Fire Bloom .

[Bobe2]

Adding Price to the deal didn't "fatten the pot," it actually reduced the return the Sox received.

 

Everyone says that but I don’t remember Price being a bad pitcher, 46 and 24 is a pretty good win % he did like to stir the pot and was out spoken but as a pitcher I don’t see the problem

[Bellhorn04]

That was because LA was forced to take Price or there was no Mookie.

 

Until anyone working for the Sox at the time ever comes clean, I'll always assume getting rid of Price was a mandate, and maybe the priority.

 

We can assume whatever we want.

 

But it's obvious the Sox had to trade Mookie. That was getting done one way or the other.

 

I think mvp is right that getting them to take Price simply lessened the return.

[Bobe2]

Agreed.

 

I think only 700 thought the Dodgers made out on the Price addition.

 

After taking the 2020 season off I agree he was never the same, but when he was traded nobody knew that would happen

[moonslav59]

It wasn't even close. There was no Kimbrel, and having no closer has been a big beef, around here, since then. (No Joe Kelly, either.)

 

No Nunez. Guys like JD and others like Pearce declined after 2018 or 2019. How is that Bloom's fault?

 

2We had the same SP'ers back, but almost all declined significantly, and some were predictable. By the time Bloom took over, Porcello was gone, Price was traded by force, Sale was toast, and Nate was not the same Nate as 2018 (5.99 ERA in 2019.)

 

Get real. 2019 was not 2018, and the slide into 2020 was predictable and expected by all, but apparently you.

[Hugh2]

If the Sox don’t plan on going big on a guy like Correa, they should prioritize a guy like Andrus for a 2 year stop gap at short stop. Invest in Brantley or Conforto for a OF\DH bat and add another starter.

 

Not a bad off-season, but not lo king up Bogey stings.

[Bellhorn04]

Everyone says that but I don’t remember Price being a bad pitcher, 46 and 24 is a pretty good win % he did like to stir the pot and was out spoken but as a pitcher I don’t see the problem

 

He was 46-24 in 4 years for us, yes, with a 3.84 ERA. He was also making 31 million a year.

 

He opted out of 2020 and pitched very little in 2021 and 2022. He wouldn't have been much help if we kept him.

[Bellhorn04]

If the Sox don’t plan on going big on a guy like Correa, they should prioritize a guy like Andrus for a 2 year stop gap at short stop. Invest in Brantley or Conforto for a OF\DH bat and add another starter.

 

Not a bad off-season, but not lo king up Bogey stings.

 

Andrus is looking better and better. His price is probably going up though!

[notin]

Everyone says that but I don’t remember Price being a bad pitcher, 46 and 24 is a pretty good win % he did like to stir the pot and was out spoken but as a pitcher I don’t see the problem

 

Price was becoming an injury-prone mediocre pitcher who was still owed $96mill over 3 years…

[notin]

Andrus is looking better and better. His price is probably going up though!

 

Kiermaier and move Kike to SS?

[moonslav59]

After taking the 2020 season off I agree he was never the same, but when he was traded nobody knew that would happen

 

It was expected he was in decline before we knew he took 2020 off. His decline was already well underway. We don't pay half is salary, if he was worth what he was before 2020. His 2018 season was worse than 2017.

 

ERA+

122 TBR

136 DET

118 BOS (123 in 2018> 114 in 2019)

 

The real decline was in IP:

 

He led the league in 2016 for BOS with 230, then...

75 in '17

176 in '18

107 in '19

 

Who looks at these numbers and say, "I'm not sure if he is declining or not?"

 

[moonslav59]

Kiermaier and move Kike to SS?

 

If we plan on getting a good SP via free agency, we might have to skimp at SS (Andrus) or CF/RF (Kiermaier or maybe we can afford Gallo/Conforto and trade Dugo.)

[Bobe2]

It was expected he was in decline before we knew he took 2020 off. His decline was already well underway. We don't pay half is salary, if he was worth what he was before 2020. His 2018 season was worse than 2017.

 

ERA+

122 TBR

136 DET

118 BOS (123 in 2018> 114 in 2019)

 

The real decline was in IP:

 

He led the league in 2016 for BOS with 230, then...

75 in '17

176 in '18

107 in '19

 

Who looks at these numbers and say, "I'm not sure if he is declining or not?"

 

Of course he was declining he was getting older, numbers are a manipulative thing they can be made to make anyone look good or bad depending on that persons point of view. Right now a pitcher that went 46 and 24 in the last four years if Bloom hired him would you be happy

[moonslav59]

Of course he was declining he was getting older, numbers are a manipulative thing they can be made to make anyone look good or bad depending on that persons point of view. Right now a pitcher that went 46 and 24 in the last four years if Bloom hired him would you be happy

 

No, because I know beforehand about age regression, especially in pitchers already showing skill decline and massive IP decline.

 

Not at $32M. Not at $16M, even at today's inflated prices.

[moonslav59]

Of course he was declining he was getting older, numbers are a manipulative thing they can be made to make anyone look good or bad depending on that persons point of view. Right now a pitcher that went 46 and 24 in the last four years if Bloom hired him would you be happy

 

$16M, in today's market is over $20M a year- maybe $25M.

 

You'd sign the 2020 Price to $20M x 4 years, now?

 

If you answer yes, please stop bashing Bloom. You are worse.

[Bobe2]

He was 46-24 in 4 years for us, yes, with a 3.84 ERA. He was also making 31 million a year.

 

He opted out of 2020 and pitched very little in 2021 and 2022. He wouldn't have been much help if we kept him.

 

That’s true, he really didn’t help anyone but that’s not the point unless the Dodgers can see into the future and know about COVID and a year off, and base their negotiations on that, otherwise the Sox got screwed

[Bobe2]

$16M, in today's market is over $20M a year- maybe $25M.

 

You'd sign the 2020 Price to $20M x 4 years, now?

 

If you answer yes, please stop bashing Bloom. You are worse.

 

I wouldn’t sign price, he opted out in 2020 and 2021 he was in the bullpen, my point is your using hind site to make your decisions on a persons ability, it’s easy to decide when you already know what the outcome is, my point was signing a pitcher with a good record should cost more not be a give away

[Bellhorn04]

I wouldn’t sign price, he opted out in 2020 and 2021 he was in the bullpen, my point is your using hind site to make your decisions on a persons ability, it’s easy to decide when you already know what the outcome is, my point was signing a pitcher with a good record should cost more not be a give away

 

We use hindsight all the time to bash management, it only seems fair to use it when it vindicates one of their moves...

[Bobe2]

We use hindsight all the time to bash management, it only seems fair to use it when it vindicates one of their moves...

 

Fair enough

[Bobe2]

Redsox have a Christmas ticket sales event in progress, I wonder how that’s going for them

[Bobe2]

The Redsox best offer to Xander was 6 years $162 million I don’t think they were seriously trying to keep him just making a show for the fans

[moonslav59]

I wouldn’t sign price, he opted out in 2020 and 2021 he was in the bullpen, my point is your using hind site to make your decisions on a persons ability, it’s easy to decide when you already know what the outcome is, my point was signing a pitcher with a good record should cost more not be a give away

 

No, I asked, would you sign the Price after the 2019 season- not knowing about the opt out- based on his numbers and clear decline in skills and durability?

[moonslav59]

The Redsox best offer to Xander was 6 years $162 million I don’t think they were seriously trying to keep him just making a show for the fans

 

I felt the same with Lester.

 

They knew all along they would never come close to the market price on an offer, and just went through the motions to appear they cared. (Nobody bought their lame attempts, then or now.)

[Bellhorn04]

I felt the same with Lester.

 

They knew all along they would never come close to the market price on an offer, and just went through the motions to appear they cared. (Nobody bought their lame attempts, then or now.)

 

I bought the second attempt on Lester. Mainly because he bought it.

[moonslav59]

I bought the second attempt on Lester. Mainly because he bought it.

 

They did come close, but in my unsupported-by-evidence opinion, I think the intentionally bid under what the Cubs offered and were just trying to save face with the fans.

 

(That did not work- nor did the "heavy" talks with Bogey at the last minute.)

 

[Bellhorn04]

They did come close, but in my unsupported-by-evidence opinion, I think the intentionally bid under what the Cubs offered and were just trying to save face with the fans.

 

(That did not work- nor did the "heavy" talks with Bogey at the last minute.)

 

 

Or did the Cubs jump the Red Sox bid by $20 million to secure the deal? We'll never know.

 

This time around the difference was humongous.

[mvp 78]

Kiermaier and move Kike to SS?

 

Kiermaier 8x150 to the Padres

[mvp 78]

Redsox have a Christmas ticket sales event in progress, I wonder how that’s going for them

 

[Bobe2]

I felt the same with Lester.

 

They knew all along they would never come close to the market price on an offer, and just went through the motions to appear they cared. (Nobody bought their lame attempts, then or now.)

 

There is only one left do they trade him now or wait, no way they pay Devers and there is no guarantee he would stay at any price

[Bobe2]

 

That’s great

[moonslav59]

Or did the Cubs jump the Red Sox bid by $20 million to secure the deal? We'll never know.

 

This time around the difference was humongous.

 

Of course, my opinion could b e wrong. I think they did not want Lester at even what their final offer was.

 

I certainly could be wrong.