Bellhorn04
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Everything posted by Bellhorn04
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I would love to know what some of the front office conversations about this were like. I'm guessing someone raised the possibility of Sale doing exactly what he's doing, and is quietly in "told you so" mode these days...
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You're combining two deals into one.
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Yes I did. I also thought at the time full throttle was a real thing, that the hype about Grissom was well founded, and that there were some big moves yet to come. If I knew at the time the sum total of starter acquisitions would be Giolito, my opinion of this move would have been much different, I believe.
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Actually when I look back at the first part of this thread moon was the one raising the most doubts about this trade. Largely because he was very dubious they would spend the $10 million they saved.
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I said little about this trade at the time because I was waiting to see what other moves were coming. I assumed this meant we would making some significant additions to the rotation. They did tell us they would be. I never dreamed it would only be Giolito. And I said if they signed Giolito I would puke.
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I was ambivalent about trading Price. But I was too much in shock about trading Betts to devote much of my attention to the Price part, honestly. One thing I'll always remember is that Kimmi, who hates bloated contracts more than anyone, didn't understand trading Price. Why? Because we needed the pitching. My guess is she didn't like the Sale trade much either, for the same reason.
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And the Giolito contract only gave the Red Sox one year of control over him. 2025 was a player option (which of course he will exercise now). Which led to early speculation they might trade him at the 2024 deadline if he was doing well. That's how our Red Sox operate these days.
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To me the Johnny Obvious approach to Sale was to keep him and hope for the best. I firmly believe that's what a typical big market team would do in any case like this. The Red Sox seem determined to show they're the filthy rich guys that are gonna do things differently. And it keeps blowing up on them.
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Ignoring all those posts, or giving them the quick scroll and chuckle, is definitely a sensible approach.
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The real question is whether the Red Sox 2023-2024 offseason plan for the rotation made sense as a whole, the plan being to remove Chris Sale and add Lucas Giolito and do nothing else. If you were told before the offseason that was the entirety of the plan, what grade would you give it on a 1 to 10 scale, from terrible to awesome?
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This place could use some moderation from time to time.
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It's not too often I enjoy seeing the Red Sox get burnt on a trade, but I'm enjoying this one, because I think they're getting burned for being too cheap and too clever.
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This team has been fun to watch a lot of the time. Cora is managing well and the players are busting their asses. It's the front office that has f***ed up once again. They are the failures. Because of their failure, we have the prospect of it making sense for the future of the team to sell off. It sucks.
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They're turning the buy or sell thing into an annual ritual.
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These things are all intertwined. Henry and his decisions have a lot to do with being a .500ish team 3 years in a row and being all in a tizzy about whether to buy or sell 3 years in a row.
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They're both baseball talk. Which is better or worse is strictly a matter of personal opinion. Some people are tired of speculating about deadline selloffs for the third year in a row.
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And of course we always cherry pick the examples that suit our bias. There are other starting pitcher signings that are doing well. But yes, every pitcher signing is risky.
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Signing more starting pitching would be "going over for the sake of going over" with these guys, it seems. It's not like it was an actual need or anything. It's not like the one guy they signed was immediately out for the season.
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They reset last year. Oddly enough, it had no impact on this year. Much to everyone's surprise, Kennedy announced to the world in January, with plenty of offseason left, that the payroll would actually be lower this year.
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If you're looking for a Red Sox fan forum that stays mostly positive, Sons of Sam Horn is the place to be.
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I think most of the booing of Red Sox fans these days is directed at the guys who run the team-owners and front office. The team itself has provided a lot of pleasant surprises and good moments. But if the rotation falls apart it's gonna be another ugly finish.
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If the starting pitching continues to unravel, it's yet another case of massive negligence by the Red Sox front office. Not surprisingly there's some chat that other teams have adapted to the changes in pitching approach instituted by Bailey. That's the way this stuff works now. All analytics all the time.
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To be fair, yes, Grissom was a victim of that tragic fire, but he was also involved in the second space mission, and was prominently featured in The Right Stuff, so he's famous for more than just his sad death.
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Also Detroit to the 2012 WS, which they lost to the Giants.
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All our threads eventually become catchall threads.
