Who should the Sox have play CF on opening day?

[Bellhorn04]

The bottom line is, it appears even the Red Sox cannot have too many players making over $20 million per season. And especially not if they have no one who makes the league minimum capable of cracking the starting lineup...

 

Yep, the $20's add up all too quickly.

[dgalehouse]

You are hereby appointed the new Cooler.

 

No. I am just another jabroni who is not too thrilled with things at the moment. That could change. Harmony will always be the true " Cooler."

[harmony]

I hope I'm proven wrong, but I don't share as much enthusiasm on Duran as many here.

 

He's got great speed, but his defense needs work. He had some pretty good offensive numbers, but the BAbip and other numbers point to the chance of it not being as good as the numbers indicate.

 

He probably needs at least 3-4 more months at AAA, assuming there is play next spring.

 

soxprospects.com has this...

 

Summation: Potential fringe starting outfielder with two carrying tools. Ceiling of an everyday center fielder. Nailing down his future projection is tough without a chance to evaluate swing changes made in 2020 without true game action. Speed is not a question, and hit tool should get to above-average if he can refine his approach. If 2020 power development is real, he could become a dynamic offensive player. Has already shown strong ability to make contact and drive the ball into the gaps. With his speed, has the potential to put a lot of pressure on the defense and inflate his average with infield singles and slugging by taking extra bases. Could also steal 30-plus bases if he improves his instincts. Is still continuing to develop in center field, but likely to develop into at least an average defender there and has the raw tools to become an above-average defender. Has one surefire major league impact tool in his speed, so should have a role on a major league roster even in the worst-case scenario, especially if MLB retains the runner-on-second rule in extra innings going forward.

 

https://soxprospects.com/players/duran-jarren.htm

Trivia: When Jarren Duran was playing for Cypress (CA) High School, down the street Dylan Moore was playing for Cypress College. This year Moore posted 1.7 bWAR and 1.4 fWAR in only 38 games playing seven positions with the Seattle Mariners.

[moonslav59]

No. I am just another jabroni who is not too thrilled with things at the moment. That could change. Harmony will always be the true " Cooler."

 

or not

 

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Denard Span played 2B in the AL East last season?

 

Nope, Span played all of 43 games with the Rays, who then traded him with Alex Colome for two more prospects (neither of whom played in the majors last summer). Span finished out '18 with the Ms, was granted free agency, and hasn't sniffed the bigs since.

[notin]

Nope, Span played all of 43 games with the Rays, who then traded him with Alex Colome for two more prospects (neither of whom played in the majors last summer). Span finished out '18 with the Ms, was granted free agency, and hasn't sniffed the bigs since.

 

So?

 

Span has been worth 28 fWAR for his pretty good MLB career. Arroyo has only topped 28 games in a season onetime and has been worth -0.2 fWAR.

 

Not even close who the best player in that trade was...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

So?

 

Span has been worth 28 fWAR for his pretty good MLB career. Arroyo has only topped 28 games in a season onetime and has been worth -0.2 fWAR.

 

Not even close who the best player in that trade was...

 

I wasn't talking about careers -- when I said "turned out to be" I meant since the trade. Arroyo at least played the last month of '20 for the Sox. Of the other two guys, Stephen Wood pitched his first 1 1/3 MLB innings for KC this summer, while Matt Krook has yet to make majors.

 

Maybe it was just a genius salary dump by Bloom, but all four players in the return for a 50 WAR third baseman were with different organizations within two years.

[Bellhorn04]

I wasn't talking about careers -- when I said "turned out to be" I meant since the trade. Arroyo at least played the last month of '20 for the Sox. Of the other two guys, Stephen Wood pitched his first 1 1/3 MLB innings for KC this summer, while Matt Krook has yet to make majors.

 

Maybe it was just a genius salary dump by Bloom, but all four players in the return for a 50 WAR third baseman were with different organizations within two years.

 

What is that third baseman's WAR since the trade though?

[harmony]

Nope, Span played all of 43 games with the Rays, who then traded him with Alex Colome for two more prospects (neither of whom played in the majors last summer). Span finished out '18 with the Ms, was granted free agency, and hasn't sniffed the bigs since.

One of those prospects, righthander Andrew Moore, was actually a post-prospect who had hurled five quality starts the previous season. Indeed Moore did not play in 2020.

[notin]

I wasn't talking about careers -- when I said "turned out to be" I meant since the trade. Arroyo at least played the last month of '20 for the Sox. Of the other two guys, Stephen Wood pitched his first 1 1/3 MLB innings for KC this summer, while Matt Krook has yet to make majors.

 

Maybe it was just a genius salary dump by Bloom, but all four players in the return for a 50 WAR third baseman were with different organizations within two years.

 

Oh it was a salary dump. Span had a much lesser contract he was willing to take back.

 

Arroyo was a bust for the Rays, playing in fewer games than even Span did before being shipped to Cleveland for a fringey A-ball payer and some bonus slot money.

 

The only things Arroyo has going for him now is that he is still fairly young (25) and coming off a good 15 game stretch for the Red Sox. And while he is in the running for a starting 2B position by default, there is no guarantee he wins that role or is able to hold it for a full season...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Oh it was a salary dump. Span had a much lesser contract he was willing to take back.

 

Arroyo was a bust for the Rays, playing in fewer games than even Span did before being shipped to Cleveland for a fringey A-ball payer and some bonus slot money.

 

The only things Arroyo has going for him now is that he is still fairly young (25) and coming off a good 15 game stretch for the Red Sox. And while he is in the running for a starting 2B position by default, there is no guarantee he wins that role or is able to hold it for a full season...

 

They'll give him a shot. Among all the baubles Bloom picked up at the MLB tag sale, Arroyo was one of the few that shined if you held him just right in the light. But I wouldn't plan on taking his rookie card to the Antiques Roadshow in 20 years.

[moonslav59]

They'll give him a shot. Among all the baubles Bloom picked up at the MLB tag sale, Arroyo was one of the few that shined if you held him just right in the light. But I wouldn't plan on taking his rookie card to the Antiques Roadshow in 20 years.

 

We will likely add a better profile 2Bman, this winter, perhaps one who can play CF, too. Notin mentioned Brad Miller's name.

 

Maybe Bloom has faith in one of the players we have rising up next year, but I don't. There's a saying that "there is strength in numbers," but I'm not sure that means much here.

 

Current 2B contenders (I won't list Pedey):

Arroyo

Chavis

Arauz (does not need to stay on 26 man roster)

Chatham (maybe be traded or DFA'd for rule 5 or FA additions.)

Downs (not on 40 man roster)

Perhaps Dalbec could be moved to 2B, but with no 1Bman, I don't see any reason to do that. Plus, he would likely be a negative on defense at 2B.)

 

[Larry Cook]

Downs is the key to who plays second base for next season.

 

If downs is one year away, we can sign schoop on a one year deal.

 

If downs is two years away, we can sign wong on a two year deal.

[harmony]

Downs is the key to who plays second base for next season.

 

If downs is one year away, we can sign schoop on a one year deal.

 

If downs is two years away, we can sign wong on a two year deal.

Jonathan Schoop and Kolten Wong may shun the Red Sox.

 

Or not.

[Bellhorn04]

Jonathan Schoop and Kolten Wong may shun the Red Sox.

 

Or not.

 

How does this add anything to a discussion?

[Thunder]

Downs is the key to who plays second base for next season.

 

If downs is one year away, we can sign schoop on a one year deal.

 

If downs is two years away, we can sign wong on a two year deal.

 

I have concerns about Downs, most of which stem from my fear that he will be swinging for the Downs on every pitch

[dgalehouse]

40% of those surveyed down at Clancy's thought Jeter Downs was a small racetrack in Alabama.

[mvp 78]

How does this add anything to a discussion?

 

It doesn't. I'm not sure that's ever harmony's point.

[mvp 78]

"Downs only has a few AB's above A."

 

He faced much better pitchers last year at the alternate site. Coaches think his problem isn't talent, just that he doesn't take practice as seriously as he needs to. I don't think he makes the opening day roster, but if he plays well in AAA, he should be promoted.

 

I think the Sox should punt on 2b or just get a guy for 1 year. I don't think this team will do better than WC contender. No reason to sign high priced contracts unless they are guys that can help you 3-5 years from now.

[moonslav59]

Duran will not be on the 26 man roster opening day.

 

We should have ranked- choice voting, here.

[mvp 78]

Duran will not be on the 26 man roster opening day.

 

We should have ranked- choice voting, here.

 

Talk to the mods about that one. It's not a poll option.

[notin]

"Downs only has a few AB's above A."

 

He faced much better pitchers last year at the alternate site. Coaches think his problem isn't talent, just that he doesn't take practice as seriously as he needs to. I don't think he makes the opening day roster, but if he plays well in AAA, he should be promoted.

 

I think the Sox should punt on 2b or just get a guy for 1 year. I don't think this team will do better than WC contender. No reason to sign high priced contracts unless they are guys that can help you 3-5 years from now.

 

There really aren't any 2B free agents that merit a deal greter than 1-2 years anyway. Except maybe Kolten Wong, and even he is not guaranteed to get 3 years.

 

There's a good chance the Sox punt CF. How many positions should they punt?

[mvp 78]

There really aren't any 2B free agents that merit a deal greter than 1-2 years anyway. Except maybe Kolten Wong, and even he is not guaranteed to get 3 years.

 

There's a good chance the Sox punt CF. How many positions should they punt?

 

By "punt" I mean "just grab a guy on a one year deal (unless it's JBJ)." When they are behind in August, just trade them away again.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

There really aren't any 2B free agents that merit a deal greter than 1-2 years anyway. Except maybe Kolten Wong, and even he is not guaranteed to get 3 years.

 

There's a good chance the Sox punt CF. How many positions should they punt?

 

Come on, we can do better than a football metphor. How about, should they Bauer (chuck a ball over the centerfield fence)? Or should they just Steamer (bounce a pitch to the backstop with the World Series-tying run on third)? It might be too confusing to pull a Manny (cutoff a Damon relay, bounce a comebacker to the mound and U-turn to the dugout, or leave the bat on your shoulder and take three straight down the middle from Rivera)...

[notin]

By "punt" I mean "just grab a guy on a one year deal (unless it's JBJ)." When they are behind in August, just trade them away again.

 

I think with 2B and CF, the plan is short term guys. Unless they go all in for Springer or Ozuna. But I don't consider that very likely...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I think with 2B and CF, the plan is short term guys. Unless they go all in for Springer or Ozuna. But I don't consider that very likely...

 

Placeholders for Lugo and Yorke, both at least 6 footers... and the DP combo for the next great Red Sox team (unless they're converted to outfielders by then).

[mvp 78]

Placeholders for Lugo and Yorke, both at least 6 footers... and the DP combo for the next great Red Sox team (unless they're converted to outfielders by then).

 

Yorke could be really good, I'm not sold on Lugo. I don't think the future SS exists in the org right now.

[notin]

Placeholders for Lugo and Yorke, both at least 6 footers... and the DP combo for the next great Red Sox team (unless they're converted to outfielders by then).

 

Yes, let's start garnering placeholders for Yorke and Lugo. Why wait until they play in Greenville? No point in stalling...

[notin]

Yorke could be really good, I'm not sold on Lugo. I don't think the future SS exists in the org right now.

 

Chad De La Guerra!! Pencil him in!!

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Yorke could be really good, I'm not sold on Lugo. I don't think the future SS exists in the org right now.

 

Lugo was the best amateur hitter in Puerto Rico; wasn't he a star pupil at Carlos Beltran's academy... uh oh.