When should Bloom be fired?

[notin]

His sample size is rather small, but the rumblings about his bad D appear to be spot on.

 

The .709 OPS in 127 PAs needs a lot of improvement to offset that bad D, but I'm not sure we can write him off, just yet.

 

I don’t mind leaving him in Worcester. Getting just one viable player for two months of Vazquez is more than worthwhile…

[mvp 78]

LF, barely, and it helps that Fenway can hide that to a higher extent, but he's still not really a plus on D, to me.

 

He may be, if he keeps improving. He really sucked just a year and a half ago.

 

He's fine in LF. He's about the same in LF as Refsnyder.

[mvp 78]

Not much value in the short end of a DH platoon, but they guy does hit LHPs, pretty damn well.

 

835 OPS, but his 459 vs RHP makes him useless otherwise and his glove leaves him solely in LF. That split is the same as Duran's overall OPS for 2023. Why not just go with Duran fulltime then (749 OPS vs LHP)?

 

If he was hitting 1000 vs LHP, you keep him like in 2022, but that's not the case anymore.

[mvp 78]

He’s a role player with one legitimate baseball skill. He’s still under contract for next year and his limited skilllset doesn’t exactly scream trade bait…

 

You're not going to get much back, just salary and 40 man relief.

[Hugh2]

He's fine in LF. He's about the same in LF as Refsnyder.

 

The free agent market for position players is going to be historically bad this offseason. Teams looking to upgrade and get creative would find a lot of value in guys like Abreu, Valdez, and Refsnyder if they believe they can be legit platoon partners and they have the right fit for them on their roster.

 

Main piece? no but they can be part of a bigger deal if the pieces align right.

[moonslav59]

He's fine in LF. He's about the same in LF as Refsnyder.

 

Yes, I see a Duran/Refsnyder platoon in LF, especially because bot are better than our new FT DH, Yoshida, but to me, both are still better suited for DH not LF, but our team does not have that luxury- not that I would keep Ref as just a platoon DH. He's okay as the back-up LF'er and emergency RF depth.

[mvp 78]

It's a small sample size but his splits are spot on with his "platoon projection"

 

.258 OPS VS. LHP

.756 OPS VS. RHP

 

Given his subpar D, you'd expect a little bit more from the left side but I think he can improve upon that.

 

That can be a nice player to have depending on your roster, you can only put 26 guys on there so his profile could add a lot of value to a team....or not.

 

It's weird because Abreu fits a similar profile in the outfield, actually, I think he and REF would make a nice platoon. But you can only have so many platoon guys on your roster. I'd like some of those spots to be guys who have positional versatility and plus defense. I don't think both can fit into Boston's future plans.

 

Abreu didn't have a dramatic platoon split in AAA this year:

LHP 788 OPS

RHP 968 OPS

 

That's a guy you roll out everyday. Refsnyder only had an 835 OPS vs LHP with worse D than Abreu.

[moonslav59]

835 OPS, but his 459 vs RHP makes him useless otherwise and his glove leaves him solely in LF. That split is the same as Duran's overall OPS for 2023. Why not just go with Duran fulltime then (749 OPS vs LHP)?

 

If he was hitting 1000 vs LHP, you keep him like in 2022, but that's not the case anymore.

 

I'm not one to expect a repeat of a player's last 2-3 months for the remainder of his career.

 

Ref is one of MLB's best batters vs LHPs since the start of 2022- a much bigger sample size than his last 2-3 months.

 

He may not hit 1.000 again, but I fully expect him to hit significantly better than Duran vs LHPs, going forward. (Also, I'm not sure we can pencil in what Duran did in 2-3 months as the new expectation.)

[mvp 78]

I'm not one to expect a repeat of a player's last 2-3 months for the remainder of his career.

 

Ref is one of MLB's best batters vs LHPs since the start of 2022- a much bigger sample size than his last 2-3 months.

 

He may not hit 1.000 again, but I fully expect him to hit significantly better than Duran vs LHPs, going forward. (Also, I'm not sure we can pencil in what Duran did in 2-3 months as the new expectation.)

 

If you want a bigger sample:

 

Career LHP OPS 757

 

I think the 2022 split is the abberration, honestly.

[notin]

You're not going to get much back, just salary and 40 man relief.

 

Really just the 40 man roster spot.

 

But Refsnyder is not the top name that needs to go where all the Sox get back is a 40 man roster spot…

[notin]

Yes, I see a Duran/Refsnyder platoon in LF, especially because bot are better than our new FT DH, Yoshida, but to me, both are still better suited for DH not LF, but our team does not have that luxury- not that I would keep Ref as just a platoon DH. He's okay as the back-up LF'er and emergency RF depth.

 

If you think Duran is not good enough defensively for left field, it is entirely possible your expectations are not realistic…

[mvp 78]

If you think Duran is not good enough defensively for left field, it is entirely possible your expectations are not realistic…

 

Somehow it's the same people that think Andrew Benintendi taking a few steps and falling over was the greatest catch in Red Sox history...

[mvp 78]

Really just the 40 man roster spot.

 

But Refsnyder is not the top name that needs to go where all the Sox get back is a 40 man roster spot…

 

No, he's not. He's just a guy without options, unlike others.

[Old Red]

If you think Duran is not good enough defensively for left field, it is entirely possible your expectations are not realistic…

 

I’m not sure Dugy will get traded, and I’m not sure JT won’t be back, so if one, or both of those things don’t happen then all kinds of changes won’t happen. No one knows what Bloom will do, and he probably doesn’t know himself. JT could be back at DH, and Yoshida could be back in LF, and who knows where that would leave Duran.

[notin]

I’m not sure Dugy will get traded, and I’m not sure JT won’t be back, so if one, or both of those things don’t happen then all kinds of changes won’t happen. No one knows what Bloom will do, and he probably doesn’t know himself. JT could be back at DH, and Yoshida could be back in LF, and who knows where that would leave Duran.

 

Verdugo should be extended and Duran should be traded, more so because of the OF surplus and because his control is more valuable than Verdugo’s skills…

[notin]

No, he's not. He's just a guy without options, unlike others.

 

Options are irrelevant when dealing with 40 man roster spots

[mvp 78]

Verdugo should be extended and Duran should be traded, more so because of the OF surplus and because his control is more valuable than Verdugo’s skills…

 

What kind of extension would you give him?

[moonslav59]

Verdugo should be extended and Duran should be traded, more so because of the OF surplus and because his control is more valuable than Verdugo’s skills…

 

Extend Dugo and then trade him.

[Hugh2]

Abreu didn't have a dramatic platoon split in AAA this year:

LHP 788 OPS

RHP 968 OPS

 

That's a guy you roll out everyday. Refsnyder only had an 835 OPS vs LHP with worse D than Abreu.

 

In how many at-bats? 66???

 

his greater body of work in the minors shows splits and scouts peg him as a platoon bat as well. Not saying he can't improve upon that projection, but I'm not certainly sold yet.

[mvp 78]

In how many at-bats? 66???

 

his greater body of work in the minors shows splits and scouts peg him as a platoon bat as well. Not saying he can't improve upon that projection, but I'm not certainly sold yet.

 

OPS in 2022 vs LHP was 775.

OPS in 2021 vs LHP was 840.

 

I'm going to have to disagree with the splits issue assessment for now.

[Old Red]

Extend Dugo and then trade him.

Wow we!🙈

[Hugh2]

OPS in 2022 vs LHP was 775.

OPS in 2021 vs LHP was 840.

 

I'm going to have to disagree with the splits issue assessment for now.

 

And how often are we told to ignore milb stats. SO much more at play BUT -

 

He has sucked vs. LHP at the MLB level, which is the only level that scouts. And that matches up verbatim with his scouting. I'll believe in that until proven otherwise.

 

"Starts open and vertical with his hands high and his front foot inverted. Medium high-leg kick. Above-average bat speed. Vertical swing path, makes a lot of contact in the air. Passive approach. Will take a walk, but also strikes out a lot due to working consistent deep counts. Will have to show he can consistently hit high fastballs at the major league level as he has struggled at times with velocity up in the zone in the minors. Does a good job recognizing spin and has shown the ability to make adjustments within an at-bat. Has some platoon splits and seems to see the ball more comfortably against right-handed pitching. Potential below-average hit tool."

 

"Potential up-and-down depth outfielder. Ceiling of a major league platoon outfielder. Development of hit tool will determine his major league potential. Has raw power and will take a walk, but needs to cut down on his swing-and-miss and show he can consistently make contact and impact the baseball against advanced pitching."

[Hugh2]

We are really in zero position to be trading outfielders. Have you guys seen next years free-agent class? What do you do if Duran turns into a pumpkin, or someone goes down?

 

I'd be hoarding my outfield depth like humanity depends on it right now.

[notin]

What kind of extension would you give him?

 

Not sure. Who is a good comp for a 26yo 2.5-3fWAR right fielder?

[notin]

We are really in zero position to be trading outfielders. Have you guys seen next years free-agent class? What do you do if Duran turns into a pumpkin, or someone goes down?

 

I'd be hoarding my outfield depth like humanity depends on it right now.

 

Let Duran turn into another team’s pumpkin.

 

If the Sox outfielders are so unreliable, why would anyone want to hoard them?

[moonslav59]

We are really in zero position to be trading outfielders. Have you guys seen next years free-agent class? What do you do if Duran turns into a pumpkin, or someone goes down?

 

I'd be hoarding my outfield depth like humanity depends on it right now.

 

Other teams need OF'ers and may overpay for one of ours, for all the reasons you want to hoard them.

 

If you look at all our positions, in terms of ML players or ML ready prospects who can play certain positions, we have 2 catchers, one 1Bman (2 if you count Dalbec), 3 middle IF'ers, 1 3Bman and 6 OF'ers:

 

Dugo

Duran

Yoshi

Refsnyder

Rafaela

Abreu

(7, if you count Rosier)

 

Some of us don't believe we will spend large and long enough on 3 SP'ers. There are doubts we will on even two.

 

A trade remains a real option, and more and more teams want ML returns or ML ready prospects. OF is our deepest position, even if it is not ideally deep enough.

[moonslav59]

Not sure. Who is a good comp for a 26yo 2.5-3fWAR right fielder?

 

If trading Duran is mostly about years, why not extend Dugo and trade him?

 

I realize keeping Duran over Dugo hurst the D and lessens the return, but Dugo does have trade value and may have more, if extended at a reasonable rate.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Some of us don't believe we will spend large and long enough on 3 SP'ers. There are doubts we will on even two.

 

A trade remains a real option, and more and more teams want ML returns or ML ready prospects. OF is our deepest position, even if it is not ideally deep enough.

 

If Bloom is still here, there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to expect a change in course. So: no way they'll sign any big money free agent pitchers and no way they'll trade any top prospects for young arms.

 

There will be additions to the pitching staff -- like a Flaherty on a one-year/$10 mil showcase contract. But just wait til we get those injured guys back!

 

Might as well accept this: if the Sox keep Bloom, that means they are committing to him, and seeing through his vision.

[mvp 78]

We are really in zero position to be trading outfielders. Have you guys seen next years free-agent class? What do you do if Duran turns into a pumpkin, or someone goes down?

 

I'd be hoarding my outfield depth like humanity depends on it right now.

 

Roman Anthony is already in AA. I think the org is planning on him being in RF at some point by late in 2025.

[Hugh2]

Other teams need OF'ers and may overpay for one of ours, for all the reasons you want to hoard them.

 

If you look at all our positions, in terms of ML players or ML ready prospects who can play certain positions, we have 2 catchers, one 1Bman (2 if you count Dalbec), 3 middle IF'ers, 1 3Bman and 6 OF'ers:

 

Dugo

Duran

Yoshi

Refsnyder

Rafaela

Abreu

(7, if you count Rosier)

 

Some of us don't believe we will spend large and long enough on 3 SP'ers. There are doubts we will on even two.

 

A trade remains a real option, and more and more teams want ML returns or ML ready prospects. OF is our deepest position, even if it is not ideally deep enough.

 

Fair, but if you're trading away that talent and you don't have much to replace it then you're effectively already giving up on the 2024 season.

 

No thank you,