Will there be a 2022 season?

[Old Red]

I know the shift has increased radically, so has the use of more and more RP'ers, batters taking a long time to get set and much more.

 

Not allowing fielders to stand where they think the ball is most likely be hit is too radical for me.

 

I respect your and others' opinions, but I'm firm on my belief, here.

 

 

The whole game has changed radically to me, and also to me not for the better. Analytics to me has a lot to do with that, and once again I think the game has gotten worse, and not better. Imagine telling Bob Gibson, or Louie Tiant they had to come out of a WS game in the 6th inning because they can’t face a batter for the 3rd time. So are you saying getting rid of the shift is more radical than the radicallly increase of the shift?

[Old Red]

You don't get it.

 

I give up. Re-read your post and the point is obvious.

 

If it is not to you, then you just don't understand how language and logic work.

 

No! I don’t get it, because I DID NOT SAY Moon you said the players are poor, poor, and pitiful. The point is obvious to you, because that’s how you want to interpret it. What would have been obvious is if I said Moon you said those things. Your logic is not everyone’s logic.

[mvp 78]

Wow! The name calling. I think it’s a great idea, and a refreshing change from some of the hometown yuckers they have had on there.

 

Mazz won't start bashing the Sox during a game. He's going to be "carrying the water" 100%.

[mvp 78]

The whole game has changed radically to me, and also to me not for the better. Analytics to me has a lot to do with that, and once again I think the game has gotten worse, and not better. Imagine telling Bob Gibson, or Louie Tiant they had to come out of a WS game in the 6th inning because they can’t face a batter for the 3rd time. So are you saying getting rid of the shift is more radical than the radicallly increase of the shift?

 

My question is, when was the tipping point for you? Did something happen that turned you off from the game? The only way analytics has changed the game noticeably is with shifting. Were you ok with the game prior to the shifting?

 

Maybe the better question is what year was the last "good year" for baseball?

[Old Red]

My question is, when was the tipping point for you? Did something happen that turned you off from the game? The only way analytics has changed the game noticeably is with shifting. Were you ok with the game prior to the shifting?

 

Maybe the better question is what year was the last "good year" for baseball?

 

The only way that analytics has changed the game is the shift? What about the pitching? That is a lot bigger change to me than the shifting. Saying the game has gotten worse does not mean I have turned off from the game. Pace, and length of the game has certainly not made the game better in my opinion either, but if I had my pick I would go back to 60’s baseball.

[mvp 78]

@Travis_Sawchik

MLB attendance declines following work stoppages that cost games:

1972 (-3.7%)

1981 (-6.8%)

1995 (-20%!)

Per-game attendance didn't recover the pre-strike average until 2006.

[Old Red]

You don't get it.

 

I give up. Re-read your post and the point is obvious.

 

If it is not to you, then you just don't understand how language and logic work.

 

Do you remember when you said that i didn’t like Cora, because I said I wouldn’t have hired him back, because of his cheating scandal? I never said I didn’t like Cora, because I like Cora, but by your interpretation that meant to you I didn’t. You even apologized for it, so it isn’t like you, or your logic haven’t been wrong before just like this time.

[mvp 78]

The only way that analytics has changed the game is the shift? What about the pitching? That is a lot bigger change to me than the shifting. Saying the game has gotten worse does not mean I have turned off from the game. Pace, and length of the game has certainly not made the game better in my opinion either, but if I had my pick I would go back to 60’s baseball.

 

I was only asking because some fans still think of the early 2000's as the glory days.

 

What was it about the 1970's that altered course for the game? FA? Too many teams? I wasn't old enough then to have an opinion.

 

I think some could point to the 1980's and say "well that's when team's went relief pitcher happy and saves exploded."

 

The 1990's had the work stoppage and the farcical HR chase with two roided up dudes.

 

Early 2000's had long games with more runs being scored than ever, an even worse HR chase, plus Congressional hearings and the advent of PED testing.

 

The 2010's is when analytics really took a hold and you started to see pitchers being pulled early and shifts.

 

The 2020's had the pandemic shortened season, swing path, HR boom, meddling with baseballs and now a lockout. This is looking like the worst decade so far.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I was only asking because some fans still think of the early 2000's as the glory days.

 

What was it about the 1970's that altered course for the game? FA? Too many teams? I wasn't old enough then to have an opinion.

 

I think some could point to the 1980's and say "well that's when team's went relief pitcher happy and saves exploded."

 

The 1990's had the work stoppage and the farcical HR chase with two roided up dudes.

 

Early 2000's had long games with more runs being scored than ever, an even worse HR chase, plus Congressional hearings and the advent of PED testing.

 

The 2010's is when analytics really took a hold and you started to see pitchers being pulled early and shifts.

 

The 2020's had the pandemic shortened season, swing path, HR boom, meddling with baseballs and now a lockout. This is looking like the worst decade so far.

 

Free agency changed the landscape for sure, but it didn't all happen at once in the 1970s. Big markets stockpiled talent, but small markets were still able to compete -- Cincinnati was actually right at the top in attendance most of the decade, behind only LA. Cincy, Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Oakland all won titles after the mid-70s. The Pirates had good clubs in the early 90s, but after Bonds left never finished first again.

 

The Bucs, Reds, A's and O's made it to 12 World Series in the '70s, five in the '80s, and zero since... in 32 years.

[Old Red]

I was only asking because some fans still think of the early 2000's as the glory days.

 

What was it about the 1970's that altered course for the game? FA? Too many teams? I wasn't old enough then to have an opinion.

 

I think some could point to the 1980's and say "well that's when team's went relief pitcher happy and saves exploded."

 

The 1990's had the work stoppage and the farcical HR chase with two roided up dudes.

 

Early 2000's had long games with more runs being scored than ever, an even worse HR chase, plus Congressional hearings and the advent of PED testing.

 

The 2010's is when analytics really took a hold and you started to see pitchers being pulled early and shifts.

 

The 2020's had the pandemic shortened season, swing path, HR boom, meddling with baseballs and now a lockout. This is looking like the worst decade so far.

 

I guess it depends on how old you are, and how far back you go. I used to listen to many teams on the East Coast on my AM radio, in the 60’s and even at times get depending on the atmosphere the Detroit Tigers. Lots of great announcers back then too. My total use of analytics is looking at box scores, and I don’t want anything more than that. I know most eat up the analytics stuff, and nothing wrong with that, but I have no desire.

[moonslav59]

Where does it say that I said that you called the players poor, and pitiful? .

 

I told you where is says it, but you won't listen.

 

I'm done with this issue.

[moonslav59]

The whole game has changed radically to me, and also to me not for the better. Analytics to me has a lot to do with that, and once again I think the game has gotten worse, and not better. Imagine telling Bob Gibson, or Louie Tiant they had to come out of a WS game in the 6th inning because they can’t face a batter for the 3rd time. So are you saying getting rid of the shift is more radical than the radicallly increase of the shift?

 

Yes. The shift increase radically, but the right to do so was always there and sometimes used.

 

Changing the rule is wrong, IMO.

 

I understand and respect your opinion. I'm fine with you not agreeing with my opinion. To me, it's not about what is more radical: it's about changing a long-standing rule that affected many players' stats over many years, and it changes something very fundamental to the game: positioning your defense to maximize your chances of getting an out.

[jad]

The only way that analytics has changed the game is the shift? What about the pitching? That is a lot bigger change to me than the shifting. Saying the game has gotten worse does not mean I have turned off from the game. Pace, and length of the game has certainly not made the game better in my opinion either, but if I had my pick I would go back to 60’s baseball.

 

Yeah, back before free agency. Back when owners were KING! and back when you could walk up to the gate and get a ticket game-time because no one went. Although yeah, it must have been hard to see desegregation (1959 for the RS), but at least you didn't have to put up with all this player union nonsense. Those were the days!

[moonslav59]

Do you remember when you said that i didn’t like Cora, because I said I wouldn’t have hired him back, because of his cheating scandal? I never said I didn’t like Cora, because I like Cora, but by your interpretation that meant to you I didn’t. You even apologized for it, so it isn’t like you, or your logic haven’t been wrong before just like this time.

 

That wasn't a question of logic. It was about me saying you said something you never said or meant. I was wrong.

 

I will not talk about your statement again. Get over it. You said what you said, and it meant what it meant. It's not about interpretation: it's about word meanings.

[moonslav59]

Yeah, back before free agency. Back when owners were KING! and back when you could walk up to the gate and get a ticket game-time because no one went. Although yeah, it must have been hard to see desegregation (1959 for the RS), but at least you didn't have to put up with all this player union nonsense. Those were the days!

 

You're the best!

[Old Red]

I told you where is says it, but you won't listen.

 

I'm done with this issue.

 

I was done yesterday when I said we’ll go with I should have worded it different, but for some reason you have kept it going today.

[Old Red]

That wasn't a question of logic. It was about me saying you said something you never said or meant. I was wrong.

 

I will not talk about your statement again. Get over it. You said what you said, and it meant what it meant. It's not about interpretation: it's about word meanings.

 

It’s no different now. You are taking something I said, and put your spin on it. Wrong before, and wrong now. At least you admitted it last time.

[moonslav59]

Last word wins. You win!

 

You are right, and I am wrong.

 

Game over.

[Old Red]

Yeah, back before free agency. Back when owners were KING! and back when you could walk up to the gate and get a ticket game-time because no one went. Although yeah, it must have been hard to see desegregation (1959 for the RS), but at least you didn't have to put up with all this player union nonsense. Those were the days!

 

Different strokes for different folks. Amazing that the Red Sox were the last to get a Black player, but the Celtics were the first.

[moonslav59]

It’s no different now. You are taking something I said, and put your spin on it. Wrong before, and wrong now. At least you admitted it last time.

 

Who is keeping it going?

[moonslav59]

We owe it to the next generation..."

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10028455-mike-trout-on-mlb-cba-negotiations-lockout-we-owe-it-to-the-next-generation

 

CBS Sports' Dayn Perry noted several teams, including the Pittsburgh Pirates, Tampa Bay Rays, Cleveland Guardians and Miami Marlins, "take in more in revenue sharing than they spend on payroll."

Edited March 3, 2022 by moonslav59

[mvp 78]

I guess it depends on how old you are, and how far back you go. I used to listen to many teams on the East Coast on my AM radio, in the 60’s and even at times get depending on the atmosphere the Detroit Tigers. Lots of great announcers back then too. My total use of analytics is looking at box scores, and I don’t want anything more than that. I know most eat up the analytics stuff, and nothing wrong with that, but I have no desire.

 

I think that's the key. For me, I fell in love with the game back in the 80's. AL only played the NL in the AS Game and WS. I could love the Sox, but follow NL teams since it wasn't likely the Sox would ever match up against them. I liked following NL players like Eric Davis, Ozzie, Gwynn and Raines. I was psyched when the Nasty Boys beat the hated A's in 1990. The brand of baseball was more "put the ball in play to manufacture runs." Aside from 1987, the long ball was still under 1 per game (24 of the past 28 seasons have been above 1 per game, it had never been that high prior to 1987).

[Old Red]

Who is keeping it going?

 

This was written, before you said last word, so I guess you didn’t mean last word.

[mvp 78]

Who is keeping it going?

 

Both of you.

[moonslav59]

This was written, before you said last word, so I guess you didn’t mean last word.

 

......

[moonslav59]

Both of you.

 

Yup, but only one says it's the other doing it.

[Old Red]

Yup, but only one says it's the other doing it.

 

Why didn’t you stop when you said last word? Can’t help yourself. Over, and out.

[moonslav59]

Why didn’t you stop when you said last word? Can’t help yourself. Over, and out.

 

.....

[Old Red]

.....

 

Hey Moon wouldn’t it be great if we could do a sports talk show together? We could take over for Felger, and Mazz.

[moonslav59]

Hey Moon wouldn’t it be great if we could do a sports talk show together? We could take over for Felger, and Mazz.

 

Like Hannity and Colmes?