Red Sox Getting Selective On A Potential Franklin Arias Trade

[JoeBrady]

44 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

If they aren't trading Arias, fine. DFA Story in the offseason. Trade Masa and eat 50% of salary. Trade Duran for prospects.

C Narvaez

1B Contreras

2B Abrams

SS Arias

3B Durbin

RF Abreu

CF Rafaela

LF Anthony

DH Mead

Bench Monasterio, Seigler, Wong, OF 4 Acquisition

I don't really see a compelling reason to choose Abrams over Mead at 2nd, if it requires trading good prospects and eating half of Yoshida's contract.  It's basically choosing Abrams over Yoshida, paying an extra $9M or so, and losing Eyanson++.  It's an upgrade, but we can get much better upgrades at that cost.

[JoeBrady]

36 minutes ago, Old Red said:

That was Cora, and this is a whole different situation now not just with Tracy, but the ball club itself, and especially how they are playing at the moment. Of course things may look different when Story is ready to come back, but even then I’m not sure how much help Story will be if any.

I agree.  I'm still incredibly PO'd at him for demanding that he speak with the owner of the company because his boss got fired, even though Story was a big part of the reason that his boss was fired.

But even putting that aside, he just didn't play well.  His plate discipline was so bad that I'd fine a pitcher for throwing him any strikes.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Angels just traded for Neto's replacement at shortstop: Arjun Nimmala, MLB's #43 prospect.

Maybe they'll take Boston pitching prospects for Neto...

 

[JoeBrady]

17 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

5:00 is too late TBH. Breslow has shown that he hasn't been able to work under pressure like that. 

I seriously doubt that.

[mvp 78]

5 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Angels just traded for Neto's replacement at shortstop: Arjun Nimmala, MLB's #43 prospect.

Maybe they'll take Boston pitching prospects for Neto...

 

Nimmala isn't ready to play today. They could still hold onto Neto for another year if they wanted to. 

[JoeBrady]

17 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

I don't think the roster works with all three. At least one has to go. 

You can never tell about Duran, but I expect that there will be a market for him.  We could probably go low-end right now and swap Duran for Adell, and Adell would be our #4 OF/platoon DH in 2027.

[Old Red]

6 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

I agree.  I'm still incredibly PO'd at him for demanding that he speak with the owner of the company because his boss got fired, even though Story was a big part of the reason that his boss was fired.

But even putting that aside, he just didn't play well.  His plate discipline was so bad that I'd fine a pitcher for throwing him any strikes.

The only way Story would help the ball club is if he went on one of his hot stretches, but I don’t know if he has it in him especially after a long layoff, and even then his glove would still be a problem.

[mvp 78]

1 minute ago, JoeBrady said:

I seriously doubt that.

Doubt which part? Do you think he did a great job with the Joe Ryan stuff last deadline? Instead of getting players to help down the stretch, he just ended up with Dustin Maye and found himself getting jerked around by the Twins. He was unable to reach out to other teams because of his inexperience. Maybe he'll do better this year. 

[mvp 78]

1 minute ago, JoeBrady said:

You can never tell about Duran, but I expect that there will be a market for him.  We could probably go low-end right now and swap Duran for Adell, and Adell would be our #4 OF/platoon DH in 2027.

I would do that trade in a heartbeat. 

[mvp 78]

1 minute ago, Old Red said:

The only way Story would help the ball club is if he went on one of his hot stretches, but I don’t know if he has it in him especially after a long layoff, and even then his glove would still be a problem.

He'd be passable at 2b. Sox still believe in him at SS for some dumb reason. 

[mvp 78]

The bigger problem with Story is his approach at the plate which kills any offensive momentum that the Sox build. 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, mvp 78 said:

I think they could certainly upgrade Romy/Jones and do it cheaply. I think whatever it takes to acquire Abrams and Neto is probably too much. I wouldn't deal Arias for either. 

They already acquired Mead for next season, so if you get Abrams or Neto, what's the lineup? Moving Mead to DH? Moving Mead to LF? 

I think Romy comes around and is a useful platoon vs LHPs at DH or 2B/1B. It would be nice if he could play LF after we dump Duran, but Jones looks fine in that platoon LF role.

On paper, the guys to replace are Narvaez and Duran, so upgrading SS or 2B may not happen. The reason I keep bringing it up is that Abrams and Neto are the best bats on the market.

[moonslav59]

Phillies get Luis Arraez, Caleb Kilian and Brooks Raley in 2 seperate trades.

TOR traded for Jose Soriano after trading Gausman, yesterday.

[mvp 78]

7 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I think Romy comes around and is a useful platoon vs LHPs at DH or 2B/1B. It would be nice if he could play LF after we dump Duran, but Jones looks fine in that platoon LF role.

On paper, the guys to replace are Narvaez and Duran, so upgrading SS or 2B may not happen. The reason I keep bringing it up is that Abrams and Neto are the best bats on the market.

The problem with replacing Narvaez is that he's a very good defensive catcher. Wong is not a good defensive catcher. Does every position need to hit? It's more likely that you can get Narvaez's bat to come around a little bit. At that point, he's much more valuable than Wong or probably any catcher you're going to deal for. 

[mvp 78]

6 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Phillies get Luis Arraez, Caleb Kilian and Brooks Raley in 2 seperate trades.

Bad defensive team just got worse.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

9 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Nimmala isn't ready to play today. They could still hold onto Neto for another year if they wanted to. 

Angels are going nowhere. No reason they couldn't bring up Nimmala or Arias if they get him or just sign Merloni to finish out the year at SS. 

Neto isn't a groovy enough reason for fans to pay money down the stretch to watch a team that loves everything basementy. They already dealt Soriano, with Detmers reportedly next. Liquidate.

[Old Red]

13 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Doubt which part? Do you think he did a great job with the Joe Ryan stuff last deadline? Instead of getting players to help down the stretch, he just ended up with Dustin Maye and found himself getting jerked around by the Twins. He was unable to reach out to other teams because of his inexperience. Maybe he'll do better this year. 

Yes it’s a lot different than making deals in the offseason. There is much more pressure now with the clock ticking on the deadline.

[notin]

22 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

He'd be passable at 2b. Sox still believe in him at SS for some dumb reason. 

It keeps his mouth shut…

[moonslav59]

10 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

The problem with replacing Narvaez is that he's a very good defensive catcher. Wong is not a good defensive catcher. Does every position need to hit? It's more likely that you can get Narvaez's bat to come around a little bit. At that point, he's much more valuable than Wong or probably any catcher you're going to deal for. 

No, every position does not need to hit, bau after adding a SP, our next highest priority is to add a big bat.

Even if you disagree, please tell me what slot or player you think is best suited for an upgrade on offense. It's fine to keep 2027 and beyond in mind.

By player:

.535 Narvaez C (9th in PAs) Wong is at .707 and has improved his defense, but Narvaez is better. Catcher could be upgraded.

.602 Duran LF (2nd in PAs) Jones has done well in a SSS, but LF could be upgraded. (Anthony may return.)

.729 Yoshida DH with .572 Romy DH v L. Yoshida has been one of our best batters for 5-6 weeks. I suppose DH could be upgraded, but we also may see Anthony return.

Note: .594 Mayer (7th) and .547 (10th) have already been replaced by .771 Monasterio, .695 Seigler and .676 Sogard. (Story, Mayer, IKF and Mead are on the IL and Romy can play 2B. Cheng is in AAA.) SS or 2B could be upgraded.

Gun to head: choose the best everyday slot to upgrade.

[moonslav59]

Does anyone know who MN was going to get for Ryan last deadline, when the clock ticked out on Brez?

[mvp 78]

7 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Does anyone know who MN was going to get for Ryan last deadline, when the clock ticked out on Brez?

Tolle and either Arias or Password

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Tolle and either Arias or Password

That's what I thought.

If Brez botched the clock, I'm kinda glad he did.

Word is, MIN pulled out and Brez had no plan B as significant as plan A.

The "suspect" Tolle is now a key part of this year's success.

Arias has seen his stock rise to a point where Abrams or Neto are being discussed with his name in any deal.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I hope they don't trade Tolle -- he's got ace arsenal and personality, a combo the Sox hardly ever develop. Plus, Tolle has been our second-best young starter all year to Bennett.

[Old Red]

17 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Tolle and either Arias or Password

Also Minnesota reportedly wanted Duran, or Abreu, and Brez wouldn’t budge on that.

[SoxPhan]

14 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

No, every position does not need to hit, bau after adding a SP, our next highest priority is to add a big bat.

Even if you disagree, please tell me what slot or player you think is best suited for an upgrade on offense. It's fine to keep 2027 and beyond in mind.

By player:

.535 Narvaez C (9th in PAs) Wong is at .707 and has improved his defense, but Narvaez is better. Catcher could be upgraded.

.602 Duran LF (2nd in PAs) Jones has done well in a SSS, but LF could be upgraded. (Anthony may return.)

.729 Yoshida DH with .572 Romy DH v L. Yoshida has been one of our best batters for 5-6 weeks. I suppose DH could be upgraded, but we also may see Anthony return.

Note: .594 Mayer (7th) and .547 (10th) have already been replaced by .771 Monasterio, .695 Seigler and .676 Sogard. (Story, Mayer, IKF and Mead are on the IL and Romy can play 2B. Cheng is in AAA.) SS or 2B could be upgraded.

Gun to head: choose the best everyday slot to upgrade.

DH. George Springer. Replaces Romy and puts Yoshida in LF platoon.
IMO. replacing a C that has us winning over a long period is the biggest risk we can take right now. We need to be careful not to shake things up too much. Bringing in a new catcher to learn the staff this deep in the season is a huge disruption. Replacing Romy and/or Jones is waay lower risk. A catcher's job is to command the staff and be solid defensively. We have that. Any hitting they do is a bonus. Plus, Narvaez is a sophomore who hit well last year. He could just as easily get rolling as Durbin did. 

[mvp 78]

20 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

That's what I thought.

If Brez botched the clock, I'm kinda glad he did.

Word is, MIN pulled out and Brez had no plan B as significant as plan A.

The "suspect" Tolle is now a key part of this year's success.

Arias has seen his stock rise to a point where Abrams or Neto are being discussed with his name in any deal.

It is a bad trade in retrospect. My point is that he was solely focused on Ryan and couldn't get an alternate deal done. A more experienced CBO would have had other fires going. I hope he has learned from this. 

[mvp 78]

14 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

I hope they don't trade Tolle -- he's got ace arsenal and personality, a combo the Sox hardly ever develop. Plus, Tolle has been our second-best young starter all year to Bennett.

At this point, it makes zero sense to deal him. He's a starter for the next 5 years. Last season, he was a question mark. 

[mvp 78]

12 minutes ago, Old Red said:

Also Minnesota reportedly wanted Duran, or Abreu, and Brez wouldn’t budge on that.

I don't think the Twins were serious on making the trade no matter what. 

[moonslav59]

6 minutes ago, SoxPhan said:

DH. George Springer. Replaces Romy and puts Yoshida in LF platoon.
IMO. replacing a C that has us winning over a long period is the biggest risk we can take right now. We need to be careful not to shake things up too much. Bringing in a new catcher to learn the staff this deep in the season is a huge disruption. Replacing Romy and/or Jones is waay lower risk. A catcher's job is to command the staff and be solid defensively. We have that. Any hitting they do is a bonus. Plus, Narvaez is a sophomore who hit well last year. He could just as easily get rolling as Durbin did. 

While Springer may be the least disruptive, I think our worst offensive positions are Catcher, LF, 2B and SS- not DH. Yoshida sucks on defense, so moving him to LF is a bit disruptive. Even Anthony looked a ittle shaky on defense, and to maybe help him stay healthier, he should DH when he returns.

I'd rather we just get a LF'er over a DH.

I'd rather get a catcher and risk some disruption to gave 250-375 points on OPS over Narvaez.

I'd rather we get a SS, even if the plan is to move him to 2B, now, in 2027 or later. Mead can DH or maybe play LF. He can also move to 1B after Willson bolts.

[mvp 78]

10 minutes ago, SoxPhan said:

DH. George Springer. Replaces Romy and puts Yoshida in LF platoon.
IMO. replacing a C that has us winning over a long period is the biggest risk we can take right now. We need to be careful not to shake things up too much. Bringing in a new catcher to learn the staff this deep in the season is a huge disruption. Replacing Romy and/or Jones is waay lower risk. A catcher's job is to command the staff and be solid defensively. We have that. Any hitting they do is a bonus. Plus, Narvaez is a sophomore who hit well last year. He could just as easily get rolling as Durbin did. 

His splits vs LHP aren't all that great TBH.