Sources say Napoli signs with Sox.

[jung]

If they sign Napoli now I would bet there is a chance it is going to leave a bad taste in Napoli's mouth. They knew he had the hip issue before making him the offer. Then the Sox tried to insert language in the contract that apparently Napoli's people balked at. As such now they are I guess talking about a cleaner contract...fewer years at the same AAV. That would leave a bad taste in my mouth if I were Napoli. At the end of the day, players still have way to much power afforded them in the ML CBA. I'm not sure how I am going to feel about Napoli if he feels like he has been abused in this process.

 

Cannot say I am real happy with what the Sox have been doing this off season. Not sure why this looks like progress.

[jopete19]

Reminds me of the Jason Bay deal. We had a 4 year deal, (I think) with him but it fell apart because of injury and he went to the Mets.

[Bellhorn04]

It is kind of amazing this can drag on so long. If the reports are right the Sox asked to take it back to two years. Napoli said no thanks. So then what? A 2 week game of Texas Hold 'Em to decide who wins?

[seabeachfred]

It is kind of amazing this can drag on so long. If the reports are right the Sox asked to take it back to two years. Napoli said no thanks. So then what? A 2 week game of Texas Hold 'Em to decide who wins?

 

We have a very inept front office Bell, an honor they have earned with one miserable blunder after another the past four seasons. It wouldn't surprise me one twit if we blow the Napoli caper; he leaves and then we dawdle and fail to sign either Swisher or LaRoche. It would at that point that it becomes open season on Henry, Lucchino, his house pet and the whole pathetic edifice on Yawkey Way.

 

If there is a problem between Napoli and Cherington, Bennie the Boob had better start running for his life to the telephone and get in touch with LaRoche or Swisher like lickity split. This could end very ugly.

[jacksonianmarch]

Napoli was brought to Boston because his right handed swing would make Fenway a homer dome. He'd be an annual 30+HR hitter if he stayed healthy in Boston. LaRoche in Boston would be more of a questionmark, especially since LaRoche's career has been a rollercoaster for all intents and purposes and he'd be moving to a field that isnt kind to lefties

[jung]

I did not realize that Napoli already said no. I suspect that means his agent is talking to other teams.

[seabeachfred]

Napoli was brought to Boston because his right handed swing would make Fenway a homer dome. He'd be an annual 30+HR hitter if he stayed healthy in Boston. LaRoche in Boston would be more of a questionmark, especially since LaRoche's career has been a rollercoaster for all intents and purposes and he'd be moving to a field that isnt kind to lefties

 

Yes Jack, all that is true, but Henry and Lucchino are playing their chicken s*** games again and once more they are trying to be clever by half and in the process of blowing the whole God damn thing---just as they did with your Teixeira, Bay, Damon and in talks with Holiday. They are just natural f***-ups and we have to have another plan in place when this blows up. LaRoche would not be as good as Napoli and with Drew on board now we could once again become too left handed, but the alternate is Moron Gomez, a total zit in the field, little power and dumber than a rail. We will need Adam or Nick and fast. This Napoli thing seems to be blowing up and there needs to be an alternate plan...like yesterday.

[mvp 78]

They made the right call with Bay. Clearly they were correct in his injury assessment. Maybe they are making the right call here?

[a700hitter]

They made the right call with Bay. Clearly they were correct in his injury assessment. Maybe they are making the right call here?

 

They made the right call with Bay, but it had nothing to do with their injury assessment which was for his knee and shoulder. Neither have caused him a problem. He runs as hard and fast as when he was with the Sox. His game fell apart after the cumulative effect of two concussions.

[jung]

Well that may well be true. This might well be the right call on Napoli. I suppose the Sox could say that since they could not perform a medical examination until both parties had an agreement in principle, they could say that they really could not include consideration for the preexisting condition into the original offer to Napoli. They did not know the extent of the condition.

 

Further the Sox could then contend that they believed that inserting language into the agreement that would take effect should the condition force Napoli to the sidelines was a better way to go than lowering the value of the contract either by changing the term of the $$ per annum. That does sound like a reasonable argument to me. Still and all at the point of having conducted a medical on Napoli it still might have been better to go back and negotiate the term and/or the per annum.

 

I just think that for some ballplayers, the kind of thing they did with Lackey might be tough to swallow. For example I would bet Napoli figured he would be able to generate some attractive numbers playing in Fenway and that he could use those numbers in his next contract negotiation. Giving the Sox time at the end of this deal to compensate for injury time apparently was not to appealing to him.

 

Who knows where they are at this point. As I said earlier, I would not be surprised if Napoli is sort of nonplussed by the whole thing.

[jacksonianmarch]

This kind of garbage with Napoli is going to make Boston an unattractive destination for free agents. This is now time #4 where the physical hasnt been bad enough to trash the contract but was concerning enough to where they decided to go back to the negotiating table. That either means the guys arent failing their physicals or the sox are using the physical as a negotiating tool after a contract has been agreed to. Traditionally, it has been, you fail the physical and the deal is null and void. The cat and mouse s*** about partially failing a physical but not really then bullying the player into a more team friendly deal will kill their reputation. Funny how they select which guys to do this to. AdGon had a messed up shoulder, but nothing was in that contract. Crawford has a wrist issue that wasnt addressed in his contract either.

[Lord Snow]

Evidently the Sox are trying to get Napoli's contract down to a 2-year deal.

 

If that's the case I think it's a good signing by the Sox. I'd be happy with him at 2-years $26-28M. It looks a lot better than 3-years $39M.

 

If only they offered that kind of contract to Victorino.

 

The Victorino deal is reminding me a lot of Julio Lugo deal. Offering a guy a long-term contract who is in decline, when he was in decline the season before he was signed, and then we spend the next years counting down to when the contract expires.

[Lord Snow]

This kind of garbage with Napoli is going to make Boston an unattractive destination for free agents. This is now time #4 where the physical hasnt been bad enough to trash the contract but was concerning enough to where they decided to go back to the negotiating table. That either means the guys arent failing their physicals or the sox are using the physical as a negotiating tool after a contract has been agreed to. Traditionally, it has been, you fail the physical and the deal is null and void. The cat and mouse s*** about partially failing a physical but not really then bullying the player into a more team friendly deal will kill their reputation. Funny how they select which guys to do this to. AdGon had a messed up shoulder, but nothing was in that contract. Crawford has a wrist issue that wasnt addressed in his contract either.

 

We are already a poor destination. On paper the Yankees, Blue Jays, and Rays all look better than us and that's just in our division, forget about the rest of the league.

[Palodios]

This kind of garbage with Napoli is going to make Boston an unattractive destination for free agents. This is now time #4 where the physical hasnt been bad enough to trash the contract but was concerning enough to where they decided to go back to the negotiating table. That either means the guys arent failing their physicals or the sox are using the physical as a negotiating tool after a contract has been agreed to. Traditionally, it has been, you fail the physical and the deal is null and void. The cat and mouse s*** about partially failing a physical but not really then bullying the player into a more team friendly deal will kill their reputation. Funny how they select which guys to do this to. AdGon had a messed up shoulder, but nothing was in that contract. Crawford has a wrist issue that wasnt addressed in his contract either.

 

Crawford's wrist WAS a problem. Agon's shoulder WAS a problem. I'm not sure how learning from their mistakes is such an issue.

[jung]

Well I don't think it is as cut and dried as "the Red Sox are dirt bags who can't be trusted". Seems to me that JD Drew is the guy that has made the Sox more mindful of these situations by dancing around the language in his contract all the way up until the last year when it did not matter.

 

So in response, the Sox decide that in certain situations where justified, they are going to tighten up the language in the agreement so that at least if there is going to be dancing they are going to call the tune. Appears to me that had JD dealt with the issues honestly the Sox probably would not be here today.

 

I do think the game has been mightily corrupted by the amount of money being flung around. The players all want their piece of the pie and maybe are getting a bit huffy at efforts by a team that is willing to pay the money but is just not willing to be dragged over the coals at the same time. These guys all want their money regardless of anything including s***** performance (see ARoid).

 

Teams can't do a damn thing about s***** performance but they can and likely should make an effort to protect themselves from some of the ******** we see regularly now including:

-what is likely rampant PED use

- insistance by players that they not return from injury until they are 100% and in some cases seemingly 110%

- what appears in some cases to be players making decisions about how they will play, how they will hit for example because it suits their efforts to generate numbers they can use in their next contract negotiation.

 

I don't really know where this great game is going. However I do think money issues are making it more and more difficult for fans/owners/players to see eye to eye.

 

I actually don't wonder if the next CBA could be a hum dinger. The owners have basically been skirting some issues that really are at the heart of the matter cause they have been unwilling to take them head on with all of these fat TV deals sitting right in front of them. Will the next CBA be the one where they feel like they can no longer just skirt around the edges of some very real concerns? I don't know. However I have to believe a whole bunch of this s*** is going to come to a head at some point.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Crawford's wrist WAS a problem. Agon's shoulder WAS a problem. I'm not sure how learning from their mistakes is such an issue.

 

Not to mention the language in Lackeys contract gave them an extra year at league min salary.

 

It's not a negotiating tool. It's a way to protect the team from lost seasons.

 

Perhaps the Yankees should have done this on ARod's contract.

[jacksonianmarch]

Crawford's wrist WAS a problem. Agon's shoulder WAS a problem. I'm not sure how learning from their mistakes is such an issue.

 

They wrote it into the contracts of Lackey and Drew and tried to do the same bully method with Bay. Why wouldnt they continue that with AdGon and Crawford? Because those guys were the flashy signings that allowed them to market their new look team. Nobody gets excited about a fat, injury prone catcher. So they know that their only value they are gonna get is on the field and hence they can bully that player into a contract

[Lord Snow]

A team should shake up all these guaranteed contracts.

 

Start giving guys like a $5 million base contract with the ability to earn $30M in performance bonuses. You'd overpay some guys but at least you wouldn't get burned by injuries and guys, like Crawford, who suck after the ink on their contract drys.

 

I'd much rather pay an MVP candidate $35M than see Crawford get $20M for doing f--k all.

[jacksonianmarch]

Not to mention the language in Lackeys contract gave them an extra year at league min salary.

 

It's not a negotiating tool. It's a way to protect the team from lost seasons.

 

Perhaps the Yankees should have done this on ARod's contract.

 

I dont doubt that it benefits the team in the short term, but it will make free agents think twice about signing and will definitely make a player ask for more out of the sox in the process. It's a short term gain, long term loss kind of process

[jacksonianmarch]

A team should shake up all these guaranteed contracts.

 

Start giving guys like a $5 million base contract with the ability to earn $30M in performance bonuses. You'd overpay some guys but at least you wouldn't get burned by injuries and guys, like Crawford, who suck after the ink on their contract drys.

 

I'd much rather pay an MVP candidate $35M than see Crawford get $20M for doing f--k all.

 

The method for which the contracts are vetted disallows that kind of contract from being a reality. You cannot stake a contract to anything more than MVP voting, CY voting, milestones, and games played. I do not believe you can give a guy a large incentive for hitting over a certain percentage

[Palodios]

They wrote it into the contracts of Lackey and Drew and tried to do the same bully method with Bay. Why wouldnt they continue that with AdGon and Crawford? Because those guys were the flashy signings that allowed them to market their new look team. Nobody gets excited about a fat, injury prone catcher. So they know that their only value they are gonna get is on the field and hence they can bully that player into a contract

 

MLB players being bullied? Pure s***. The majority of them get one little owie, and make millions of dollars doing nothing. There is nothing wrong with the Red Sox wanting to get what they paid for.

[Lord Snow]

The method for which the contracts are vetted disallows that kind of contract from being a reality. You cannot stake a contract to anything more than MVP voting, CY voting, milestones, and games played. I do not believe you can give a guy a large incentive for hitting over a certain percentage

 

I don't mean to stake a contract on awards. But obviously if you're getting MVP consideration you had a pretty darn good year.

 

I think I tiered system of something like .300+/.400+/.600+/1.000 with 150 games started = $30M bonus

.900+ OPS with 150 games started = $25M bonus

And so on...

different for every person but you get the point.

 

Edit: I think players with big egos would go for deals where they thought they could make $200M (with maybe $40-60M guaranteed) for the lifetime of a contract in favor of $120M guaranteed.

[jacksonianmarch]

MLB players being bullied? Pure s***. The majority of them get one little owie, and make millions of dollars doing nothing. There is nothing wrong with the Red Sox wanting to get what they paid for.

 

You arent really seeing my point. The sox are the only team doing this. They are going to get blackballed in the process unless they vastly overpay. Think about it, the market for Napoli is mostly gone, those teams in the running moved on. Now, he goes back into a depressed market all because he didnt fail a physical, but may have had an issue that would otherwise be overlooked. If Napoli goes back out into the market and has to sign for less than 3 yrs $39 mil the players union will file a grievance and I am sure there will be a backlash

[Palodios]

The method for which the contracts are vetted disallows that kind of contract from being a reality. You cannot stake a contract to anything more than MVP voting, CY voting, milestones, and games played. I do not believe you can give a guy a large incentive for hitting over a certain percentage

 

So could you give 5 million for an allstar game, 10 million for MVP/CY, and more for HR milestones? There is probably some way to swing it.

[jacksonianmarch]

So could you give 5 million for an allstar game, 10 million for MVP/CY, and more for HR milestones? There is probably some way to swing it.

 

I am sure you could, but the sox tried that with Schilling and got a big F-U from the commissioners office. HR milestones need to be career numbers, so unless the sox mark off 30HR per season per contract in someone's career total, it won't work.

[Palodios]

You arent really seeing my point. The sox are the only team doing this. They are going to get blackballed in the process unless they vastly overpay. Think about it, the market for Napoli is mostly gone, those teams in the running moved on. Now, he goes back into a depressed market all because he didnt fail a physical, but may have had an issue that would otherwise be overlooked. If Napoli goes back out into the market and has to sign for less than 3 yrs $39 mil the players union will file a grievance and I am sure there will be a backlash

 

The contract was agreed upon pending a physical. He failed the physical. However, they're trying to work around it. Maybe its annoying for Napoli, but I seriously doubt they manage to decrease the number of years on the contract-- maybe an option to void a year with games missed, but if a player goes into a contract assuming they're going to miss a significant number of games, they're the ones being dishonest in the negotiations.

[jacksonianmarch]

If he failed the physical, then he'd be back on the market. They arent "failing" physicals here. They are finding potentially chronic problems that arent acute and trying to leverage the player. It's like doing an MRI on any pitcher and seeing some wear and tear of the shoulder and then leveraging that player. Even though every pitcher will have some wear and tear in their shoulder.

[jung]

And the Steinbrenners overruled their GM on ARod out of their goodness of the hearts....right....or was it because they saw ARod as a marketing draw and took on that idiot contract because they saw it as an opportunity.

 

We don't have any idea why the Sox did not insert language into the Crawford or AGons deals. In the case of Agons....who knows....maybe they view a player that has already had his surgical repair differently than one that is heading into heavy waters. They might have seen Crawford's wrist as nothing more than a nuisance since he had been getting shots for it apparently for years without effecting his play. I am not arguing that it wasn't wrong headed in the case of either Agons or Crawford. I think it was. However I can see how they could rationalize it.

 

I think one thing we as fans totally miss is that all of these guys are carrying around some sort of injury or damage. None of them escape...it is a fantasy to believe any of them escape the wear and tear of being a pro athlete.

 

Merloni was on the air today talking about Drew's ankle. In describing his own ankle problem he said that while making a throw, he literally turned his leg out of his ankle. Think about that for a minute. So he had just worn that thing down so far that in just making that throw he turned hie leg right out of his ankle! When Jeter went down in October, it simply looked like he had turned something. Instead the ankle was broken, shattered really. That was a nothing play. Jeter had simply stressed the joint to such a degree via abuse over time that just landing on it wrong shattered the thing. Think about how much that joint must have been worn down and how brittle to have just shattered like that.

 

I am not looking for sympathy for the players. They go into this with their eyes open and I suspect they know more about the risks they take than we will ever know. I do think it is the fans that remain wearing their rose tinted glasses and really have no idea how few "healthy" ballplayers there are running around out there. I think the teams know though. With the amount of money in play now I suspect we will see more and more teams trying to flesh through these issues with player and we may possibly see modifications in the next CBA aimed at addressing some of them.

[NZSox]

Don't worry all, my daily tweet of "SIGN DA TING, NAP!" will get it done. You're all welcome.

[jung]

There must be something that has come out via Napoli's medical exam that has the Sox worried. Look worse case they are saying to Napoli that they think the risk of him losing considerable time via that hip is great. We are willing to pay you. We are willing to sign you. We are just not willing to lose the time that we are buying based on your condition. They are simply asking Napoli to make good on the time. I can see why he might be balky but I can also see where the Sox are coming from. Unfortunately you cannot conduct a medical on a player until there is an agreement in principle. It should not be a surprise that teams are seeking some solution besides killing the deal. If Napoli was not willing to stick around for this he could just walk away entirely at this point. He seems not to have done that as yet. So I guess he is not totally "insulted" yet to refresh a term from last year.

 

I do think this is an issue that will not get by the next CBA and I believe we will see modification there that will govern the options that teams and players have. Frankly I think this is more an issue of the players wanting to have their cake and eat it too and teams having few tools available to them to simply get what they are paying for. However it is getting messy. Hence I think we will see things done in the CBA.