10/15 ALCS Game 1 @ Astros

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Sawamura and D-Hern are on the 26 man roster for ALCS. Barnes and Davis are left out.

Santana is also on roster.

Edited October 15, 2021 by SPLENDIDSPLINTER

[Old Red]

This is the way I see it:

 

The goal is to split the first 2 games in Houston.

 

Worst case scenario: Sale still doesn't have it, and Cora takes him out within 1 or 2 innings. Unless our bullpen blows up, we still have a shot to win game 1. Our offense is never out of it, especially the way they've been playing recently. Game 2 in Tampa is a prime example of that. I thought we were done after the Luplow grand slam. Even if we end up losing, we send our ace out to go win game 2. Certainly not a lock, but nobody else I would rather have there when we're down 1-0 in the series.

 

Best case scenario: Sale returns to form, we steal game 1, and Nate gives us a great shot to take both games in Houston

 

The way I see it the goal is to win every game you play. A split in Houston would be better than 0-2, but not as good as 2-0. Just because they came back from a 5-0 deficit against Tampa doesn’t mean it will happen again. I hope this layoff won’t hurt the offense, but EO is their number one starter, and to me he should start the first game. I here all kinds of talk about how much rest a starter is on, but this isn’t like Louie Tiant throwing 130 pitches. Cora said Sale had to pitch sometime, but to me no he did not. At least as a starter. I think E Rod, Pivetta, and Houck would have been better options than Sale to pitch after EO. I hope it works out, and Sale comes back like E Rod did, and I know Cora’s decisions have pretty much all worked out, but I don’t know if the amount of innings that have been pitched by the bullpen in another grueling series with out guys imploding can be sustained. Like some have said Cora has more info than we do, and I think we’ll know early on if this was the right decision.

[mvp 78]

Only a Red Sox physical?

 

I'm pretty sure there have been some very derogatory comments made about the Sox medical staff on here.

[mvp 78]

He did start 25 games out of the gate in 2019, so I'm not sure anything would have shown up on a "physical." Certainly, 2018 put a scare into every GM, and a future injury was a big worry.

 

He was under contract for 2019. He wouldn't have been a FA until the following offseason when he was injured.

[Maxbialystock]

The way I see it the goal is to win every game you play. A split in Houston would be better than 0-2, but not as good as 2-0. Just because they came back from a 5-0 deficit against Tampa doesn’t mean it will happen again. I hope this layoff won’t hurt the offense, but EO is their number one starter, and to me he should start the first game. I here all kinds of talk about how much rest a starter is on, but this isn’t like Louie Tiant throwing 130 pitches. Cora said Sale had to pitch sometime, but to me no he did not. At least as a starter. I think E Rod, Pivetta, and Houck would have been better options than Sale to pitch after EO. I hope it works out, and Sale comes back like E Rod did, and I know Cora’s decisions have pretty much all worked out, but I don’t know if the amount of innings that have been pitched by the bullpen in another grueling series with out guys imploding can be sustained. Like some have said Cora has more info than we do, and I think we’ll know early on if this was the right decision.

 

Yes, of course, the Sox should want to go 2-0 in Houston, but Thunder doesn't rule that out. Indeed, the hope is that, if Sale is back to his earlier self this season, the Sox can win both games in Houston.

 

That said, I have no disagreement with your wanting Eovaldi to start game 1. He is our ace, period. He throws harder than Sale and has a much better repertoire.

 

On the other hand, the Astros haven't faced Sale since 2018 and back in June they hit Eovaldi pretty hard. Plus almost all of us trust Cora's decisions and know that he will be ready to bring in the bullpen early and often if necessary.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Sawamura and K-Hern are on the 26 man roster for ALCS. Barnes and Davis are left out.

Santana is also on roster.

 

They must think Darwinzon's stuff -- if he gets it over the plate -- has the best chance to get an Astro out. Houston's bashers are more apt to bash Davis, while Barnes and his issues would maybe crush Boston.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

The way I see it the goal is to win every game you play. A split in Houston would be better than 0-2, but not as good as 2-0. Just because they came back from a 5-0 deficit against Tampa doesn’t mean it will happen again. I hope this layoff won’t hurt the offense, but EO is their number one starter, and to me he should start the first game. I here all kinds of talk about how much rest a starter is on, but this isn’t like Louie Tiant throwing 130 pitches. Cora said Sale had to pitch sometime, but to me no he did not. At least as a starter. I think E Rod, Pivetta, and Houck would have been better options than Sale to pitch after EO. I hope it works out, and Sale comes back like E Rod did, and I know Cora’s decisions have pretty much all worked out, but I don’t know if the amount of innings that have been pitched by the bullpen in another grueling series with out guys imploding can be sustained. Like some have said Cora has more info than we do, and I think we’ll know early on if this was the right decision.

 

Red, maybe Cora's thinking is that if Sale starts and doesn't have it, the Sox still have plenty of time to come back (like in Tampa). But if Sale relieves and blows a lead, then it may be too late to overcome. Cora's plan tonight may already be he just trusts his enders more than his starter.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

They must think Darwinzon's stuff -- if he gets it over the plate -- has the best chance to get an Astro out. Houston's bashers are more apt to bash Davis, while Barnes and his issues would maybe crush Boston.

 

My bad. That should have been D-Hern.

[Old Red]

Red, maybe Cora's thinking is that if Sale starts and doesn't have it, the Sox still have plenty of time to come back (like in Tampa). But if Sale relieves and blows a lead, then it may be too late to overcome. Cora's plan tonight may already be he just trusts his enders more than his starter.

 

What would be good is if we had starters that could go 6 innings, so we wouldn’t have to use so many relievers pitch so many innings. Sooner, or later one, or more of these relievers are going to implode. Like Smoltz said the more you use the bigger chance you have of someone blowing up. It only would take one.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

What would be good is if we had starters that could go 6 innings, so we wouldn’t have to use so many relievers pitch so many innings. Sooner, or later one, or more of these relievers are going to implode. Like Smoltz said the more you use the bigger chance you have of someone blowing up. It only would take one.

 

You sound like the type of rebel who would leave Houck in to pitch to the 7-8-9 batters when he was throwing a perfect game -- or let Blake Snell keep pitching when he was working on a World Series shutout with his team on the brink of elimination. Some crazy fans...

[moonslav59]

He was under contract for 2019. He wouldn't have been a FA until the following offseason when he was injured.

 

Of course, but when an extension is signed, we normally look at what would that player have gotten on the market at the time of the signing.

 

Yes, if the debate is about what would he have signed for after 2019, team physicals would have played a major role in the price set on his next contract.

 

Just for argument's sake, do you think the contract was fair at the time it was signed, despite knowing an injury was possible?

[Maxbialystock]

What would be good is if we had starters that could go 6 innings, so we wouldn’t have to use so many relievers pitch so many innings. Sooner, or later one, or more of these relievers are going to implode. Like Smoltz said the more you use the bigger chance you have of someone blowing up. It only would take one.

 

Smoltz is an idiot. I don't disagree about the danger of a succession of one inning relievers, but Smoltz obviously didn't watch games 2 and 3 of the ALDS in which first Houck and then Pivetta went multiple innings--plus Pivetta went multiple innings in game 1. Whitlock has shown he can go multiple innings.

 

Indeed, Eovaldi, ERod, and Sale started five games in the postseason and pitched a total of 18 innings. Pivetta, Houck, and Whitlock started no games in the postseason and pitched a total of 20 innings.

 

Funny thing about those 6 inning starts. You like them, I like them, and MLB statisticians like them because you can't have a quality start unless you go 6 innings. But managers are increasingly leery of keeping their starters out there for the third time through the opposing team's lineup, especially a good lineup.

[moonslav59]

Smoltz is an idiot. I don't disagree about the danger of a succession of one inning relievers, but Smoltz obviously didn't watch games 2 and 3 of the ALDS in which first Houck and then Pivetta went multiple innings--plus Pivetta went multiple innings in game 1. Whitlock has shown he can go multiple innings.

 

Smoltz probably watched those games, but doesn't think Pivetta will repeat that feat the next time. He thinks Cora is pushing his luck.

 

The way Pivetta has looked great then awful several times, this year, he might not be wrong.

[Maxbialystock]

Smoltz probably watched those games, but doesn't think Pivetta will repeat that feat the next time. He thinks Cora is pushing his luck.

 

The way Pivetta has looked great then awful several times, this year, he might not be wrong.

 

Yeah, Cora is just plain old lucky. Or just maybe he sends Pivetta or Houck or Whitlock out there with the intention of going multiple innings, but with the ability to pull them if they don't have it. That's exactly what he did with two starters, Sale and ERod.

 

Interestingly, Cora sent Pivetta in to pitch 4.2 innings in game 1 and then him sent back out in game 3 to pitch 4 more innings. He did the exact same thing with Houck going 5 innings in game 2 and coming back to pitch the 6th inning in game 4. However, Houck gave up that dinger in the 6th, so out came Taylor to pitch a perfect 7th. Unfortunately, Brasier pitched an awful 8th, giving up 2 runs, and Whitlock had to pitch the 8th and 9th to get the win.

Edited October 15, 2021 by Maxbialystock

[Slasher9]

WIN THIS GAME.

 

thank you.

[moonslav59]

Yeah, Cora is just plain old lucky. Or just maybe he sends Pivetta or Houck or Whitlock out there with the intention of going multiple innings, but with the ability to pull them if they don't have it. That's exactly what he did with two starters, Sale and ERod.

 

Interestingly, Cora sent Pivetta in to pitch 4.2 innings in game 1 and then him sent back out in game 3 to pitch 4 more innings. He did the exact same thing with Houck going 5 innings in game 2 and coming back to pitch the 6th inning in game 4. However, Houck gave up that dinger in the 6th, so out came Taylor to pitch a perfect 7th. Unfortunately, Brasier pitched an awful 8th, giving up 2 runs, and Whitlock had to pitch the 8th and 9th to get the win.

 

Personally, I don't think it is luck, but I won't be shocked if Pivetta does not do well, next time.

 

I think many Sox fans felt we were pushing our luck with Richards as the closer/key set up man for a while, then Brasier & Robles.

 

I think Cora know how to pick spots where certain pitchers are best suited to succeed.

[mvp 78]

WIN THIS GAME.

 

thank you.

 

This AM:

 

Daughter: Who do the Red Sox play now?

Me: The Astros.

Daughter: Do we like the Astros?

Me: No, we like the Red Sox. You can like any team you want, but you absolutely cannot like the Yankees.

Daughter: Why?

Me: That's what Baga told me when I was your brother's age.

Daughter: Ok. Do you want the Red Sox to win every game?

Me: Yes.

Daughter: What happens if they win every game for the rest of the year?

Me: They win the world series.

Daughter: What happens then?

Me: They have a parade on the duck boats near the hotel we stayed at.

Daughter: Then I hope they win every game.

Me: Me too.

[YastrzemskI]

Get your s*** together Chris. The time for excuses is over and its that time again. That time to win a 10th World Series for the Boston Red Sox. Pitching a gem in the ALCS would be a good way to get off the mat Chris. Find your brass and dominate these fools like we all know you can.

Forget the noise and forget the last few starts. Take control and make H-Town look like a bunch of hacks.

 

Go SoX!

[Maxbialystock]

Personally, I don't think it is luck, but I won't be shocked if Pivetta does not do well, next time.

 

I think many Sox fans felt we were pushing our luck with Richards as the closer/key set up man for a while, then Brasier & Robles.

 

I think Cora know how to pick spots where certain pitchers are best suited to succeed.

 

It absolutely is not luck. In fact, having three long relievers available borders on genius. By my count Cora has used at least five relievers that way: Whitlock, Valdez, Richards, Houck, and finally Pivetta. Richards was semi-OK as a starter before going south, then came back brilliantly as a reliever, and finally couldn't make the cut for the season roster with a huge 13 arm pitching contingent.

 

Sale came back and did well, but then had two lousy starts against the Nats and the Rays. In both games Cora had no hesitation in pulling him early.

[Maxbialystock]

Get your s*** together Chris. The time for excuses is over and its that time again. That time to win a 10th World Series for the Boston Red Sox. Pitching a gem in the ALCS would be a good way to get off the mat Chris. Find your brass and dominate these fools like we all know you can.

Forget the noise and forget the last few starts. Take control and make H-Town look like a bunch of hacks.

 

Go SoX!

 

Oh, stop it.

 

The Sox and Cora right now are playing with house money because two weeks ago none of us thought the Sox would get to the ALCS.

 

And right now, until proven otherwise, the Sox have the upper hand in pitching, especially if McCullers can't start game 3.

 

I would never disagree that the Astros are still a threat and can win this ALCS. They've had good pitching and hitting all season long.

 

On the other hand, so did the Rays. Plus, against us, the Rays had the big advantage of not having to beat the Yankees in the wild card two days before starting the ALDS.

[jad]

Oh, stop it.

 

The Sox and Cora right now are playing with house money because two weeks ago none of us thought the Sox would get to the ALCS.

 

And right now, until proven otherwise, the Sox have the upper hand in pitching, especially if McCullers can't start game 3.

 

I would never disagree that the Astros are still a threat and can win this ALCS. They've had good pitching and hitting all season long.

 

On the other hand, so did the Rays. Plus, against us, the Rays had the big advantage of not having to beat the Yankees in the wild card two days before starting the ALDS.

 

It ain't house money if it's in your wallet. Go Sox.

[a700hitter]

Oh, stop it.

 

The Sox and Cora right now are playing with house money because two weeks ago none of us thought the Sox would get to the ALCS.

 

And right now, until proven otherwise, the Sox have the upper hand in pitching, especially if McCullers can't start game 3.

 

I would never disagree that the Astros are still a threat and can win this ALCS. They've had good pitching and hitting all season long.

 

On the other hand, so did the Rays. Plus, against us, the Rays had the big advantage of not having to beat the Yankees in the wild card two days before starting the ALDS.

You never know when you will get back to the ALCS. When you are in it, you have to go for it. I don’t buy into the “house money” notion.

[moonslav59]

It absolutely is not luck. In fact, having three long relievers available borders on genius. By my count Cora has used at least five relievers that way: Whitlock, Valdez, Richards, Houck, and finally Pivetta. Richards was semi-OK as a starter before going south, then came back brilliantly as a reliever, and finally couldn't make the cut for the season roster with a huge 13 arm pitching contingent.

 

Sale came back and did well, but then had two lousy starts against the Nats and the Rays. In both games Cora had no hesitation in pulling him early.

 

So, it was a 100% certainty that Pivetta was going to give a brilliant long relief effort?

 

Again, I would not call Cora lucky, but I can understand how someone can look at the names in our pen and wonder how they did so well without some luck being involved.

 

There were Sox fans screaming at Cora for even pitching Robles after his bas start with us. Same with using Richards in high leverage situations for quite a while. Some questioned why we even promoted Brasier, and soon he was our go-to guy.

 

I'm not sure the word "absolutely" is the best, but I do think Cora is masterful at getting the best out of just about everyone. Every move does not work out, and in hindsight we always heard about them. I guess one could argue those times were "bad luck." LOL.

 

Again, I'm agreeing with you. I don't think our pen or our team is "lucky." We make our own luck, and Cora is the best I have seen at getting players to be put in spots where they are most likely to succeed. Then, maybe some luck takes over. Over the long haul, the luck should even out and the choices a manger makes is what mattered.

[moonslav59]

Oh, stop it.

 

The Sox and Cora right now are playing with house money because two weeks ago none of us thought the Sox would get to the ALCS.

 

So, we got lucky?

[YastrzemskI]

Oh, stop it.

 

The Sox and Cora right now are playing with house money because two weeks ago none of us thought the Sox would get to the ALCS.

 

And right now, until proven otherwise, the Sox have the upper hand in pitching, especially if McCullers can't start game 3.

 

I would never disagree that the Astros are still a threat and can win this ALCS. They've had good pitching and hitting all season long.

 

On the other hand, so did the Rays. Plus, against us, the Rays had the big advantage of not having to beat the Yankees in the wild card two days before starting the ALDS.

 

Thanks for the reality check. :::eye roll:::

 

Your point makes sense once the season is over and we have a chance to reflect on it. Right now is not the time to be complacent. Save it. 100 win teams get bounced from division series all the time. We are in the ALCS after winning 92 ball games. Excuse me if I am cheering like hell for this team to focus and execute when it matters most. If they get outplayed while playing their best ball? Oh well. If they lose because they s*** all over themselves then it becomes disappointing. The whole “we are just happy to be there” theory does not apply to Red Sox baseball. This is too big of a market with too big of a payroll. Sure, I am elated with what this team has accomplished so far..

[moonslav59]

With the lefty going, we see Kike back to lead off, and Verdugo after JD (and Renfroe).

 

1. Kike CF

2. Schwarber 1B

3. Bogey SS

4. Devers 3B

5. JD DH

6. Renfroe RF

7. Verdugo LF

8. Arroyo 2B

9. Vaz C

 

(Maybe Cora decided to start Sale, so he could get Vaz into the line-up! LOL!)

 

This line-up has 11 HRs in this post season. The Astros line up has 4.

 

GO SOX!!!!

[Old Red]

With the lefty going, we see Kike back to lead off, and Verdugo after JD (and Renfroe).

 

1. Kike CF

2. Schwarber 1B

3. Bogey SS

4. Devers 3B

5. JD DH

6. Renfroe RF

7. Verdugo LF

8. Arroyo 2B

9. Vaz C

 

(Maybe Cora decided to start Sale, so he could get Vaz into the line-up! LOL!)

 

This line-up has 11 HRs in this post season. The Astros line up has 4.

 

GO SOX!!!!

 

Like I mentioned earlier I hope the 3 day layoff won’t affect the bats.

[Maxbialystock]

It ain't house money if it's in your wallet. Go Sox.

 

When you are "playing with house money," it's already in your pocket.

[Maxbialystock]

So, we got lucky?

 

Possibly. But I still like the way Cora managed the final series vs. the Nats, especially playing Schwarber and JDM with no DH and pulling Sale early in game 3. And I think he was terrific in the ALDS given that he couldn't start Eovaldi until game three and his first two starters, ERod and Sale, crapped out.

[Maxbialystock]

Thanks for the reality check. :::eye roll:::

 

Your point makes sense once the season is over and we have a chance to reflect on it. Right now is not the time to be complacent. Save it. 100 win teams get bounced from division series all the time. We are in the ALCS after winning 92 ball games. Excuse me if I am cheering like hell for this team to focus and execute when it matters most. If they get outplayed while playing their best ball? Oh well. If they lose because they s*** all over themselves then it becomes disappointing. The whole “we are just happy to be there” theory does not apply to Red Sox baseball. This is too big of a market with too big of a payroll. Sure, I am elated with what this team has accomplished so far..

 

I am the opposite of complacent, so I apologize if I seem that way. Yes, I like our chances after the ALDS and with McCullers not on the Astros Roster, but they are still a tough out. I just don't think the ALCS depends on what Sale does tonight.