Free Agent SS??

[Spudboy]

gotta put Nick Green on that list -- I'd prefer him to most of the players on it.

 

At least Green is an above average defender and put up a career average year offensively last year.

 

s***.

 

I agree with Dojji for the third time this week.

[riverside sluggers]

Tejada's defensive skills have really declined. This past season in Houston he was looking like Rent a-wreck in 2005. At this stage, some scouts say he's better off being plugged at 3rd base

 

This free agent market is just weak all around. Well except relief pitchers, good crop of them

[SCM33]

My guess is Theo is gonna see if he can acquire the bat he's looking for (Ex. Holliday, Gonzalez, Cabrera) and that will determine whether he'll need to fill the SS position with someone who can only field or someone who needs to be able to field and hit.

 

And BTW Mino, don't butcher names as bad as Scuatura and expect people who consider your opinion seriously.

 

We already had that option. Alex Gonzalez. It seems that once again, the FO dropped the ball on SS, and we will enter yet another year with a s***** SS>

[a700hitter]

We already had that option. Alex Gonzalez. It seems that once again' date=' the FO dropped the ball on SS, and we will enter yet another year with a s***** SS>[/quote']Will this be another year of Nick Green and Lowrie (and his MASH unit)

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

The team has no starting SS' date=' its something to worry about. Scuatura is a bust waiting to happen and I pray we don't go in that direction.[/quote']

Who gives a s***? We've won ~95 games each of the past three years with Julio Lugo, Nick Green, Jed Lowrie, and Alex Gonzalez for a brief time last year. Since we won the WS in 2007 and came within one game of making it back in 2008, I get the feeling that you can overcome having a crap shortstop.

[Keeper]

Yes, the Sox have proven they can overcome mediocrity at SS, but it's still a position you'd like to stabilize. And it should be a priority for the FO. Not the number one priority, mind you, but it should be up there.

[Dipre]

We already had that option. Alex Gonzalez. It seems that once again' date=' the FO dropped the ball on SS, and we will enter yet another year with a s***** SS>[/quote']

 

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

 

No matter what the rose-glassed uber-FO defenders say (Not directed at you bosox), the FO dropped the ball on this one big time.

 

The consensus seems to be that "He wasn't that good", but SS is a defense-first position, and defense is what Gonzo provided since arriving here.

[BSN07]

Tejada's defensive skills have really declined. This past season in Houston he was looking like Rent a-wreck in 2005. At this stage, some scouts say he's better off being plugged at 3rd base

 

This free agent market is just weak all around. Well except relief pitchers, good crop of them

Holy s*** RS your here! How the Hell are you? Have you been away or just lurking and not posting much? Nice to see you back.

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

 

No matter what the rose-glassed uber-FO defenders say (Not directed at you bosox), the FO dropped the ball on this one big time.

 

The consensus seems to be that "He wasn't that good", but SS is a defense-first position, and defense is what Gonzo provided since arriving here.

 

Oh yes I agree 100%. The first thing that the FO should have done was sign Agon. Then they could have looked around for an upgrade. It would have helped there leverage in trade talks, and would have given them a tolerable fall back plan.

 

Overall I really like what Theo and company have done with the Sox. But SS is the absolute and obvious Achilles heel of this regime. They have really just F'd the dog consistently with regards to the position. So far they have dropped the ball te\wice this off season IMO when it comes to SS. 1st with Hardy(considering what it cost to get him in the end, the Red Sox could and should have matched or beat the offer very easily). Now with Agon. I hope they have something in the works, but considering past history I'm not holding my breath

[jacksonianmarch]

Everyone says you need defense up the middle. C-SS-2B-CF. You need to have most of those positions solidified. The fact that the sox have gotten by with a terrible SS is more of an exception rather than the rule.

[riverside sluggers]

Holy s*** RS your here! How the Hell are you? Have you been away or just lurking and not posting much? Nice to see you back.

 

Heyy yeah Ive just been working a lot, and personal s*** that I have had to deal with. Hopefully 2010 turns out to be a better year. Thanks always good to hear compliments like that.

 

And I agree, the Sox shouldve activated A-Gon's option or rip it up and make a deal similar to Toronto's. Instead they said "well you just be patient as we look at other options." I dont blame him for bolting to Toronto. They already spurned him once before, his stellar defensive campaign (Jeter got gold glove over him??) and went for Lugo because "we needed more offense from the position"

[Sox Fan on Cape]

Riverside, glad to see you back. You've been missed.

[TheMino007]

SS is a position you need stability at. When the Sox won in 07, even though Lugo was terrible, at least we knew he was going to be out there everyday. Know we have no idea who will be thrown out there. You can put out the bust waiting to happen in Scutaro, or go with a platoon of whomever. I'd would really much rather have a set guy out there who can play the position day in and day out instead of this platoon crap. Pitchers can focus more clearly when they don't have to worry about shotty defense behind them. That is why Gonzo was the answer.

[Tyler Durden]

Marco Scutaro seems like the best option for the Soxs

[Tyler Durden]

SS is a position you need stability at. When the Sox won in 07' date=' even though Lugo was terrible, at least we knew he was going to be out there everyday. Know we have no idea who will be thrown out there. You can put out the bust waiting to happen in Scutaro, or go with a platoon of whomever. I'd would really much rather have a set guy out there who can play the position day in and day out instead of this platoon crap. Pitchers can focus more clearly when they don't have to worry about shotty defense behind them. That is why Gonzo was the answer.[/quote']

 

Lugo had very little to do with the Sox's championship in 2007.

[Dipre]

Lugo had very little to do with the Sox's championship in 2007.

 

Which is exactly what he said in his post.

 

What is your point?

[Tyler Durden]

Which is exactly what he said in his post.

 

What is your point?

 

Sox could of had Nick Green, Lugo, and Cody Ransom playing at shortstop in 2007 and they would of still won the World Series, stability had nothing to do with it.

[Dipre]

Sox could of had Nick Green' date=' Lugo, and Cody Ransom playing at shortstop in 2007 and they would of still won the World Series, stability had nothing to do with it.[/quote']

 

Jesus Christ.

[BSN07]

Marco Scutaro seems like the best option for the Soxs

 

Have you suffered head trauma lately?

 

Scutaro may be the best SS available. But his contract requirements quickly move him down the list. If he will go one year with an option then maybe. But if he wants 3 years like is being said, pass.

[Tyler Durden]

Jesus Christ.

 

Even he's laughing at how dumb you are

[Dipre]

Even he's laugh at how dumb you are

 

I'm pretty sure, unlike you, he can conjugate verbs in the past sense.

 

Extra chromosomes FTW!

[Dojji]

Green > Scutaro. Scutaro's bat isn't enough to make up for Green's significant defensive advantage.

[Dipre]

Green > Scutaro. Scutaro's bat isn't enough to make up for Green's significant defensive advantage.

 

Listen, i'll agree with you that i want no part of Scutaro, but that's no reason to state such obvious fallacies.

 

Nick Green's time at SS last year is not enough of a sample size to come up with such a conclusion when compared to Scutaro's. Please stick to the facts.

 

Scutaro: 415 games at SS. Last year's sample size was 143 games.

 

Green: 104 games at SS. Last year's sample size was 81 games.

 

Anyone can look good over a half-season of baseball, Green over Scutaro makes sense from a financial standpoint, but advocating his defensive superiority is an exercise in futility since Green simply doesn't have the range to stick at SS as a regular.

[Dojji]

Nick Green has a career-positive range rating at shortstop. His problem is his hands, not his range or athleticism.

 

Green got pigeonholed as a 2B because he first broke in there while playing on the same team as Rafael Furcal and then again with the Rays while Julio Lugo was still at least not so totally awful that you would play a Glovey McNoodlebat shortstop ahead of him. Everytime he's gotten a chance to play SS he's looked good there.

 

Small sample sizes are prone to distortions, but they aren't useless. I'll take Nick Green's 100 games of 12.1 UZR/150 on a low-cost flier over Scutaro's -2.9 in a much bigger sample plus the contract and loss of a draft pick. Even if Green regresses by a lot, he's still a better option for the price.

[Cocos Disciples]

Scutaro's not a bad defensive shortstop. Green may be better, but he's also awful offensively. I'm not thrilled about Scutaro but I'd easily take him over Green.

[Dipre]

Nick Green has a career-positive range rating at shortstop. His problem is his hands' date=' not his range or athleticism.[/quote']

 

Even though it's positive, it's hardly impressive.

 

Look, he converts everything he gets to into outs, and i hate to sound Gommish, but i saw him play SS most of the games he played last year. His lateral range leaves a lot to be desired, that's why you need to combine defensive metrics and actually seeing the ballplayers take the field to come up with accurate opinions on their abilities.

[Dipre]

Scutaro's not a bad defensive shortstop. Green may be better' date=' but he's also awful offensively. I'm not thrilled about Scutaro but I'd easily take him over Green.[/quote']

 

The problem is the following:

 

Defensively:

 

Green might be a bit better than Scutaro.

 

Offensively:

 

Scutaro is absolutely better than Green.

[Cocos Disciples]

The problem is the following:

 

Defensively:

 

Green might be a bit better than Scutaro.

 

Offensively:

 

Scutaro is absolutely better than Green.

 

I concur.

 

At this point I'd be surprised if Scutaro isn't the SS this season.

[Dojji]

Sure, he's better than Green, but don't kid yourself into thinking that that means Scutaro's actually good.

 

Scutaro has a .721 career OPS

Green has a .660 OPS

 

How much is that extra .061 really worth? Is it worth a first round pick?

[Dipre]

People might want to shoot me for this, but i'd much rather have Tejada and a Glovey McnoodleBat on one-year deals.

 

Tejada, contrary to popular belief, was a pretty good SS as soon as 2008, and i got to see a lot of him because he's "Captain Dominican" so we get a lot of Astros games, usually when Wandy Rodriguez pitches, or they face up against a Dominican SP.

 

2008 Tejada defensive metrics:

 

UZR: 9.3

 

UZR/150: 9.4

 

RF/G: 4.0

 

RF/9: 4.2.

 

2009 Tejada defensive metrics:

 

UZR: -13.9

 

UZR/150: -12.4

 

RF/G: 4.4

 

RF/9: 4.5

 

His range factor ratings actually improved in 2009, so a number of factors might have to do with his UZR decline, but the fact is, Tejada's defense is not what he showed in 2008 or 2009 but something in between, right around league average, and not a statue like some "Educated guessers" would lead you to believe.

[Dipre]

Sure, he's better than Green, but don't kid yourself into thinking that that means Scutaro's actually good.

 

Scutaro has a .721 career OPS

Green has a .660 OPS

 

How much is that extra .061 really worth? Is it worth a first round pick?

 

Listen' date=' i'll agree with you that i want no part of Scutaro,[/b'] but that's no reason to state such obvious fallacies.

 

Nick Green's time at SS last year is not enough of a sample size to come up with such a conclusion when compared to Scutaro's. Please stick to the facts.

 

Scutaro: 415 games at SS. Last year's sample size was 143 games.

 

Green: 104 games at SS. Last year's sample size was 81 games.

 

Anyone can look good over a half-season of baseball, Green over Scutaro makes sense from a financial standpoint, but advocating his defensive superiority is an exercise in futility since Green simply doesn't have the range to stick at SS as a regular.

 

Thanks.