John Lackey to undergo Tommy John surgery

[Laser Show]

Good luck finding one of those.

 

There's plenty out there. This year alone, 12 pitchers tossed more than 225, with another half-dozen or so within 5. We need to trade some of this offense for an ace.

[mvp 78]

Going from sloppy mess Lackey to straight edge CJ Wilson would be an interesting turn of events. (not that I'd want him in Boston)

[Trillz808]

I wouldn't be opposed to the notion or Pedro coming back for one last go round. Sign him cheap with incentives. Let him get in shape for ST and let's see what he's got.

 

if this was 2 years ago when he had success in philly and they didnt pick him up in the offseason i would be all for it but he hasnt pitched for 2 seasons now not too sure i would want him back in our rotation... maybe out of the pen like a long relief kind of a role lol

[jung]

Bedard as the #5 sounds reasonable. I just stand by my thinking that we NEED a #1 that can pitch 225 quality innings.

Presuming they successfully sign Paps, then that takes care of the Bard decision as closer and unless somebody takes him in free agency Bard maybe goes to the Lackey role, Bedard goes to the Wake role.

 

I agree with your contention that as good as the big 3 are, none of them distinguished themselves as a number 1. However I am equally convinced that Lester should have moved past Beckett and been good enough to be the stopper of the SP. Given the sparsity of SP talent in the 2012 pool, it might make sense to take a buy low gamble on somebody and try to help Lester actually do in 2012 what was expected of him in 2011. From a talent perspective, having Becket, Lester and Buchholz as the core cannot be a negative putting the attitude issues aside.

[a700hitter]

if this was 2 years ago when he had success in philly and they didnt pick him up in the offseason i would be all for it but he hasnt pitched for 2 seasons now not too sure i would want him back in our rotation... maybe out of the pen like a long relief kind of a role lol

It couldn't hurt to see what he has left like the Yanks did last season with Colon. I am not recommending building a staff around him.

[a700hitter]

Does anyone know if we have any insurance on this chump?

[mvp 78]

It couldn't hurt to see what he has left like the Yanks did last season with Colon. I am not recommending building a staff around him.

 

Would never happen. He's my second favorite player of all time, but I hope he stays home and spends the rest of his life under that mango tree.

[Trillz808]

It couldn't hurt to see what he has left like the Yanks did last season with Colon. I am not recommending building a staff around him.

 

true it couldnt hurt to see if he still has any gas left in the tank especially with a incentive based contract and then we could do the right thing and let him retire as a sox lol which would be all time other then that

 

Bedard i still dont see as a quality starter in the majors anymore every other game he either got knocked around in the first inning or he complained about some crap ass injury. i didnt understand for the life of me why theo traded for him when his start right prior to the trade showed no signs of being a decent pitcher

 

Id go with Aceves as our 5th

 

I also dont think someone who pitches for 2 innings a game and loses his mechanics in pitching is anywhere near being our next closer or a starter for that matter its one thing to blow a game when you are a solid closer like pap but when ur the next in line and your already blowing games i dont like the sound of that

[a700hitter]

Would never happen. He's my second favorite player of all time' date=' but I hope he stays home and spends the rest of his life under that mango tree.[/quote']He'd have to have the fire in the belly. I'd never want to see him be ordinary.

[a700hitter]

true it couldnt hurt to see if he still has any gas left in the tank especially with a incentive based contract and then we could do the right thing and let him retire as a sox lol which would be all time other then that

 

Bedard i still dont see as a quality starter in the majors anymore every other game he either got knocked around in the first inning or he complained about some crap ass injury. i didnt understand for the life of me why theo traded for him when his start right prior to the trade showed no signs of being a decent pitcher

 

Id go with Aceves as our 5th

 

I also dont think someone who pitches for 2 innings a game and loses his mechanics in pitching is anywhere near being our next closer or a starter for that matter its one thing to blow a game when you are a solid closer like pap but when ur the next in line and your already blowing games i dont like the sound of that

I am not big on Bedard. I'm tired of fragile players that miss substantial chunks of time.

 

Speaking of fragile, can we finally get a RF who can play every day.

[mvp 78]

He'd have to have the fire in the belly. I'd never want to see him be ordinary.

 

Would he be better than 2011 Lackey? Sure, but at this point I'd rather not tarnish my memories of him. As a grown man, his final press conference as a Red Sox made me feel far too emo.

[Trillz808]

Speaking of fragile' date=' can we finally get a RF who can play every day.[/quote']

 

Right before the trade deadline i figured theo would have given up on a low priced SP in search for a RF like Hunter Pence who i would have loved to sign for an everyday RF but NOOOOOOO he wanted Bedard we could have traded for Edwin Jackson that would have made more sense anything aside from Bedard lol

[Dojji]

Presuming they successfully sign Paps, then that takes care of the Bard decision as closer and unless somebody takes him in free agency Bard maybe goes to the Lackey role, Bedard goes to the Wake role.

 

I agree with your contention that as good as the big 3 are, none of them distinguished themselves as a number 1. However I am equally convinced that Lester should have moved past Beckett and been good enough to be the stopper of the SP. Given the sparsity of SP talent in the 2012 pool, it might make sense to take a buy low gamble on somebody and try to help Lester actually do in 2012 what was expected of him in 2011. From a talent perspective, having Becket, Lester and Buchholz as the core cannot be a negative putting the attitude issues aside.

 

No idea why people insist that Bard is a potential starter. He burnt that bridge in 07.

 

Daniel Bard has NEVER been even a REMOTELY successful professional starting pitcher.

 

The man is a relief pitcher. A good one, September hiccup notwithstanding. But definitely a reliever.

[Trillz808]

Looking on fangraphs at the stats for Andrew Miller... he would have been a more suitable 5th starter down the stretch than Bedard did for us... Tito gave so much confidence in his old beat down horses and never gave a chance for the young kids to step it up and prove they could hang with the big boys this is just my opinion anyone else know reasoning for not sticking with A Miller?

[Trillz808]

Daniel Bard has NEVER been even a REMOTELY successful professional starting pitcher.

 

The man is a relief pitcher. A good one, September hiccup notwithstanding. But definitely a reliever.

 

A good Relief pitcher who needs at least one more year to figure out if he will ever be a legitimate closer or if he will always be JUST a set up man... i personally would prefer him to figure his s*** out and be able to step up to the plate when we need him most because I believe he can do it

[Palodios]

Remember when Gammons mentioned this last June? Why didn't he have the surgery sooner?!

 

Whatever happens, keep him the hell away from the clubhouse.

[Laser Show]

Looking on fangraphs at the stats for Andrew Miller... he would have been a more suitable 5th starter down the stretch than Bedard did for us... Tito gave so much confidence in his old beat down horses and never gave a chance for the young kids to step it up and prove they could hang with the big boys this is just my opinion anyone else know reasoning for not sticking with A Miller?

 

His 5.54 ERA and 1.82 WHIP

[Trillz808]

Really wish we never traded away Justin Masterson then we would have a solid 4

 

Lester

Beckett

Buchholz

Masterson

 

doesnt that sound good.... and its no longer possible all for one year of service for victor martinez...

[a700hitter]

Remember when Gammons mentioned this last June? Why didn't he have the surgery sooner?!

 

Whatever happens, keep him the hell away from the clubhouse.

Send the lite beer directly to the hospital and rehab facility.

[jung]

I would be OK with Aceves instead of Bard. The point is they need to replace something like 300 innings at the back end of the rotation and Aceves might be fine there. Hopefully whatever buy low gamble they take at SP eats some of these innings.

 

I suspect that if they are both still there and Pap has the closer job the Sox will try to prepare both Aceves and Bard for more innings and ultimately decide which one gets a back end starting role there.

[Laser Show]

Really wish we never traded away Justin Masterson then we would have a solid 4

 

Lester

Beckett

Buchholz

Masterson

 

doesnt that sound good.... and its no longer possible all for one year of service for victor martinez...

 

Masterson has that ace potential. We should've kept him.

[La Munson]

Remember when Gammons mentioned this last June? Why didn't he have the surgery sooner?!

 

Whatever happens, keep him the hell away from the clubhouse.

 

And the genius of Gammons continues to show: He was the first to talk about the disagreements between Epstein and Francona, and now how Lackey needs Tommy John Surgery.

 

And Lackey seems a bit like a "I can pitch without the damn surgery!" stubborn kind of guy, that is most defiantly the reason.

[Trillz808]

His 5.54 ERA and 1.82 WHIP

 

is comparable to Bedards 4.03 and 1.55

and Lackeys 6.41 and 1.61

 

Andrew miller had the energy and drive as a younger kid to prove himself in the 17 games he played to at least turn it around and have better numbers EB and JL jus continued to slump

[a700hitter]

Maybe a plastic surgeon can install a face cap over his ugly mug while he is under anesthesia for his TJ surgery.

[Trillz808]

Cancel his TJ Surgery just force his ass to retire already lol

[wyo-sox]

I thought Bedard looked ok. Good enough to be a solid 4 or 5 guy if he is healthy. Seems like his first start for us in Minnesota the ump called half his strikes as balls. Then for most of his starts he got pretty poor run support with the sox. His last start was bad- and was that the one his ex had Jim served papers right before the game? As far as him not going deeper games- how much of that was managerial decisions in the hopes he would go deeper and more often in the post season.

 

Overall his attitude seems good, his control looked good to me, his lifetime era is decent and consistent- and he's cheap.

 

I guess to me it comes down to his health assessment. Could someone that understands and knows numbers / stats better then I explain what is right and wrong with my thinking?

[Trillz808]

Mark Buehrle CWS

Bruce Chen KC

Aaron Cook COL *

Kyle Davies TOR

Ryan Dempster CHC *

Justin Duchscherer OAK

Zach Duke ARI *

Jeff Francis KC

Freddy Garcia NYY

Jon Garland LAD

Aaron Harang SD

Rich Harden OAK

Livan Hernandez WAS

Edwin Jackson STL

Kenshin Kawakami ATL

Scott Kazmir LAA

Hiroki Kuroda LAD

Rodrigo Lopez CHC

Paul Maholm PIT

John Maine COL

Jason Marquis WAS

Kevin Millwood NYY

Scott Olsen PIT *

Roy Oswalt PHI *

Brad Penny DET

Oliver Perez NYM

Joel Pineiro LAA

CC Sabathia NYY (may opt out)

Carlos Silva NYY

Javier Vazquez FLA

Adam Wainwright STL *

Tim Wakefield BOS

Chien-Ming Wang WAS

Brandon Webb ARI

C.J. Wilson TEX

Chris Young NYM

 

* have club options for the upcoming year

i think Buehrle would be a nice addition to our starting rotation

[Trillz808]

I thought Bedard looked ok. Good enough to be a solid 4 or 5 guy if he is healthy. Seems like his first start for us in Minnesota the ump called half his strikes as balls. Then for most of his starts he got pretty poor run support with the sox.

 

I figured that was what Theo and Tito thought as well a good 5th starter... but as far as run support goes... Sox offense was so hot and cold this season it was disgusting, games where we would be getting shut out when a week prior we would be scoring 15 runs, just didnt make sense to me but with run support you could argue Wake didnt get it as much either nor did he get pulled in the right inning from tito if you ask me their were games he should have notched his 200 win and been done with that chase but the games were being called like s*** the one pitcher who seemed to me to always have run support even though at times he didnt need it was andrew miller

 

regardless of our offensive production in support for our lack their of starting pitching we still need a 5th starter that can get out of the 4th without being down a s*** load on the boards

[User Name]

Masterson has that ace potential.

 

I disagree with this. He's always had trouble retiring lefties, and last year was no exception. His season was very flukey. Trading him still looks like a mistake though.

[User Name]

Mark Buehrle CWS

Bruce Chen KC

Aaron Cook COL *

Kyle Davies TOR

Ryan Dempster CHC *

Justin Duchscherer OAK

Zach Duke ARI *

Jeff Francis KC

Freddy Garcia NYY

Jon Garland LAD

Aaron Harang SD

Rich Harden OAK

Livan Hernandez WAS

Edwin Jackson STL

Kenshin Kawakami ATL

Scott Kazmir LAA

Hiroki Kuroda LAD

Rodrigo Lopez CHC

Paul Maholm PIT

John Maine COL

Jason Marquis WAS

Kevin Millwood NYY

Scott Olsen PIT *

Roy Oswalt PHI *

Brad Penny DET

Oliver Perez NYM

Joel Pineiro LAA

CC Sabathia NYY (may opt out)

Carlos Silva NYY

Javier Vazquez FLA

Adam Wainwright STL *

Tim Wakefield BOS

Chien-Ming Wang WAS

Brandon Webb ARI

C.J. Wilson TEX

Chris Young NYM

 

* have club options for the upcoming year

i think Buehrle would be a nice addition to our starting rotation

 

Interesting pitchers bolded. Thoughts?