Fire Bloom .

[cp176]

Henry knows what he's doing.

 

The guy is still spending, bigtime and is actively working on building up the long term success of this franchise.

 

"Statute of limitations?" Really? Is talk radio supportive of this idea?

 

I kind of like the Wyc Grousbek(sp) approach to winning. He is willing to pay whatever it takes luxury tax be damned. These billionaires likely aren't too worried about any monthly bills the likes of which most of us have to budget for. I disagree obviously with those of you who try to justify the rationale behind how much JH has spent and how much he plans to spend. Now what I will say is that I do wonder if Bloom had the blank check could he get the job done? I'm just not convinced that he could. He very well might be doing just what JH wants him to do. Nice right-not. He has moved over to the adult table by coming to Boston. Lets see how he likes it going forward. I'm hoping that he can do it.

[moonslav59]

Statute of limitations not only yes, but hell yes! All you have to do, and I have brought this up before is see how the Hoodie who coaches the Pats has been getting roasted, and toasted, and has been for 3 years now. The Pats have won more rings than the Red Sox, but a lot of fans only care about the here, and now. That is something you have a problem understanding. Like it, or not that is how lots of fans are. The jury is still out by the way on if Henry knew what he was doing hiring Bloom if he still wants to have a team that wins to get into the postseason.

 

I could care less about the Pats, and I'm talking about the owner not the coach or GM.

 

Yes, Henry knew what he was doing when he hired Bloom to rebuild the farm and strengthen the 26 and 40 man roster from a baseline that was about as low as I've seen in henry's tenure as owner.

 

Stop saying I don't understand, just because I disagree. I know how fans are. I know the different directions an owner and GM are being pulled, constantly. I know most of our society revels in the here and now and thinks little of the future. I fully understand that. I'm not like that, and I think and am glad Henry is not just about the now. He certainly cares about it, probably more than I do, as I wish we had gotten under the tax line, this year, but he also cares about the future way more than you and many fans do.

 

 

If you are thinking it may be time or close to time to want a new owner, I disagree with your position. I understand it, fully. You repeat it as much as I repeat my position.

[moonslav59]

I kind of like the Wyc Grousbek(sp) approach to winning. He is willing to pay whatever it takes luxury tax be damned. These billionaires likely aren't too worried about any monthly bills the likes of which most of us have to budget for. I disagree obviously with those of you who try to justify the rationale behind how much JH has spent and how much he plans to spend. Now what I will say is that I do wonder if Bloom had the blank check could he get the job done? I'm just not convinced that he could. He very well might be doing just what JH wants him to do. Nice right-not. He has moved over to the adult table by coming to Boston. Lets see how he likes it going forward. I'm hoping that he can do it.

 

I'm not sure Bloom is the guy to hand 10 blank checks to, either. He was hired for a different reason than DD was hired. He may end up following Ben's path- with or without a ring season.

 

It's all speculation, but it appears that he has greatly improved the farm and longer term outlook of the team from where it was after 2019. If you look at the 26 and 40 man rosters of the 2020 team, brought about in part by aging vets, injuries and departures, but mostly by a massive budget cut and the rosters we have now, I think we have improved significantly. We are also, now looking at 10-15 first or second year players joining the 26 man roster over the 2023 season. Some look very promising- some, not so much, but I see that as an encouraging sign things are changing, and for the good.

 

It might not be as fast and as complete as many wanted it to be, but I think this was the plan, when Bloom was hired. Maybe, JH lets Bloom get us to a certain place and then hires the next DD to go all-in with.

[Old Red]

I could care less about the Pats, and I'm talking about the owner not the coach or GM.

 

Yes, Henry knew what he was doing when he hired Bloom to rebuild the farm and strengthen the 26 and 40 man roster from a baseline that was about as low as I've seen in henry's tenure as owner.

 

Stop saying I don't understand, just because I disagree. I know how fans are. I know the different directions an owner and GM are being pulled, constantly. I know most of our society revels in the here and now and thinks little of the future. I fully understand that. I'm not like that, and I think and am glad Henry is not just about the now. He certainly cares about it, probably more than I do, as I wish we had gotten under the tax line, this year, but he also cares about the future way more than you and many fans do.

 

 

If you are thinking it may be time or close to time to want a new owner, I disagree with your position. I understand it, fully. You repeat it as much as I repeat my position.

 

The point about the Pats was the what have you done for me lately opinion, and not if it was about an Owner, GM, or player. Is that your opinion that JH knew what he was doing when he hired Bloom? It wasn’t a fact, and there are lots of fans including myself who have a different opinion. I am not in the camp that we need a new owner, but like I have voiced before that all the rings doesn’t make it alright for all the last place finishes.

[Bellhorn04]

The point about the Pats was the what have you done for me lately opinion, and not if it was about an Owner, GM, or player. Is that your opinion that JH knew what he was doing when he hired Bloom? It wasn’t a fact, and there are lots of fans including myself who have a different opinion. I am not in the camp that we need a new owner, but like I have voiced before that all the rings doesn’t make it alright for all the last place finishes.

 

The last place finishes are all in the past. Why do you care about them? LOL

[moonslav59]

The point about the Pats was the what have you done for me lately opinion, and not if it was about an Owner, GM, or player. Is that your opinion that JH knew what he was doing when he hired Bloom? It wasn’t a fact, and there are lots of fans including myself who have a different opinion. I am not in the camp that we need a new owner, but like I have voiced before that all the rings doesn’t make it alright for all the last place finishes.

 

I fully understand this position and know many feel the same way or almost the same way.

 

Our last ring was 2018, and we had a decent season in 2021. We went from 2013 to 2018 and are at that point again.

 

I feel very strongly JH knew exactly what he was doing, when he hired Bloom. I'm sure they discussed the philosophy and plan before they even hired him.

 

The plan was not to only build up the farm and future. The plan was supposed to include playing respectable ball while rebuilding, except for maybe the lost 2020 season. Bloom has gone 1 for 2 on that priority. That can be viewed negatively, for sure. This year sucked. No doubt we should have done better, and Bloom is partially responsible and example brought up over and over- like JBJ- are fair game. (I was the driver of the JBJ trade sucks bandwagon from day 1.) Bloom is also partially responsible for building up the farm, on paper anyway, and the 40 man roster depth. He has a ways to go, and this winter's spending budget and how Bloom uses it will be a big part of Bloom's lasting legacy- good or bad.

[moonslav59]

The last place finishes are all in the past. Why do you care about them? LOL

 

The past can only be invoked when supporting his own positions.

[Old Red]

The past can only be invoked when supporting his own positions.

 

And that goes BOTH ways.

[Old Red]

The last place finishes are all in the past. Why do you care about them? LOL

 

Guaranteeing, or wishful thinking?

[Bellhorn04]

Guaranteeing, or wishful thinking?

 

I was only talking about the ones that are literally in the past.

[moonslav59]

And that goes BOTH ways.

 

Not really, because I am not the one saying "The past is the past-" You are.

 

You say that many times we bring up the past. We don't say that to you when you bring it up, except to point out your hypocrisy.

[notin]

If you don't care about the championships that have been won, what's the freakin' point of any of this LOL

 

So apparently rings have a statute of limitations but flags fly forever,

 

Focus on flags! Not rings!

 

Jury is still out on trophies…

[moonslav59]

I was only talking about the ones that are literally in the past.

 

One great poster recently told me, "You have to ignore a lot of that stuff."

[Old Red]

Not really, because I am not the one saying "The past is the past-" You are.

 

You say that many times we bring up the past. We don't say that to you when you bring it up, except to point out your hypocrisy.

 

Hypocrisy to you, and hypocrisy to others could be two different points of view, which has happened many times over on here.

[Slasher9]

DD has gotten 4 different orgs to the WS.

bloom has 1 trip to ALCS.

they arent even in the same league, let alone ballpark.

 

thanks Dave!

[moonslav59]

Hypocrisy to you, and hypocrisy to others could be two different points of view, which has happened many times over on here.

 

Nobody is saying you are the only hypocrite, here. It should be expected, however, that any example of hypocrisy will be called out, no matter who it is.

 

I'm not sure why you keep trying to change the meaning of words. Hypocrisy is hypocrisy. If you keep saying you don't care about the past, but keep bringing it up, it is what it is.

 

Either stop bringing up the past or stop saying "the past is the past," when others invoke it, or be prepared to take the criticism of hypocrisy at face value.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

The last place finishes are all in the past. Why do you care about them? LOL

 

Well, we're still the defending last place AL East team until someone else finishes lower.

[Slasher9]

the past can predict the future.

can. not will. but still. it can. its a saying for a reason.

[Old Red]

If you don't care about the championships that have been won, what's the freakin' point of any of this LOL

 

Who said anything about not caring about championships?NO ONE. The point was how long can you rest on the laurels for winning them. Once again I’ll point to the Pats who have MORe laurels to rest on, but lots of fans are not letting them rest, and they have every right to do that like it, or not.

[cp176]

DD has gotten 4 different orgs to the WS.

bloom has 1 trip to ALCS.

they arent even in the same league, let alone ballpark.

 

thanks Dave!

 

i really hope no one but the very close members of Bloom's circle would disagree with what you have said. Regardless though, Bloom gets his chance to eat at the adult table.

[Bellhorn04]

Who said anything about not caring about championships?NO ONE. The point was how long can you rest on the laurels for winning them. Once again I’ll point to the Pats who have MORe laurels to rest on, but lots of fans are not letting them rest, and they have every right to do that like it, or not.

 

Yeah, it almost seems like the more titles you win, the higher the expectations get...

[Old Red]

Yeah, it almost seems like the more titles you win, the higher the expectations get...

 

If fans want to pat JH on the back for a job well done every year that is their prerogative, and I get that. On the other hand if someone doesn’t want to pat JH on the back every year for past good deeds that is their prerogative , and I get that too. I agree on the expectations part. I expect the Red Sox to be in the postseason every year, and if not to me that is a failure. Other fans are not that critical, and I get that to.

[moonslav59]

If fans want to pat JH on the back for a job well done every year that is their prerogative, and I get that. On the other hand if someone doesn’t want to pat JH on the back every year for past good deeds that is their prerogative , and I get that too. I agree on the expectations part. I expect the Red Sox to be in the postseason every year, and if not to me that is a failure. Other fans are not that critical, and I get that to.

 

I'm not sure anyone is patting JH on the back specifically over 2022. He actually allowed mose winter spending, last winter than any other time in quite a while, but we sucked, so I think people defending him are defending the long view of his time here.

 

If the farm and budget looked to be getting worse, I could understand being upset with the overall state of the team, but we are finally seeing some light from the farm- something that has been missing for too long, IMO.

 

It didn't happen out of thin air. It was planned for.

[Old Red]

I'm not sure anyone is patting JH on the back specifically over 2022. He actually allowed mose winter spending, last winter than any other time in quite a while, but we sucked, so I think people defending him are defending the long view of his time here.

 

If the farm and budget looked to be getting worse, I could understand being upset with the overall state of the team, but we are finally seeing some light from the farm- something that has been missing for too long, IMO.

 

It didn't happen out of thin air. It was planned for.

 

That’s what we’ve been discussing for several post now, which is the long view of JH time here, and if he should still be patted on the back for 2004, and the three other years they have won, and how long the pats should still come after all the last place finishes.

[dgalehouse]

Maybe Sox fans have become a little spoiled and expectations are sometimes too high, but when the team finishes dead last , 21 games behind their arch rival and the games are often painful to watch , people are justifiably angry. No amount of spin or excuses will change that.

[moonslav59]

That’s what we’ve been discussing for several post now, which is the long view of JH time here, and if he should still be patted on the back for 2004, and the three other years they have won, and how long the pats should still come after all the last place finishes.

 

If we finish in last place the next 5 years, and JH sells the team, he still gets a warm pat on the back from me. Eternal gratefulness for just one ring.

 

It doesn't take him or anyone else off the hook for the bad parts of his era, but everything is not black or white to many people. IMO, it's okay to like someone and praise them- warts and all.

 

(It's okay to not like him, too- not that anyone needs my permission.)

[moonslav59]

Maybe Sox fans have become a little spoiled and expectations are sometimes too high, but when the team finishes dead last , 21 games behind their arch rival and the games are often painful to watch , people are justifiably angry. No amount of spin or excuses will change that.

 

Nobody is saying fans don't have a right to be angry or that finishing 21 games back is okay.

[Old Red]

Nobody is saying fans don't have a right to be angry or that finishing 21 games back is okay.

 

How we got there, and how is it fixed is the problem, and I don’t believe Bloom is that problem solver. Injuries, and lack of production were problems, but Bloom’s moves, or lack of were also a problem.

Edited October 26, 2022 by Old Red

[Old Red]

If we finish in last place the next 5 years, and JH sells the team, he still gets a warm pat on the back from me. Eternal gratefulness for just one ring.

 

It doesn't take him or anyone else off the hook for the bad parts of his era, but everything is not black or white to many people. IMO, it's okay to like someone and praise them- warts and all.

 

(It's okay to not like him, too- not that anyone needs my permission.)

 

This we will agree on.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

How we got there, and how is it fixed is the problem, and I don’t believe Bloom is that problem solver. Injuries, and lack of production were problems, but Bloom’s moves, or lack of were also a problem.

 

Your second line summarizes the main reasons for the Wil E Coyote dive and the Acme anvil that followed.

 

It's up to the organization to plan for the inevitable and stockpile legitimate depth -- or promote/deal for suitable replacements.

 

Injuries happen to every team and are no excuse. It's not like '22 was one of those rare years where injuries to key stars were disasters that spelled instant doom...

 

... like 20 years ago, when Nomar missed just about the whole season, after winning back-to-back batting crowns and hitting .3freaking72. Then about a third of the way in, Varitek broke his elbow diving for a pop-up, and everyone knew it was over before it was over.