A Realistic View at 2022: Part I

[mvp 78]

The second one is 18 for 6.

 

Is 3 years of Trivino a real coup?

[moonslav59]

Is 3 years of Trivino a real coup?

 

Maybe.

 

2 years of Montas is much more of a known than those 18 years of prospects.

 

I think Trivino is worth more than what BTV gives him.

 

Montas is pretty damn good and just entering prime.

[moonslav59]

Tell me more about the joys of 2005, 2006, 2010, 2012, 2014, 2015 and 2020. Were those seasons fun for everyone? If there weren't a few WS flags in there, don't you think that fans would be more pissed. If the playoffs are a crapshoot, you can't guarantee to get a ring every few years while alternating with pissing off your fans. At some point, you'll just piss off your fans and end the season with a loss for a few decades.

 

Many of those years had plenty of joys, and I would not trade a single championship for better in between seasons.

 

Maybe we lose a couple fans here and there, when their favorite player(s) are let go, but we've done a very good job replacing them with exciting new players rather quickly, and bring a ring every 4-5 years.

 

We were able to do that by not getting too nostalgic about aging stars.

 

Only Betts was let go pre-prime. When that starts to become a pattern, we'll talk again.

[mvp 78]

Many of those years had plenty of joys, and I would not trade a single championship for better in between seasons.

 

Maybe we lose a couple fans here and there, when their favorite player(s) are let go, but we've done a very good job replacing them with exciting new players rather quickly, and bring a ring every 4-5 years.

 

We were able to do that by not getting too nostalgic about aging stars.

 

Only Betts was let go pre-prime. When that starts to become a pattern, we'll talk again.

 

The players that were perceived to have been let go early in their career:

Lester

Betts

Ellsbury

 

Everyone else mentioned was let go when their career was on the downturn, even if some had productive seasons left. With Betts, you could see 10 more productive seasons. If Bogey leaves, you could see another 6-7 years. Raffy? Another 10 years if he leaves.

 

The worry is that there are legit concerns about Bogey and Raffy staying. Letting homegrown players like that walk is a bad look for a "big market" team. The sting is much less if it happens when they are 34.

[moonslav59]

The players that were perceived to have been let go early in their career:

Lester

Betts

Ellsbury

 

Everyone else mentioned was let go when their career was on the downturn, even if some had productive seasons left. With Betts, you could see 10 more productive seasons. If Bogey leaves, you could see another 6-7 years. Raffy? Another 10 years if he leaves.

 

The worry is that there are legit concerns about Bogey and Raffy staying. Letting homegrown players like that walk is a bad look for a "big market" team. The sting is much less if it happens when they are 34.

 

Damon and Lowe, too.

 

Some were pissed we let lackey go before his contract was up or that we did not extend him.

[moonslav59]

Damon and Lowe, too.

 

 

Some were pissed we let Lackey go before his contract was up or that we did not extend him, despite not being "early in his career."

 

We got over Lester, though, didn't we?

 

We won on the Ellsbury non-move..

[mvp 78]

Damon and Lowe, too.

 

Some were pissed we let lackey go before his contract was up or that we did not extend him.

 

Lowe left after his age 31 season with so much baggage that he needed a Uhaul to leave the stadium.

[mvp 78]

Some were pissed we let Lackey go before his contract was up or that we did not extend him, despite not being "early in his career."

 

We got over Lester, though, didn't we?

 

We won on the Ellsbury non-move..

 

No, because we got Price instead and continue to litigate it.

[notin]

Damon and Lowe, too.

 

Some were pissed we let lackey go before his contract was up or that we did not extend him.

 

Well, we would have missed out on Allen Craig...

[moonslav59]

Lowe left after his age 31 season with so much baggage that he needed a Uhaul to leave the stadium.

 

Some fans were upset we let him go, and we got over losing him and won again.

[moonslav59]

No, because we got Price instead and continue to litigate it.

 

Some fans were upset we let him go, and we got over losing him and won again.

[moonslav59]

Well, we would have missed out on Allen Craig...

 

And Joe Kelly!

[mvp 78]

Some fans were upset we let him go, and we got over losing him and won again.

 

And what if the next championship doesn't come in 5 years?

[notin]

No, because we got Price instead and continue to litigate it.

 

Do you really think having Lester would have given any pause to Dombrowski when it came to signing Price? He did still go out and get Sale, after all..

[notin]

Is 3 years of Trivino a real coup?

 

They might be more valuable than 6 years of Seabold...

[mvp 78]

Do you really think having Lester would have given any pause to Dombrowski when it came to signing Price? He did still go out and get Sale, after all..

 

Yes.

[mvp 78]

They might be more valuable than 6 years of Seabold...

 

Is someone suggesting a one for one?

[notin]

Is someone suggesting a one for one?

 

Would it make sense?

[notin]

Yes.

 

I don't think it's all that likely. If the Sox had Lester in 2015, I would be very surprised if Dombrowski still did not go out and get Price, whom he did acquire before. More likely, is he did not go after Sale, since that move came later...

[moonslav59]

And what if the next championship doesn't come in 5 years?

 

That has nothing to do with us letting Lowe, Damon, Ellsbury and Lester go.

 

As for Betts, we've already had an exciting season since letting him go, but if 5 years from now, some fans stop supporting us over letting Betts and maybe others go, then you'll have a point.

[mvp 78]

Would it make sense?

 

I could be sold on Trivino for Seabold.

[mvp 78]

That has nothing to do with us letting Lowe, Damon, Ellsbury and Lester go.

 

As for Betts, we've already had an exciting season since letting him go, but if 5 years from now, some fans stop supporting us over letting Betts and maybe others go, then you'll have a point.

 

Lowe and Damon weren't homegrown or that beloved.

[moonslav59]

Lowe and Damon weren't homegrown or that beloved.

 

Oh, it's only homegrown players fans get upset about letting go?

 

I think this debate is going off track.

 

My point is, if we keep putting winning and or exciting teams on the field or teams that win it all every 4-6 years, I think fans will forgive GMs that let stars get away.

 

Again, I'm not sure why we are reading so much into letting Betts go and that being our new norm. Part of the reason we let Betts go was because we went large and long on Sale and Bogey. It's not like we are going cheap, despite what a few posters think.

[mvp 78]

Oh, it's only homegrown players fans get upset about letting go?

 

I think this debate is going off track.

 

My point is, if we keep putting winning and or exciting teams on the field or teams that win it all every 4-6 years, I think fans will forgive GMs that let stars get away.

 

Again, I'm not sure why we are reading so much into letting Betts go and that being our new norm. Part of the reason we let Betts go was because we went large and long on Sale and Bogey. It's not like we are going cheap, despite what a few posters think.

 

It's coming back around now that Bogey is coming due and there are signals out there that they may not extend him.

[mvp 78]

Oh, it's only homegrown players fans get upset about letting go?

 

I think this debate is going off track.

 

My point is, if we keep putting winning and or exciting teams on the field or teams that win it all every 4-6 years, I think fans will forgive GMs that let stars get away.

 

Again, I'm not sure why we are reading so much into letting Betts go and that being our new norm. Part of the reason we let Betts go was because we went large and long on Sale and Bogey. It's not like we are going cheap, despite what a few posters think.

 

Lowe wasn't a very beloved ballplayer. Prior to the 04 playoffs, nobody would have given 2 shits if he left.

 

Damon was the veritable hired gun. It sucked that he left, but I don't know if people had the attachment to him and saw him as a face of the franchise the way they did for Betts or Lester. I can't equate losing Lowe and Damon to losing Raffy and Bogey. It doesn't seem similar enough to me.

[Bellhorn04]

Oh, it's only homegrown players fans get upset about letting go?

 

I think this debate is going off track.

 

My point is, if we keep putting winning and or exciting teams on the field or teams that win it all every 4-6 years, I think fans will forgive GMs that let stars get away.

 

Again, I'm not sure why we are reading so much into letting Betts go and that being our new norm. Part of the reason we let Betts go was because we went large and long on Sale and Bogey. It's not like we are going cheap, despite what a few posters think.

 

Yeah, this seems like some pre-judging to me.

[Bellhorn04]

It's coming back around now that Bogey is coming due and there are signals out there that they may not extend him.

 

What signals?

[notin]

It's coming back around now that Bogey is coming due and there are signals out there that they may not extend him.

 

Has thee been any chatter that the Sox will not extend him? I now it is out there that he plans to opt out, which is not exactly surprising news. Chatter or not, he is opting out...

[moonslav59]

It's coming back around now that Bogey is coming due and there are signals out there that they may not extend him.

 

I haven't heard any.

 

We know Bogey will want a big payday and likely will not go for any home discount.

 

If we fail to overpay him, and some fans get upset, so be it.

 

Just keep winning, Bloom, and I'll support anything you do.

[moonslav59]

Has thee been any chatter that the Sox will not extend him? I now it is out there that he plans to opt out, which is not exactly surprising news. Chatter or not, he is opting out...

 

My guess is we make him an offer to extend. If he turns it down, we'll have to decide to trade him or offer him a QO.

 

If he becomes a FA and we offer him fair market value, but someone else overpays, fine with me.