8/26 Rays @ SOX

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

I'm not sold yet, but yes, he's improved.

 

You're not sold yet? Maybe you should lower the price.

[Maxbialystock]

Pollyanna here.

 

This is the third straight terrific game I've watched. Yes, absolutely, the Sox lost the first two because in the end the Jays could bring that run home from 2d in the 10th and the Sox flat could not. Last night the Jays did it with two freaking groundouts (except the 2d one was fielder's choice and the batter was safe at first when Bogey went home with a high throw.

 

So my point is that I do not see what everyone else is seeing--a bunch of quitters. Brasier stunk tonight of course, but he was trying and just didn't have it.

 

Meanwhile we are learning that Barnes was only mostly dead, and to the Sox credit they put him on the IL forever--or at least long enough to seem to regain the heart of what made him so good last year--a good knuckle curve and good enough fast ball.

 

In 10 freaking appearances this month he has given up 2 runs with an ERA of 1.93. Tonight was his third game in 3 nights and third straight shutout inning in very close games.

 

How could anyone not applaud not only his performance but--heaven forbid I say this--his freaking heart. He gets paid $8M whether he's good or stinks to high heaven. He wants to contribute.

 

And, I think, so does everyone else on this team, as unpopular as that is on talksox.

 

I have always wondered how MLB players can maintain desire/intensity/skill/whatever over 162 games, 6 games a week for 6 months, in games that sometimes seem interminable with the petty little game delays by pitchers, hitters, whatever. And in the Sox case they are doing it during a rough season immediately after a pretty good one.

 

I'm a Sox fan forever, but more than that I'm a baseball fan grateful that his team is still in the John Henry era.

Edited August 27, 2022 by Maxbialystock

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

I think the SOX should keep Whitlock.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Whitlock, Schreiber and Barnes; that's a thin BP.

[Tedballgame]

I think the SOX should keep Whitlock.

 

And keep him in the bullpen.

[Maxbialystock]

Whitlock, Schreiber and Barnes; that's a thin BP.

 

And that's the freaking point. Brasier absolutely stunk tonight, no question. In 12 games this month he stunk three times, including tonight, but in the other 9 games he gave up 0 earned runs in 9 innings. He has a terrible WAR (-.9 or worse) and ERA (over 7), but the Sox bullpen right now is pretty desperate. Thus Barnes pitching his third straight game tonight. Whitlock last game was Wednesday, but that was 2 innings and 24 pitches. And before that Saturday for another 2 innings and 25 pitches. Schreiber had the night off, but he pitched Wed and Thurs. Schreiber has already pitched more innings this season than in his previous three seasons combined.

 

I left out Sawamura whose WAR is a respectable +0.8 and his ERA in August is 2.08. Strahm's WAR is +0.2 and this month is ERA is around 3.70 in 4 appearances.

 

Let's also not forget that the team ERA is 14th of 15 AL teams.

Edited August 27, 2022 by Maxbialystock

[notin]

Who says this? He has over a 6 ERA and a negative WAR

 

Mrs. Brasier, for one…

[moonslav59]

I've forgotten how good it feels after a win- shaky as it was.

[illinoisredsox]

3-0

Game over

This team isn’t mediocre. They absolutely suck. And the worst part is that they aren’t even showing up for the games. They don’t care any more and it shows.

Totally unwatchable. Good thing the Patriots are playing today.

Enjoy the game as much as you all can.

Outta here.

 

Enjoyed the game just fine. Some tense moments but entertaining. To paraphrase what Jim Lovell said to Marylin Lovell in Apollo 13, you missed a hell of a show.

[illinoisredsox]

Wacha is collapsing

 

He did what good pitchers do when they don’t have their best stuff, he battled, kept the score reasonable and gave his team a chance.

[notin]

I think the SOX should keep Whitlock.

 

Agreed.

 

NEXT!!

[moonslav59]

Whitlock, Schreiber and Barnes; that's a thin BP.

 

Houck being out really hurts.

 

Strahm is not the same guy as earlier in the season.

[notin]

And that's the freaking point. Brasier absolutely stunk tonight, no question. In 12 games this month he stunk three times, including tonight, but in the other 9 games he gave up 0 earned runs in 9 innings. He has a terrible WAR (-.9 or worse) and ERA (over 7), but the Sox bullpen right now is pretty desperate. Thus Barnes pitching his third straight game tonight. Whitlock last game was Wednesday, but that was 2 innings and 24 pitches. And before that Saturday for another 2 innings and 25 pitches. Schreiber had the night off, but he pitched Wed and Thurs. Schreiber has already pitched more innings this season than in his previous three seasons combined.

 

I left out Sawamura whose WAR is a respectable +0.8 and his ERA in August is 2.08. Strahm's WAR is +0.2 and this month is ERA is around 3.70 in 4 appearances.

 

Let's also not forget that the team ERA is 14th of 15 AL teams.

 

Matt has an ERA of 1.74 since coming off the IL…

[moonslav59]

Matt has an ERA of 1.74 since coming off the IL…

 

... and an OPS Against around .500 and FIP around 2.50.

 

10.1 IP

[moonslav59]

 

Let's also not forget that the team ERA is 14th of 15 AL teams.

 

We do still play in a hitter's park, so I prefer ERA+ or ERA- and other data.

 

We are 24th in ERA- (out of 30 teams)- not great but also not second worst.

 

19th in SIERA at 3.93

 

20th fWAR Pitching

 

T14th in balls hit softly. (25th in BAbip hints at poor defensive support)

 

Certainly, our pitching has not been our bright spot, but it's not really all that close to being worst, as ERA makes it seem like we are. (IMO)

[jad]

You're like a dog that keeps chewing on his favorite bone.

 

I know. I really should be making insightful and creative points about Brasier and COra instead.

[Maxbialystock]

Matt has an ERA of 1.74 since coming off the IL…

 

I'm sure you're right. I just wanted to make the point that he has been terrific and much needed--and that relievers can in fact come back.

 

To a far lesser degree, something like that can be said about Brasier. Last night he stunk and almost cost the game, but overall in August he as been solid in 9 of 12 appearances during which he gave up 0 earned runs.

[Maxbialystock]

We do still play in a hitter's park, so I prefer ERA+ or ERA- and other data.

 

We are 24th in ERA- (out of 30 teams)- not great but also not second worst.

 

19th in SIERA at 3.93

 

20th fWAR Pitching

 

T14th in balls hit softly. (25th in BAbip hints at poor defensive support)

 

Certainly, our pitching has not been our bright spot, but it's not really all that close to being worst, as ERA makes it seem like we are. (IMO)

 

I said 2d worst in the AL, not MLB.

 

But I do agree with your comments on Fenway being a hitters park. Plus I think the Sox outfield defense--and at 1b--has made it tougher on the Sox pitching this year.

[Bellhorn04]

Like everyone else I was full of dread when Barnes came in last night, and he fooled everyone.

 

And how about that 8 pitch 9th by Whitlock?

[Maxbialystock]

Enjoyed the game just fine. Some tense moments but entertaining. To paraphrase what Jim Lovell said to Marylin Lovell in Apollo 13, you missed a hell of a show.

 

Freaking brilliant quote. Plus I too enjoyed that game.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Whitlock, Schreiber and Barnes; that's a thin BP.

 

To be fair I should also add Familia.

[Maxbialystock]

Ask the faux genius.

 

The guy who managed the Sox to their best season ever in 2018 and to the ALCS last year? Yeah, what a bum.

[Maxbialystock]

Like everyone else I was full of dread when Barnes came in last night, and he fooled everyone.

 

And how about that 8 pitch 9th by Whitlock?

 

He fooled everyone? He's been the Sox most reliable reliever in August with an ERA of 1.74 in 11 appearances--8 of them against teams with winning records. Last night was his third stint--against the Rays and Jays--in as many nights--and he pitched a 1-2-3 inning after Brasier gave up 4 runs with no outs.

[Maxbialystock]

He did what good pitchers do when they don’t have their best stuff, he battled, kept the score reasonable and gave his team a chance.

 

Yep.

[Bellhorn04]

He fooled everyone? He's been the Sox most reliable reliever in August with an ERA of 1.74 in 11 appearances--8 of them against teams with winning records. Last night was his third stint--against the Rays and Jays--in as many nights--and he pitched a 1-2-3 inning after Brasier gave up 4 runs with no outs.

 

I know, but Matt had a lot of meltdowns in the second half last year and the first half this year.

 

It would be great if he's back on form.

[Maxbialystock]

Think what all those AA prospects will be doing in that situation.

 

Plus Bogey has never quit on this team, especially not this month when he has been in a slump. I'm not sure I would give him the contract he has reportedly demanded, but I do think he has been a stalwart since he came up in 2013 and played 3b in 12 of 16 games--including starting all 6 games in the WS--in the postseason when the Sox won the WS. Hard to believe that was 9 years ago.

[moonslav59]

Plus Bogey has never quit on this team, especially not this month when he has been in a slump. I'm not sure I would give him the contract he has reportedly demanded, but I do think he has been a stalwart since he came up in 2013 and played 3b in 12 of 16 games--including starting all 6 games in the WS--in the postseason when the Sox won the WS. Hard to believe that was 9 years ago.

 

I don't think any Sox players have "quit," but it seems some do feel that way.

 

I think Bogey deserves and will get more than Story got, even though their numbers are very similar. Story got $140M/6. I'd offer Bogey $150M/6, maybe with a $20M option year 7 with a $6M buyout- making it essentially a $156M/6 year deal ($26M x 6.)

 

I suspect he will get more, elsewhere, but maybe this down season will keep the offers lower than I expect.

 

I also don't see him as being a SS for the full 6 years, so that might lower the price tag, if the GM making the offer feels the same.

 

He's been one hell of a player, and I'll miss him, but if it comes down to keeping him vs Devers, I'm on the Devers wagon.

[moonslav59]

I know, but Matt had a lot of meltdowns in the second half last year and the first half this year.

 

It would be great if he's back on form.

 

Even if he just got back to pre start of 2021 form, he'd be a big plus in 2023 and beyond. Somewhere in between 2018-2020 Barnes and first half 2021 Barnes, and we'd have ourselves a closer or top set-up man.

 

The whole DFA Barnes thing got out of hand, and not just because of his contract.

[Maxbialystock]

I know, but Matt had a lot of meltdowns in the second half last year and the first half this year.

 

It would be great if he's back on form.

 

It is beyond question he basically collapsed last year and stayed that way this year. His WAR to date is -.5. But that's based mostly on April and May when his ERA's were 5.87 and an almost world record 9.64 in May. Grounds for DFA? I'm guessing many on talksox thought so. Instead, the Sox put him on the IL for over 60 days, which turned out to be a wise move.

 

Somehow he seems to have regained his knuckle curve and almost his fastball that worked so well in the first half of last season. And, if you watched him last night in his 3d stint in 3 nights, you saw one very determined guy.

 

The jury is still out on how long this will last, but it is crazy not to say, "boy did we and don't we badly need some version of the good Matt Barnes right freaking now." Houck is out. Whitlock is back, but Cora can't use him every night. Schreiber is still good but not as good as earlier, plus he is a one inning guy.

 

I just looked at the wild card standings, I readily agree the Sox are definitely a long shot to get to the postseason. They are 8 games back of the Jays and Mariners with 36 games to go, and their run differential of -44 ain't promising.

 

But, as moonslav loves to remind us, in baseball, including especially MLB, anything can happen.

[moonslav59]

It is beyond question he basically collapsed last year and stayed that way this year. His WAR to date is -.5. But that's based mostly on April and May when his ERA's were 5.87 and an almost world record 9.64 in May. Grounds for DFA? I'm guessing many on talksox thought so. Instead, the Sox put him on the IL for over 60 days, which turned out to be a wise move.

 

Somehow he seems to have regained his knuckle curve and almost his fastball that worked so well in the first half of last season. And, if you watched him last night in his 3d stint in 3 nights, you saw one very determined guy.

 

The jury is still out on how long this will last, but it is crazy not to say, "boy did we and don't we badly need some version of the good Matt Barnes right freaking now." Houck is out. Whitlock is back, but Cora can't use him every night. Schreiber is still good but not as good as earlier, plus he is a one inning guy.

 

I just looked at the wild card standings, I readily agree the Sox are definitely a long shot to get to the postseason. They are 8 games back of the Jays and Mariners with 36 games to go, and their run differential of -44 ain't promising.

 

But, as moonslav loves to remind us, in baseball, including especially MLB, anything can happen.

 

I'm not expecting a comeback. I started the 2023 thread on July 22nd and caught some grief for doing so.

 

All I want to see is fun and exciting baseball, these last 5 weeks. Getting to watch some kids show their stuff might be enough, by itself, assuming some do well, but last night was a fun game to watch. The two before that were, too, but we lost, so that took some of the joy away, but baseball is a great game.

 

I hate the way losing has brought the worst out of many of us, including myself, but I'm optimistic about 2023 and beyond, and I've not totally given up on 2023, although the mountain is steep and high. The fact that we play TOR & TBR so many games keeps the hope alive, but we need to run off on a 10-2 streak or something to have a realistic shot at anything magical, this season. Maybe last night was game 1 of such a run.

 

Let the fun begin! (Again)