Manny Ramirez Trade Deadline Thread (renamed)

[jacksonianmarch]

what would the point of dealing Burrell for Manny be? They are right about equal in terms of performance right now, while Burrell is younger and cheaper

[CalvnHobs6]

-The Marlins may be about to make a huge splash, as they seem to be the team in most serious discussions about disgruntled Boston outfielder Manny Ramirez. The deal would be for outfielder Jeremy Hermida and prospects, and would certainly strengthen the one-dimensional Marlins offense for the stretch run. But apparently the fact that Florida and Philadelphia have pursued Ramirez isn't enough to prod Mets ownership into signing off on the run Omar Minaya would like to make at him.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Trading Manny for anything other than top prospects simply isn't worth it.

[User Name]

********. If that's the type of trade we're making, we're getting ripped off. I just want to keep Manny.

 

The only one on the Marlins I'd trade Manny for is Hanley.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

********. If that's the type of trade we're making, we're getting ripped off. I just want to keep Manny.

 

The only one on the Marlins I'd trade Manny for is Hanley.

 

We'll have to call the mob in for help on that one.

 

 

But yes, trading Manny anyway is a bad idea.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

********. If that's the type of trade we're making, we're getting ripped off. I just want to keep Manny.

 

The only one on the Marlins I'd trade Manny for is Hanley.

 

I still believe the idea is to trade Manny for Hermida then turn around and swing Hermida with another prospect for a bat to replace Manny. Thats a lot they need to make happen in a short span....not to mention they are looking for a reliever.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

I still believe the idea is to trade Manny for Hermida then turn around and swing Hermida with another prospect for a bat to replace Manny. Thats a lot they need to make happen in a short span....not to mention they are looking for a reliever.

 

not enough time now for that entire thing to happen, realistically.

[Gom]

I think there is zero chance Manny passes through irrevocable waivers. If I'm the Yankees, if they put him on IW, I claim him in a heartbeat. It's worth nearly every team to put in a claim, you get the rest of the salary but two draft picks. As for regular waivers, I'm not sure.

[ORS]

what would the point of dealing Burrell for Manny be? They are right about equal in terms of performance right now' date=' while Burrell is younger and cheaper[/quote']

Not if the Sox are kicking in $, which is what they are reportedly willing to do here.

 

Burrell's a FA this year too, so it really would be a non-move on the field. My in-laws live up that way, and my father in-law tells me Burrell is not a fan favorite. Call it the JD Drew syndrome, but he's viewed as too dispassionate. With negligible net change on the field, it could be done for PR.

 

Or, supposing they intend to resign Burrell, they let him go, get the picks for Manny, sign Burrell and lose their 1, but they net a 1s.

 

While I agree that it's not likely to happen, finding a reason isn't particularly difficult.

[ORS]

I think there is zero chance Manny passes through irrevocable waivers. If I'm the Yankees' date=' if they put him on IW, I claim him in a heartbeat. It's worth nearly every team to put in a claim, you get the rest of the salary but two draft picks. As for regular waivers, I'm not sure.[/quote']

What makes you think he'd go on irrevocable waivers?

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Not if the Sox are kicking in $, which is what they are reportedly willing to do here.

 

Burrell's a FA this year too, so it really would be a non-move on the field. My in-laws live up that way, and my father in-law tells me Burrell is not a fan favorite. Call it the JD Drew syndrome, but he's viewed as too dispassionate. With negligible net change on the field, it could be done for PR.

 

Or, supposing they intend to resign Burrell, they let him go, get the picks for Manny, sign Burrell and lose their 1, but they net a 1s.

 

While I agree that it's not likely to happen, finding a reason isn't particularly difficult.

 

If Theo is dumb enough to trade Manny, we should at least try and get some quality prospects in return, or abandon the idea altogether. I don't want to trade for a LF who I think is far inferior to Manny (despite what the cold hard stats show over the past year and a half), who also has an expiring contract, and have to bank on signing a Matt Holliday in the offseason.

[ORS]

If Theo is dumb enough to trade Manny' date=' we should at least try and get some quality prospects in return, or abandon the idea altogether. I don't want to trade for a LF who I think is far inferior to Manny (despite what the cold hard stats show over the past year and a half), who also has an expiring contract, and have to bank on signing a Matt Holliday in the offseason.[/quote']

Yeah, I saw your earlier response about getting top prospects and then the subsequent one about not wanting Hermida. Hermida was a top 5 prospect going into his rookie year. Don't know who you have in mind, but just arbitrarily throwing "top" out there means little to us because, for all we know, I mean you did just join today, you could be talking about a guy who spins around in circles real fast.

 

As for comparison's to Burrell, can you let us know just what it is you see that has escaped the many different stats that say something different?

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Yeah' date=' I saw your earlier response about getting top prospects and then the subsequent one about not wanting Hermida. Hermida was a top 5 prospect going into his rookie year. Don't know who you have in mind, but just arbitrarily throwing "top" out there means little to us because, for all we know, I mean you did just join today, you could be talking about a guy who spins around in circles real fast.[/quote']

 

I never said I didn't want Hermida. I just posted my isolated opinion that if we deal Manny, we need to get our money's worth in return.

 

As for comparison's to Burrell, can you let us know just what it is you see that has escaped the many different stats that say something different?

 

It was said Burrell has production equal to Manny over the past year and a half I think? Well Manny was hurt a big chunk of 2007 so I think that's moot. Plus the idea is protecting Ortiz, and Burrell won't do that as well as Manny, for the simple reason that its a mental thing with pitchers and the Ortiz/Ramirez combo. If you're a pitcher on the mound debating whether to pitch around Papi, who scares you more when you look toward the on-deck circle; Manny, or Burrell?

[Gom]

What makes you think he'd go on irrevocable waivers?

I didn't. Just that I was sure he wouldn't be. Ok, let's play armchair GM.

 

He's not traded before the deadline.

You'll obviously put him on waivers.

 

Yankee fans: Do you claim him?

Red Sox fans: Do you let him go or do you pull him back?

 

If I'm the Yankees FO, I claim him...maybe. If you don't claim him, and no one claims him, the Sox deal him, which most likely is in the Yankees short term gain. If you do claim him, the Sox will most likely pull him off waivers and that's actually against our team's best interest.

 

Must say, kinda interesting.

[Beckett95]

Ok, since it now seems like Manny is either going to the Marlins or staying here, i think we should be looking at Hermida and another top prospect (Ryan Tucker or Matt Dominguez?) and Jeff Allison. I dont see anything happening here though.

[CalvnHobs6]

Maybe this deal is closer than we think? Per mlbtraderumors...

Baseball Prospectus' John Perrotto has multiple baseball sources saying the Red Sox are on the verge of sending Ramirez to Florida for three players, including outfielder Mike Stanton.

 

Here's the original quote:

Multipe baseball sources say the Red Sox are on the verge of sending disgrunted left fielder Manny Ramirez to the Marlins in a trade for a package of three players that included low Class A Greensboro outfielder Mike Stanton, an 18-year-old who is hitting .275/.351/.569 with 26 home runs in 96 games.

[Anuj09]

When i first saw Mike Stanton i was like WTF hes old as hell! then i realized it said outfielder haha.

[Beckett95]

Mike Stanton better not be the best person we get in return

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

When i first saw Mike Stanton i was like WTF hes old as hell! then i realized it said outfielder haha.

 

LOL me too.

[Beckett95]

Hermida, Stanton and Allison i'm guessing?

[ORS]

It was said Burrell has production equal to Manny over the past year and a half I think? Well Manny was hurt a big chunk of 2007 so I think that's moot. Plus the idea is protecting Ortiz' date=' and Burrell won't do that as well as Manny, for the simple reason that its a mental thing with pitchers and the Ortiz/Ramirez combo. If you're a pitcher on the mound debating whether to pitch around Papi, who scares you more when you look toward the on-deck circle; Manny, or Burrell?[/quote']

Despite his better health this year, he's still worse than Burrell, according to the stats.

 

Look, pitcher's are careful with Ortiz regardless of who is behind him. Ortiz was the better hitter the last two years, his production did not suffer when Manny missed time, and pitchers aren't just going to groove him one to avoid walking him simply because of who is hitting behind him. Last year, Manny missed time from 8/29 to 9/24. Did anything change?

 

Ortiz on 8/28: .322/.433/.577

Ortiz on 9/25: .321/.437/.600

 

He was better! He needs no protection. He's a great hitter because he's a great hitter.

 

Pat Burrell is no Manny Ramirez from '96-'06, and neither is the guy on the Sox right, but that's who I feel he's being compared to.

[ORS]

I didn't. Just that I was sure he wouldn't be. Ok, let's play armchair GM.

 

He's not traded before the deadline.

You'll obviously put him on waivers.

 

Yankee fans: Do you claim him?

Red Sox fans: Do you let him go or do you pull him back?

 

If I'm the Yankees FO, I claim him...maybe. If you don't claim him, and no one claims him, the Sox deal him, which most likely is in the Yankees short term gain. If you do claim him, the Sox will most likely pull him off waivers and that's actually against our team's best interest.

 

Must say, kinda interesting.

Now you are talking about regular waivers.

 

Irrevocable waivers, what he was placed on in the '03 offseason, is when the team can't recall him if someone claims him. Irrevocable = can't revoke. This is not what they refer to when they talk about waivers and trades after the deadline.

[Gom]

Please be true.

[Beckett95]

Stanton to me looks like a better version of Willy Mo

 

Willy Mo's A stats=.264, .327, .485, .812 with 26 HR and a 5.36 K/BB ratio in 510 AB's

Stantons A stats=.275, .351, .569, .920 with 26 HR and a 3.64 K/BB ratio in 360 AB's

 

both at the same age

[Gom]

Now you are talking about regular waivers.

 

Irrevocable waivers, what he was placed on in the '03 offseason, is when the team can't recall him if someone claims him. Irrevocable = can't revoke. This is not what they refer to when they talk about waivers and trades after the deadline.

I know. This is assuming regular waivers. What would you do?

[Beckett95]

The Red Sox's clubhouse had a twilight zone-like feel to it in the hours leading up to Wednesday's game with the Angels. At around 5:30, the following blurb appeared on the ESPN crawl: "Red Sox engaged in serious conversation to trade Manny Ramirez to the Marlins." At literally that exact time, Ramirez walked past that television with a plate of food in his hand, but didn't see it.

 

About 20 minutes later, Ramirez, obviously aware, or made aware by teammates, said with light-hearted enthusiasm, "Oh yeah, Marlins. Tax free. Stay at home." Then he gave Hideki Okajima's interpreter -- Jeff Yamaguchi -- a mock hug good-bye. Yamaguchi simply smiled and shook his head.

http://trades.mlblogs.com/archives/2008/07/will_manny_go_home.html

[rician blast]

Seems to me a previous Sox trade of an apparently disgruntled superstar worked out pretty damn well, at least in the near term, for the team.

[ORS]

I know. This is assuming regular waivers. What would you do?

Nothing. The meat of who can help the Sox now is off the market. Like you said, they are unlikely to improve in the short-term. If you claim him, they recall him.

[Beckett95]

Jason Bay to the Sox in a three way deal?

 

http://trades.mlblogs.com/archives/2008/07/manny_in_threeway_deal_that_in.html

 

Under this scenario, Ramirez would go to the Marlins, while Jeremy Hermida would go to the Pirates, and Jason Bay would go to the Red Sox

[CalvnHobs6]

From a Marlins message board, the rumor is expanded to 9 players:

BoSox get:

Jason Bay

Jack Wilson

Hector Correa

 

Pirates get:

Jeremy Hermida

Jed Lowrie

Hunter Jones

Jai Miller

 

Marlins get:

Manny Ramirez

John Grabow

6M in cash