sherzer signing, although painful monetarily, could secure this team's future for a number of years. A fairly young talented pitching staff with some good young arms having time to develop.

 

 

I don't disagree. I guess it depends on what the bottom line is, but I just don't see the FO giving Scherzer what he will likely command. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have him. For the Sox, I think Shields is a more realistic option. I can see possibly getting him for a 4 year deal.

[Behindenemylines]

Hi Pruneface. While I would definitely like to see another starter, and I think the Sox should add one, I don't think it's a necessity. I like the team as currently constructed and think they are legitimate contenders. I can see the rationale for waiting until midseason as well, but I'm still hopeful they pick up another starter this offseason.

 

The Sox will add another starter sometime during 2015. Right now the demands for any of the mentioned starters (Hamels, Zimmermann, etc.) are too high. I think Sox start season with the staff they have now, but by the July trading deadline they will acquire someone. They will be able to compete in AL East because of the flaws of all of the teams, but the need for a number will have to be filled if a run at the playoffs is going to happen.

[cp176]

I don't disagree. I guess it depends on what the bottom line is, but I just don't see the FO giving Scherzer what he will likely command. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have him. For the Sox, I think Shields is a more realistic option. I can see possibly getting him for a 4 year deal.

 

I think that it is very odd that one or both of these guys have not already been signed. January 18th seems a little late for these types of signings. I am going to guess that there is a lot of stuff going on that we don't hear anything about. Not even a whisper. Doesn't really appear that there are many teams out there willing to pay the big bucks for longer term deals for either of them. I hope the Sox are in the hunt. I prefer one to Hamels.

[a700hitter]

I think that it is very odd that one or both of these guys have not already been signed. January 18th seems a little late for these types of signings. I am going to guess that there is a lot of stuff going on that we don't hear anything about. Not even a whisper. Doesn't really appear that there are many teams out there willing to pay the big bucks for longer term deals for either of them. I hope the Sox are in the hunt. I prefer one to Hamels.

I read that the only FS pitcher to sign a $100+ million deal after January 1st is Tanaka. Both Shields and Scherzer are in unchartered territory.

[Palodios]

I read that the only FS pitcher to sign a $100+ million deal after January 1st is Tanaka. Both Shields and Scherzer are in unchartered territory.

 

The Jays are giving Shields a long look. Adding an ace makes them easy favorites in the division, maybe the Red Sox will work on outmaneuvering them.

[User Name]

Sources say the feeling around the industry is that Shields won't even be able to break $100 million anymore, and that Scherzer may have a hard time beating Detroit's initial $144 million offer because of how they've waited. I don't buy it on Scherzer, because it's an ownership-level decision, but i'd swing on 4/100 for Shields.

[Elktonnick]

The Jays are giving Shields a long look. Adding an ace makes them easy favorites in the division, maybe the Red Sox will work on outmaneuvering them.

 

Recently I heard Jim Bowden on MLB radio describe Shields as a solid "middle of the rotation starter". I think fewer baseball people are ready to put Shields in the so called ace category because of his recent playoff performance. Shields is valuable because he is durable and can save a bull pen over the course of a season. I do agree,however, that if Toronto were to land Shields they would be the odds on favorite to win the ALE. But the ALE is so weak that any team adding Shields with the exception of the Rays who have such a woeful lineup would in my view be divisional favorite.

[Bellhorn04]

Recently I heard Jim Bowden on MLB radio describe Shields as a solid "middle of the rotation starter". I think fewer baseball people are ready to put Shields in the so called ace category because of his recent playoff performance.

 

Wouldn't that also take Kershaw out of the ace category?

[cp176]

Sources say the feeling around the industry is that Shields won't even be able to break $100 million anymore, and that Scherzer may have a hard time beating Detroit's initial $144 million offer because of how they've waited. I don't buy it on Scherzer, because it's an ownership-level decision, but i'd swing on 4/100 for Shields.

 

I'll preface this by saying that from a point of understanding most things financial, I am able to pay my own bills and that is about it. I do not understand the technicalities of much of the high contract discussion. If I was paying those bills I probably would. I actually think that I will learn things from following this discussion board. I am thinking that Shields may go to someone for less than $100,000,000 (hurt me putting in all those zeroes ). Do you think that Scherzer will wind up with a contract worth more than what Detroit's offer was or does he go back to Detroit? I would love to see him in Boston but a signing of either one or possibly someone else I think sends a clear message that not only is this team looking to win this year but for years to come.

[Kimmi]

The Sox will add another starter sometime during 2015. Right now the demands for any of the mentioned starters (Hamels, Zimmermann, etc.) are too high. I think Sox start season with the staff they have now, but by the July trading deadline they will acquire someone. They will be able to compete in AL East because of the flaws of all of the teams, but the need for a number will have to be filled if a run at the playoffs is going to happen.

 

 

I agree that the demands for any of the starters are too high right now. It's quite possible that the Sox wait until midseason to add another starter. Or, it's possible that some of those demands will come down as we get closer to Opening Day. Thankfully, the FO has revamped the rotation well enough that they do not have to add another starter right now and they do not have to succumb to demands that they are not comfortable meeting.

[Kimmi]

I think that it is very odd that one or both of these guys have not already been signed. January 18th seems a little late for these types of signings. I am going to guess that there is a lot of stuff going on that we don't hear anything about. Not even a whisper. Doesn't really appear that there are many teams out there willing to pay the big bucks for longer term deals for either of them. I hope the Sox are in the hunt. I prefer one to Hamels.

 

 

It does seem odd that both are still available, and to me, it doesn't seem like the interest or chatter about either one has been as strong as it usually is for top starters. I really wish they would just go ahead and sign already. LOL

 

As far as Hamels goes, I have nothing against him as a pitcher. But my preference is almost always paying "just money" for players versus paying prospects plus money. From what I understand, Amaro has been rather unreasonable in his demands.

[Palodios]

I think fewer baseball people are ready to put Shields in the so called ace category because of his recent playoff performance.

 

People who don't put Shields into the ace category need to take a serious look at his numbers. He's always in the low 3.00 ERA's with 225+ IP, and hasn't missed a start his whole career.

[jad]

On a lesser note, RS and Nava just submitted arbitration figures: 2.3 vs. 1.3. Good grief, just pay the dude. It's going to be hard to argue to the arb. committee that the low figure is just, after paying such stiffs as Gomes 5 and Drew 10 for about a months worth of service.

[Elktonnick]

People who don't put Shields into the ace category need to take a serious look at his numbers. He's always in the low 3.00 ERA's with 225+ IP, and hasn't missed a start his whole career.

That may be true, But there appears to be growing sentiment that Shields isn't a big game pitcher but a solid performer during the regular season. What ever the reason he isn't drawing the "love" from GMs that was previously expected.

[cp176]

Wouldn't that also take Kershaw out of the ace category?

 

There are aces I guess then there are aces. I think Kershaw goes into that elite category I think.

[Bellhorn04]

On a lesser note, RS and Nava just submitted arbitration figures: 2.3 vs. 1.3. Good grief, just pay the dude. It's going to be hard to argue to the arb. committee that the low figure is just, after paying such stiffs as Gomes 5 and Drew 10 for about a months worth of service.

 

The Sox normally settle before it goes to arbitration. I'd expect Nava to end up with 1.9 million or thereabouts.

[a700hitter]

Scherzer Talking Seven-Year Deal With Nats, 1 Other

By Edward Creech [January 18, 2015 at 3:56pm CST]

Max Scherzer is talking with the Nationals and one other team about a seven-year contract, reports Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com. SB Nation’s Chris Cotillo tweeted earlier the impression around baseball is the Nationals will sign Scherzer, but it was unclear whether a deal was close.

The Nat's would have quite a staff if they add Scherzer. It's already pretty good.

[Elktonnick]

If the Nats do sign Scherzer does that make it likely they'll deal Zimmerman? Let's see if that possibility is raised by the media.

[Northern Star]

If the Nats do sign Scherzer does that make it likely they'll deal Zimmerman? Let's see if that possibility is raised by the media.

 

If I was them I wouldn't if I didn't have to.

[Elktonnick]

If I was them I wouldn't if I didn't have to.

 

 

A source told ESPN.com's Jayson Stark that the Nationals won't have the financial flexibility to sign Scherzer unless they have a trade in place to move starter Jordan Zimmermann and possibly shortstop Ian Desmond. As of Saturday, Stark reports, the Nationals did not have trades in place for either Zimmermann or Desmond.

 

Jon Morosi of Fox Sports reports that the Nationals have been discussing Jordan Zimmermann with multiple teams the past few weeks.

With the Nationals perhaps closing in on a deal with Max Scherzer, it makes sense that they could potentially deal Zimmermann who is entering the final season of his contract. Jan 18 - 5:26 PM

Edited January 19, 2015 by Elktonnick

[a700hitter]

A source told ESPN.com's Jayson Stark that the Nationals won't have the financial flexibility to sign Scherzer unless they have a trade in place to move starter Jordan Zimmermann and possibly shortstop Ian Desmond. As of Saturday, Stark reports, the Nationals did not have trades in place for either Zimmermann or Desmond.

 

Jon Morosi of Fox Sports reports that the Nationals have been discussing Jordan Zimmermann with multiple teams the past few weeks.

With the Nationals perhaps closing in on a deal with Max Scherzer, it makes sense that they could potentially deal Zimmermann who is entering the final season of his contract. Jan 18 - 5:26 PM

That doesn't add up. Zimmerman is a free agent after 2015. They could back load Scherzer's contract if they need payroll room.

[jacksonianmarch]

I saw on mlbtr that they were talking about dealing Strasburg. Imagine the return theyd get for that kid

[Elktonnick]

That doesn't add up. Zimmerman is a free agent after 2015. They could back load Scherzer's contract if they need payroll room.

 

I for the life of me can't understand why the Nats are doing what they are doing vis a vis Scherzer and Zimmermann

[Palodios]

I saw on mlbtr that they were talking about dealing Strasburg. Imagine the return theyd get for that kid

 

If they're selling, he's the kind of pitcher the Red Sox are willing to trade blue chips to get.

[Bellhorn04]

That doesn't add up. Zimmerman is a free agent after 2015. They could back load Scherzer's contract if they need payroll room.

 

Looks like Washington will be close to the luxury tax threshold if they sign Scherzer. Back loading wouldn't help that.

[SeanJohn93]

Maybe these chain of events could lead the Sox to grab Zimmerman, I don't know what kind of prospects they would be asking for but I don't want to include Betts, Owens, or Swihart.

[jacksonianmarch]

Maybe these chain of events could lead the Sox to grab Zimmerman, I don't know what kind of prospects they would be asking for but I don't want to include Betts, Owens, or Swihart.

 

Then you're probably not getting Zimmerman. IMO, if they are moving on Scherzer, they probably already have a taker for Zimmerman. You don't commit the kind of cash you will need to commit to Scherzer if you don't have a suitable deal in hand for one of your starters.

[SeanJohn93]

I don't know if he is really worth getting if the price is sky high

[cp176]

I would certainly keep Betts. As for Swihart and Owens - I don't know. Soon there will be no room at the top for some position players if the sox do not make a move. I doubt seriously that we ever see Vasquez and Swihart together. It just doesn't seem to make any sense. As for Owens - if he was the centerpiece that brought Zimmerman to Boston, that I would do. One proven one not. Scherzer gone. I still am holding out hope. I don't understand why you would spend the kind of $ the Sox have so far on 2 position players and still not bring in the best pitcher that you can. A balance is necessary for sure but it is top quality pitching and defense first for me I guess.