Giancarlo Stanton?

[mvp 78]

He's not better than either, and he wouldn't be worth the aggregate value of the prospects it would take to obtain him + a monster extension.

 

Yup, if you REALLY want him, just wait until he's a FA.

[italstallianion]

Yup, if you REALLY want him, just wait until he's a FA.

 

Sounds like the Yankees motto.

[marklmw]

I feel like trading for Stanton is like creating a problem just to solve it.

 

Just for argument's sake, is Stanton really that much better than Trout and Harper?

 

Not! Stanton is not better than Trout. Trout maybe the best everyday player in MLB right now. Of course Cabrera fans will beg to differ. Harper and Stanton are fairly comparable however. The Sox get in trouble when then make the big trade ... thinking Crawford ... Sox will be better served to compete for free agents and keep the studs they have in the minors. Pitching, Pitching, Pitching ... and resign Ellsbury!

[marklmw]

I would not want the sox to trade for him. If we look at the St. Louis cardinals, you will see that baseball America has them ranked as the best farm system in the game with the sox not far behind. They ate competitive this year and have prospects in the wings that are ready to keep the team championship caliber for years to come. I would much rather have a mix of quality players both pitching and positional than to give up all that for one player who is injury prone.

 

SeanJohn speaks the truth!

[User Name]

Not! Stanton is not better than Trout. Trout maybe the best everyday player in MLB right now. Of course Cabrera fans will beg to differ. Harper and Stanton are fairly comparable however. The Sox get in trouble when then make the big trade ... thinking Crawford ... Sox will be better served to compete for free agents and keep the studs they have in the minors. Pitching, Pitching, Pitching ... and resign Ellsbury!

 

The Sox did not trade for Crawford. They traded for Gonzales. Otherwise, your point is well taken.

[marklmw]

Ells is simply not worth it. Replace him with JBJ and move on.

Ellsbury has had a bad rap as being injury prone ... Beltre leveled the guy and busted up his ribs ... The Sox can up Ellsbury from $10M to $18M over 5 years no problem. Make the deal now! Put the deal out to Ellsbury today. Let him turn it down.

[mvp 78]

Ells isn't signing for $10M per. If he'd do 5/50, they'd sign him today. He WANTS to go to FA.

[sk7326]

Crawford and Lackey in consecutive years were - well it was crapping out on a couple of very highly rated FAs. Crawford's decline was particularly stark - his skills looked like things that would age decently (batting approach, good athlete) - still weird to think a guy who was an MVP candidate a year before became replacement level filler (and even after his surgery just a guy).

[Orange Juiced]

I wonder if there's a way to get Stanton this offseason without giving up Bogaerts. I think the Sox would have to be very creative. Maybe bring a 3rd team in on it. And, of course, be willing to surrender multiple high-level prospects not named Bogaerts. The Sox are deep in two places now: starting pitching and near-ML-ready prospects. Most MLB clubs value both of these things, so it puts the Sox in a good position.

 

Now, what team that is on the cusp of contention (or in contention) really could use a quality starting pitcher or two? Let's talk about the Angels. They have a huge payroll, their best power hitter (Pujols) is out for the rest of the year but they hope he'll be back mashing next season fully healthy. Their starting pitching is a huge disappointment, featuring guys like Blanton (5.52 era), Hanson (5.59 era), and Jerome Williams (4.77 era). They need starting pitching help. Their farm system is in rough shape after a handful of trades the past couple of years. But they do have some quality players and a few good prospects left.

 

So how about something along these lines....

 

Sox give up: Doubront, Bradley Jr., Lester (after they exercise the option on him), and Ranaudo.

LAA gives up: LHP Nick Maronde (their best pitching prospect), 3b Kaleb Cowart (their best overall prospect), Trumbo, Hanson

Fla gives up: Stanton

 

Sox get back: Stanton, Trumbo

LAA gets back: Doubront, Lester

Fla gets back: Bradley, Ranaudo, Maronde, Cowart, Hanson

 

Why Boston does it: They would still have the following SP available: Buchholz, Lackey, Peavy, Dempster, Webster, Workman, DeLaRosa. Plus, they could sign a FA pitcher as well. That's still a lot of SP. I hate giving up Doubront, but I feel it would be a huge piece to this trade. They add one of the best RH power bats in all of baseball in Stanton, and solve their 1b issues moving forward with Trumbo. Suddenly there's major thump from the right side. I feel they give up an awful lot (two quality starting pitchers, and two of their best prospects), but that RH power is worth it.

 

Why LAA does it: They desperately need starting pitching. They can pick up a DH elsewhere (Pujols goes back to 1b next year) and their lineup is still stacked. Lester + Doubront represents a huge upgrade over Hanson and, say, Blanton. Suddenly their rotation becomes: Wilson, Weaver, Doubront, Lester, and Vargas. That's as good as any in baseball 1-5. And since pitching wins championships....well, they would have upgraded their team considerably.

 

Why Fla does it: Losing Stanton obviously hurts. But they get a SP that has had major success in the NL East (Hanson), plus he's really cheap and under control through 2015. They also add four excellent prospects - two from Boston and two from LAA. That is a pretty nice haul when all is said and done.

 

Perhaps Boston might need to throw in another prospect (not named Bogaerts) to go to Florida to nail this down. Or Hanson is left out of the deal, Lester goes to LAA, Doubront goes to Florida instead (if they prefer him over Hanson), and another prospect goes from Boston to LAA instead. But I think a deal along these lines (even if the particulars aren't correct) could work. The Sox then re-sign Ellsbury and Saltalamacchia.

 

For the Sox, it would mean their lineup would look like this in 2014:

 

C - Saltalacchia

1b - Trumbo

2b - Pedroia

3b - Middlebrooks (hopefully!)

SS - Bogaerts

LF - Stanton

CF - Ellsbury (hopefully!)

RF - Victorino

DH - Ortiz

 

Lineup:

CF Ellsbury

2b Pedroia

DH Ortiz

LF Stanton

1b Trumbo

SS Bogaerts

3b Middlebrooks

C Saltalamacchia

RF Victorino

 

SP - Peavy, Buchholz, Lackey, Dempster, Workman/Webster/FA signing

[dupree]

If that happened Juiced that would definitely be exciting and a blockbuster trade. Great thoughts and if it were to come true the sox could be the best team in baseball for many years to come.

[Orange Juiced]

If that happened Juiced that would definitely be exciting and a blockbuster trade. Great thoughts and if it were to come true the sox could be the best team in baseball for many years to come.

 

I don't see it happening (these kinds of trades rarely do). I am just thinking about what might need to happen for the Sox to land Stanton without giving up Bogaerts. It'll take something kinda similarly creative to this to get it done, IMO.

 

But man, that lineup the Sox could throw out there (in my scenario)...holy smokes. And again, they'd still have enough starting pitching to have a really good rotation.

[dupree]

I don't see it happening (these kinds of trades rarely do). I am just thinking about what might need to happen for the Sox to land Stanton without giving up Bogaerts. It'll take something kinda similarly creative to this to get it done, IMO.

But man, that lineup the Sox could throw out there (in my scenario)...holy smokes. And again, they'd still have enough starting pitching to have a really good rotation.

 

I think it will take a 3 team trade as well for the Sox to land Stanton if that ever is to happen. I honestly dont see the Sox ever getting him tho. But your scenario and that line up are remarkable. If that trade could go down the Sox would be set and still relatively young and be a powerhouse for years to come. But as you said trades like that rarely happen. But still its nice to have hope.

[Behindenemylines]

No way the Sox get him without giving up the farm. Lets say the Sox make the trade and lose 4 or 5 of their top prospects. Stanton then either gets hurt or bombs in Boston. It would set the Sox back a great deal. I say push forward with their plan and only consider Stanton if the price comes down.

[SCM33]

I feel like trading for Stanton is like creating a problem just to solve it.

 

Just for argument's sake, is Stanton really that much better than Trout and Harper?

Yeah, we don't really need him. We have the best offense in baseball right now. In the offseason their focus should be on getting a real #2. Laptop is your 1, Lackey is your 3, Doubront is your 4 and Peavy will be your 5. We need a real #2, and some additional help from the right side in the pen.

 

Stanton scares the hell out of me, the ability is through the roof. I think he has the ability to be one of the best, but there is also a chance that 2012 is an aberration, with 2010, 2011 and 2013 being the norm .....the amount of talent he will cost in a trade would never be worth the production. Too much high end talent to sacrifice for 1 player.

 

He's not better than either, and he wouldn't be worth the aggregate value of the prospects it would take to obtain him + a monster extension.

Yes.

 

Yup, if you REALLY want him, just wait until he's a FA.

And even at that point, would he really be worth it? We seem to have put together a pretty solid offensive club, and none of the guys have monster contracts.

[Dojji]

I wonder if there's a way to get Stanton this offseason without giving up Bogaerts. I think the Sox would have to be very creative. Maybe bring a 3rd team in on it. And, of course, be willing to surrender multiple high-level prospects not named Bogaerts. The Sox are deep in two places now: starting pitching and near-ML-ready prospects. Most MLB clubs value both of these things, so it puts the Sox in a good position.

 

Now, what team that is on the cusp of contention (or in contention) really could use a quality starting pitcher or two? Let's talk about the Angels. They have a huge payroll, their best power hitter (Pujols) is out for the rest of the year but they hope he'll be back mashing next season fully healthy. Their starting pitching is a huge disappointment, featuring guys like Blanton (5.52 era), Hanson (5.59 era), and Jerome Williams (4.77 era). They need starting pitching help. Their farm system is in rough shape after a handful of trades the past couple of years. But they do have some quality players and a few good prospects left.

 

So how about something along these lines....

 

Sox give up: Doubront, Bradley Jr., Lester (after they exercise the option on him), and Ranaudo.

LAA gives up: LHP Nick Maronde (their best pitching prospect), 3b Kaleb Cowart (their best overall prospect), Trumbo, Hanson

Fla gives up: Stanton

 

Sox get back: Stanton, Trumbo

LAA gets back: Doubront, Lester

Fla gets back: Bradley, Ranaudo, Maronde, Cowart, Hanson

 

Why Boston does it: They would still have the following SP available: Buchholz, Lackey, Peavy, Dempster, Webster, Workman, DeLaRosa. Plus, they could sign a FA pitcher as well. That's still a lot of SP. I hate giving up Doubront, but I feel it would be a huge piece to this trade. They add one of the best RH power bats in all of baseball in Stanton, and solve their 1b issues moving forward with Trumbo. Suddenly there's major thump from the right side. I feel they give up an awful lot (two quality starting pitchers, and two of their best prospects), but that RH power is worth it.

 

Why LAA does it: They desperately need starting pitching. They can pick up a DH elsewhere (Pujols goes back to 1b next year) and their lineup is still stacked. Lester + Doubront represents a huge upgrade over Hanson and, say, Blanton. Suddenly their rotation becomes: Wilson, Weaver, Doubront, Lester, and Vargas. That's as good as any in baseball 1-5. And since pitching wins championships....well, they would have upgraded their team considerably.

 

Why Fla does it: Losing Stanton obviously hurts. But they get a SP that has had major success in the NL East (Hanson), plus he's really cheap and under control through 2015. They also add four excellent prospects - two from Boston and two from LAA. That is a pretty nice haul when all is said and done.

 

Perhaps Boston might need to throw in another prospect (not named Bogaerts) to go to Florida to nail this down. Or Hanson is left out of the deal, Lester goes to LAA, Doubront goes to Florida instead (if they prefer him over Hanson), and another prospect goes from Boston to LAA instead. But I think a deal along these lines (even if the particulars aren't correct) could work. The Sox then re-sign Ellsbury and Saltalamacchia.

 

For the Sox, it would mean their lineup would look like this in 2014:

 

C - Saltalacchia

1b - Trumbo

2b - Pedroia

3b - Middlebrooks (hopefully!)

SS - Bogaerts

LF - Stanton

CF - Ellsbury (hopefully!)

RF - Victorino

DH - Ortiz

 

Lineup:

CF Ellsbury

2b Pedroia

DH Ortiz

LF Stanton

1b Trumbo

SS Bogaerts

3b Middlebrooks

C Saltalamacchia

RF Victorino

 

SP - Peavy, Buchholz, Lackey, Dempster, Workman/Webster/FA signing

 

Interesting concept, except for one thing. Both teams know what Bogaerts is and have little reason to move any of the principals involved. Put the two facts together and you have two teams both with every incentive to demand Bogaerts be thrown into any deal before they move their young stars.

 

Even if the demand wouldn't be reasonable or this price is "fair" you're blundering into a seller's market and you can expect to be taken for all you have. That's probably the single biggest reason teams don't do deals like this.

[rjortiz]

I wonder if Bradley, Owens, Ranaudo, and Cecchini could get it done.

[jacksonianmarch]

It wouldn't. Any deal has to start with Bogaerts

[SoxFanForsyth]

It wouldn't. Any deal has to start with Bogaerts

 

The offer that rjortiz just posted would destroy any other offer on the table. Those prospects trump a lot of teams #1 prospects. The only team that could compete w the Sox would be the Cardinals.

 

That's 3 top 30 prospects per Klaw & 3 top 50 per BA midseason, and BA didn't have Owens top 50 which he almost certainly would, now that he's dominating AA talent as well.

 

The Marlins would be really hard pressed to find 4 guys rated in almost every top 50 prospect listing

[rjortiz]

I wonder if there's a way to get Stanton this offseason without giving up Bogaerts. I think the Sox would have to be very creative. Maybe bring a 3rd team in on it. And, of course, be willing to surrender multiple high-level prospects not named Bogaerts. The Sox are deep in two places now: starting pitching and near-ML-ready prospects. Most MLB clubs value both of these things, so it puts the Sox in a good position.

 

Now, what team that is on the cusp of contention (or in contention) really could use a quality starting pitcher or two? Let's talk about the Angels. They have a huge payroll, their best power hitter (Pujols) is out for the rest of the year but they hope he'll be back mashing next season fully healthy. Their starting pitching is a huge disappointment, featuring guys like Blanton (5.52 era), Hanson (5.59 era), and Jerome Williams (4.77 era). They need starting pitching help. Their farm system is in rough shape after a handful of trades the past couple of years. But they do have some quality players and a few good prospects left.

 

So how about something along these lines....

 

Sox give up: Doubront, Bradley Jr., Lester (after they exercise the option on him), and Ranaudo.

LAA gives up: LHP Nick Maronde (their best pitching prospect), 3b Kaleb Cowart (their best overall prospect), Trumbo, Hanson

Fla gives up: Stanton

 

Sox get back: Stanton, Trumbo

LAA gets back: Doubront, Lester

Fla gets back: Bradley, Ranaudo, Maronde, Cowart, Hanson

 

Why Boston does it: They would still have the following SP available: Buchholz, Lackey, Peavy, Dempster, Webster, Workman, DeLaRosa. Plus, they could sign a FA pitcher as well. That's still a lot of SP. I hate giving up Doubront, but I feel it would be a huge piece to this trade. They add one of the best RH power bats in all of baseball in Stanton, and solve their 1b issues moving forward with Trumbo. Suddenly there's major thump from the right side. I feel they give up an awful lot (two quality starting pitchers, and two of their best prospects), but that RH power is worth it.

 

Why LAA does it: They desperately need starting pitching. They can pick up a DH elsewhere (Pujols goes back to 1b next year) and their lineup is still stacked. Lester + Doubront represents a huge upgrade over Hanson and, say, Blanton. Suddenly their rotation becomes: Wilson, Weaver, Doubront, Lester, and Vargas. That's as good as any in baseball 1-5. And since pitching wins championships....well, they would have upgraded their team considerably.

 

Why Fla does it: Losing Stanton obviously hurts. But they get a SP that has had major success in the NL East (Hanson), plus he's really cheap and under control through 2015. They also add four excellent prospects - two from Boston and two from LAA. That is a pretty nice haul when all is said and done.

 

Perhaps Boston might need to throw in another prospect (not named Bogaerts) to go to Florida to nail this down. Or Hanson is left out of the deal, Lester goes to LAA, Doubront goes to Florida instead (if they prefer him over Hanson), and another prospect goes from Boston to LAA instead. But I think a deal along these lines (even if the particulars aren't correct) could work. The Sox then re-sign Ellsbury and Saltalamacchia.

 

For the Sox, it would mean their lineup would look like this in 2014:

 

C - Saltalacchia

1b - Trumbo

2b - Pedroia

3b - Middlebrooks (hopefully!)

SS - Bogaerts

LF - Stanton

CF - Ellsbury (hopefully!)

RF - Victorino

DH - Ortiz

 

Lineup:

CF Ellsbury

2b Pedroia

DH Ortiz

LF Stanton

1b Trumbo

SS Bogaerts

3b Middlebrooks

C Saltalamacchia

RF Victorino

 

SP - Peavy, Buchholz, Lackey, Dempster, Workman/Webster/FA signing

 

That's highway robbery for the Red Sox. Trumbo might be struggling this year, but he's still cheap and has tremendous power. The Angels aren't giving him up plus their two top prospects for a third starter, and a pitcher coming off two down years with only one year of control. The Marlins will get much better prospects for Stanton than that lot. Bradley is a good start, but Cowart has lost a little shine off his status, and Maronde isn't an elite prospect. Hanson is a garbage throw in with no value.

 

Stanton is a monster. He's having a down year, but he's been hurt and plays for the Marlins. He's going to land a massive haul for the Marlins. I wouldn't be surprised to see him go to whoever gives up Tavares, Profar, or Bogaerts.

[jacksonianmarch]

The offer that rjortiz just posted would destroy any other offer on the table. Those prospects trump a lot of teams #1 prospects. The only team that could compete w the Sox would be the Cardinals.

 

That's 3 top 30 prospects per Klaw & 3 top 50 per BA midseason, and BA didn't have Owens top 50 which he almost certainly would, now that he's dominating AA talent as well.

 

The Marlins would be really hard pressed to find 4 guys rated in almost every top 50 prospect listing

 

And were are talking about a 23 yr old talent with clean power that hasn't been seen in decades. This isn't just a ho-hum swap here. This is a swap for a guy who is likely a future HOFer. You don't deal that kind of talent away with all the yrs of team control left to a team and not net their #1 prospect. And I don't care what Keith Law says, Cecchini is an oddball prospect because he isn't a power hitter yet occupies a power position. I doubt his inclusion changes much

[SoxFanForsyth]

And were are talking about a 23 yr old talent with clean power that hasn't been seen in decades. This isn't just a ho-hum swap here. This is a swap for a guy who is likely a future HOFer. You don't deal that kind of talent away with all the yrs of team control left to a team and not net their #1 prospect. And I don't care what Keith Law says, Cecchini is an oddball prospect because he isn't a power hitter yet occupies a power position. I doubt his inclusion changes much

 

Well considering Cecchini was top 50 in BA, Fangraphs, and Klaw, I would say maybe their aggregate opinion of him trumps yours. I can understand if he was ranked top 50 by just 1 guy, but he's a pretty much consensus top 50.

 

And you're acting like the Sox would be giving up nothing. Four top 50 prospects, 2 or 3 of which are top 30, is an absolutely unheard of and extremely huge offer.

[rjortiz]

And were are talking about a 23 yr old talent with clean power that hasn't been seen in decades. This isn't just a ho-hum swap here. This is a swap for a guy who is likely a future HOFer. You don't deal that kind of talent away with all the yrs of team control left to a team and not net their #1 prospect. And I don't care what Keith Law says, Cecchini is an oddball prospect because he isn't a power hitter yet occupies a power position. I doubt his inclusion changes much

 

I have to agree with you. I think the offer is a good start, but I'd bet the Red Sox would have to give up at least two more prospects and it still might not be enough. The Marlins have Marisnick, Ozuna, and Yelich, so Bradley Jr. may not be as valuable to the Marlins as he is to the Red Sox. Owens and Ranaudo are projected second or third starters, and like you said Cecchini has plus-plus contact projection, but not a lot of power, which has to diminish his value a little. Furthermore, one of the bigger holes on the Marlins is SS. Bogaerts would immediately start for them there.

 

Someone earlier in the thread said that he thought that 2012 was an aberration for Stanton, and that 2010, 2011, and 2013 might be his normal seasons. 2010, 2011, and 2013 were/are his age 20, 21, and 23 seasons. He's a beast. Bogaerts has to be in the deal, unless the Cardinals, Rangers, and Red Sox all conspire to refuse the Marlins their top prospect.

Edited August 16, 2013 by rjortiz

[rjortiz]

I doubt the Rockies have any motivation to move him, but I'd offer that same package for Carlos Gonzalez.