2023 Free Agents

[mvp 78]

That 2011 draft did have some massive carry-over affect, but this is a great point. It really goes beyond the 2017 Devers call-up.

 

Theo once spoke about how the team got away from it's core principles and relied too much on free agent signings and mortgaging the future for the present, but what does he know. Sox radio talk show callers know better.

 

What names were traded that "mortgaged the future" though under Henry?

 

Rizzo?

[mvp 78]

What names were traded that "mortgaged the future" though under Henry?

 

Rizzo?

 

I hate when the Sox mortgage their future like this:

 

Red Sox receive:

Curt Schilling

 

Red Sox trade:

Casey Fossum

Brandon Lyon

Jorge De La Rosa

Mike Goss

[Hugh2]

Boston never had many top 10 picks because they were usually a contender. Benintendi at #7 in 2015 was the Red Sox' best Top 10 pick since Trot Nixon went #7 in 1993. Nixon earned 21.2 WAR, surpassed by only one pick above him (ARod), though several other first rounders had better career WAR: Wagner, Derek Lee, Chris Carpenter, Tori Hunter and Varitek.

 

There were a lot of recognizable names in the '15 draft -- Swanson, Tucker, Buehler, Austin Riley -- but the only first rounder with higher WAR than Beni's 15.7 so far is Bregman.

 

We all have high hopes for Marcelo Mayer, but stardom is hardly guaranteed. The Red Sox may have missed by selecting Trey Ball #7 in 2013, but the picks immediately before and after him -- Colin Moran and Hunter Dozier -- are negative WAR below replacement players so far...

 

Up until recently the Sox seemed to do pretty good drafting in the back of the draft, of course, up until about a decade ago there were completely different rules and you didn't have financial restrictions in the draft either. Also, teams like LA have done a good job of drafting as well.

 

Drafting is hard, if you get 2 productive MLBers in a draft you did a decent job. Sox have had some duds.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

That 2011 draft did have some massive carry-over affect, but this is a great point. It really goes beyond the 2017 Devers call-up.

 

Theo once spoke about how the team got away from it's core principles and relied too much on free agent signings and mortgaging the future for the present, but what does he know. Sox radio talk show callers know better.

 

Part of the checkbook Theo had access to -- that some posters swear Bloom is denied (with no evidence of organizational confirmation) -- was used to sign every Red Sox draft pick and international prospect. Then the MLB changed the rules.

[mvp 78]

Part of the checkbook Theo had access to -- that some posters swear Bloom is denied (with no evidence of organizational confirmation) -- was used to sign every Red Sox draft pick and international prospect. Then the MLB changed the rules.

 

Bloom did mess things up for the Sox with the international signings due to his indiscretions.

[moonslav59]

Yankees continually have a pretty good system and they don't typically have early draft picks.

 

The Dodgers, too.

 

It's not impossible to build and keep farms strong under this system, but it's not as easy as it was years ago, either.

 

On paper, it looks like we are close to being "there." We have 12-15 prospects or recent grads that should get a significant chance at earning a key role on the 2023 team.

 

We have Mayer, Yorke, Lugo, Ward, Binelas, Hamilton & Koss in 2024.

 

We have Paulino, Wikelman, Jordan, Hickey, Kavadas, Abreu, Drohan & Uberstine in 2025.

 

We have Bleis, Romero, Anthony, Perales, Coffey, Rodriguez-Cruz & Brannon by 2026 or later.

 

Again, I know many of these guys will not work out well, but with so many, I'm hopeful enough stick and enough do well.

 

[moonslav59]

Bloom did mess things up for the Sox with the international signings due to his indiscretions.

 

That was just one year of penalties, right?

[moonslav59]

What names were traded that "mortgaged the future" though under Henry?

 

Rizzo?

 

I'm just paraphrasing what he said, himself.

[mvp 78]

The Dodgers, too.

 

It's not impossible to build and keep farms strong under this system, but it's not as easy as it was years ago, either.

 

On paper, it looks like we are close to being "there." We have 12-15 prospects or recent grads that should get a significant chance at earning a key role on the 2023 team.

 

We have Mayer, Yorke, Lugo, Ward, Binelas, Hamilton & Koss in 2024.

 

I'm unsure who you are referencing for 2023 so I won't speculate.

 

Mayer will be good.

 

Yorke had a terrible 2022 and still has a lot to prove. Maybe his bat doesn't end up being good enough to drag the rest of his skill set to BOS?

 

Lugo is a 2b/3b who showed zero power until last season. Most likely is just and up and down utility guy and not a regular.

 

If Koss gets extended run in BOS, things have gone horribly wrong. He's not a very good player.

 

Hamilton is fast, but doesn't really do anything else very well. He's ok defensively but has a weird swing for a speedy guy.

 

Binelas was just horrible last season. I couldn't project him making it past AAA at this point. His bat just hasn't handled advanced pitching at all.

 

Ward is most likely getting selected in the Rule 5 draft.

[mvp 78]

I'm just paraphrasing what he said, himself.

 

I understand, but did they really "mortgage the future"? Seems like they just signed some bad contracts and ownership freaked out?

[mvp 78]

That was just one year of penalties, right?

 

It was a whole year of not signing ANY international prospects. That's really bad.

[Hugh2]

It was a whole year of not signing ANY international prospects. That's really bad.

 

The penalties hurt, and not too long after the stud we signed tragically passed away. Daniel Flores.

[moonslav59]

It was a whole year of not signing ANY international prospects. That's really bad.

 

Yes, it is, but we are talking a long time between Devers and Bello. I can't see one year being the major reason for that.

[Hugh2]

Yes, it is, but we are talking a long time between Devers and Bello. I can't see one year being the major reason for that.

 

Well lets go the year after Bello

 

You have W. Gonzelez and Paulino who are our 13th and 9th-ranked prospects both still just 20 years old. And the year before Bello you had your best talent die. They gave Flores 3.1 million dollars in 2017, and 5 years since then have NOT given someone that much money. The year before that was the year they couldn't sign anyone, and the year before most of their signings were voided. The year before that we had Moncada and he gave us Sale, and the year before that takes us to Devers.

 

If you want to go in the other direction we are talking about 16-19 year olds so. Has the international drafting really been bad? no, it has not.

[moonslav59]

Well lets go the year after Bello

 

You have W. Gonzelez and Paulino who are our 13th and 9th-ranked prospects both still just 20 years old. And the year before Bello you had your best talent die. They gave Flores 3.1 million dollars in 2017, and 5 years since then have NOT given someone that much money. The year before that was the year they couldn't sign anyone, and the year before most of their signings were voided. The year before that we had Moncada and he gave us Sale, and the year before that takes us to Devers.

 

If you want to go in the other direction we are talking about 16-19 year olds so. Has the international drafting really been bad? no, it has not.

 

No, but it has not brought us anyone between Devers and Bello, except Moncada, who yes brought us Sale, but has not been all that great.

 

When you couple this with no great draft picks that have helped us greatly since 2011, it's hard to find a better reason for our drop in rings since 2013- one in nine seasons.

[Bellhorn04]

No, but it has not brought us anyone between Devers and Bello, except Moncada, who yes brought us Sale, but has not been all that great.

 

And Moncada cost $63 million, let's not forget.

[Hugh2]

No, but it has not brought us anyone between Devers and Bello, except Moncada, who yes brought us Sale, but has not been all that great.

 

When you couple this with no great draft picks that have helped us greatly since 2011, it's hard to find a better reason for our drop in rings since 2013- one in nine seasons.

 

You said it can't be one thing, I gave you more than one reason. If you take out the penalties, and a top prospect dying, we have had either a hit or current top prospects drafted. You go beyond that and we are talking about 19-18-year-olds.

[mvp 78]

And Moncada cost $63 million, let's not forget.

 

That's almost Seiya Suzuki money!

[Bobe2]

The Dodgers, too.

 

It's not impossible to build and keep farms strong under this system, but it's not as easy as it was years ago, either.

 

On paper, it looks like we are close to being "there." We have 12-15 prospects or recent grads that should get a significant chance at earning a key role on the 2023 team.

 

We have Mayer, Yorke, Lugo, Ward, Binelas, Hamilton & Koss in 2024.

 

We have Paulino, Wikelman, Jordan, Hickey, Kavadas, Abreu, Drohan & Uberstine in 2025.

 

We have Bleis, Romero, Anthony, Perales, Coffey, Rodriguez-Cruz & Brannon by 2026 or later.

 

Again, I know many of these guys will not work out well, but with so many, I'm hopeful enough stick and enough do well.

 

Mlb top 100 minor league prospects has Mayer ranked at 7 and Rafaela at 96 ( both draft picks) only two Red Sox on list. since oct 2019 bloom has made 12 trades and received 21 minor league prospects, the trades under Bloom appear to have added to the organizational depth without adding a player who projects to be an above average big league player.

[moonslav59]

And Moncada cost $63 million, let's not forget.

 

Rusney cost a fortune, too.

 

We've done okay with IFA's, but not like the 4 year period of Bogey, Iggy, Montas, Margot and Devers.

[moonslav59]

Dodgers meeting with Verlander. It appears their big spending will continue.

[moonslav59]

Mlb top 100 minor league prospects has Mayer ranked at 7 and Rafaela at 96 ( both draft picks) only two Red Sox on list. since oct 2019 bloom has made 12 trades and received 21 minor league prospects, the trades under Bloom appear to have added to the organizational depth without adding a player who projects to be an above average big league player.

 

While true, he did acquire Whitlock, and guys like Kelly, German, Wink, E Valdez, Abreu and Hamilton may add some nice ML roster production in 2023.

 

Bleis (IFA) may be joining the top 100 list by mid season 2023 and may be our best prospect, right now.

[cp176]

Mlb top 100 minor league prospects has Mayer ranked at 7 and Rafaela at 96 ( both draft picks) only two Red Sox on list. since oct 2019 bloom has made 12 trades and received 21 minor league prospects, the trades under Bloom appear to have added to the organizational depth without adding a player who projects to be an above average big league player.

 

You are right for sure. Now Bloom might be doing a decent job bringing people in that can at least play a little. I think that part of my problem has been that I have listened to the people claiming how much he has built up the farm. I agree that he has but until he pulls off some big time trades with all of this very average talent that he has brought in, I'm going to remain very skeptical with respect to the job that he has done, is doing, and will do. Of course he gets high grades for adding players to the program. I wish that they were better players.

[mvp 78]

Mlb top 100 minor league prospects has Mayer ranked at 7 and Rafaela at 96 ( both draft picks) only two Red Sox on list. since oct 2019 bloom has made 12 trades and received 21 minor league prospects, the trades under Bloom appear to have added to the organizational depth without adding a player who projects to be an above average big league player.

 

Yorke was top 100 prior to 2022, right?

[mvp 78]

Dodgers meeting with Verlander. It appears their big spending will continue.

 

As it should. Kershaw is not a lock to re-sign.

[moonslav59]

You are right for sure. Now Bloom might be doing a decent job bringing people in that can at least play a little. I think that part of my problem has been that I have listened to the people claiming how much he has built up the farm. I agree that he has but until he pulls off some big time trades with all of this very average talent that he has brought in, I'm going to remain very skeptical with respect to the job that he has done, is doing, and will do. Of course he gets high grades for adding players to the program. I wish that they were better players.

 

The vast majority we don't know how good they are or will be. We do know Whitlock is good.

 

When you figure it takes 3-7 years to start seeing results, seeing Whitlock already looks pretty good to me.

 

Looking at Kelly, German and Wink, with very little ML experience already, I'm thinking 1 or 2 should be good.

 

Those yet to show anything cannot be judged, but on paper, it looks pretty good, and many of his trades added depth that should lead to at least 1 or 2 meaningful players, at some point:

 

(I'm not sure how much better we could have expected.)

 

Bloom's guys only (some not so good, so far, agreed)

2023 (and before): Whitlock, Wink, Seabold, Kelly, German, Wong, Downs, EVladez,

2024: Mayer, Wallace, Abreu, Hamilton, RHern, Binelas, Koss

2025: Hickey, Kavadas, Jordan, Drohan, Ferguson, Rosier

2006> Bleis, Romero, Anthony, Coffey, Rodriguez-Cruz, Brannon

 

Lots of names- a few should do well, and that should beat the last 5 year record of:

 

Houck

Dalbec

Duran

 

[Hugh2]

Yorke was top 100 prior to 2022, right?

 

Yorke might still be on some peoples radar and top 100s. If he bounces back he’s easily a top 100 guy a lot of scouts still really believe in his bat

[mvp 78]

While true, he did acquire Whitlock, and guys like Kelly, German, Wink, E Valdez, Abreu and Hamilton may add some nice ML roster production in 2023.

 

Bleis (IFA) may be joining the top 100 list by mid season 2023 and may be our best prospect, right now.

 

FWIW, SoxProspects doesn't believe Hamilton or Abreu will appear for BOS in 2023. If Hamilton can gain some usefulness in the OF, maybe he can get a cup of coffee even with his dumb flyball rate. Hamilton at least has the speed. Abreu k's too much for his mediocre power. He'll walk a lot, but has too much swing and miss. His SLG went way down after being traded.

[mvp 78]

Yorke might still be on some peoples radar and top 100s. If he bounces back he’s easily a top 100 guy a lot of scouts still really believe in his bat

 

He played well in the AFL. He deserves another year before I worry about him. Development is not linear.

[Hugh2]

He played well in the AFL. He deserves another year before I worry about him. Development is not linear.

 

Exactly