A Realistic View at 2021: Part I

[notin]

Should have signed Jayson Werth rather than a second CFer.

 

I suspected they knew Ellsbury was leaving so they got their replacement when he was available rather than waiting..

[mvp 78]

I suspected they knew Ellsbury was leaving so they got their replacement when he was available rather than waiting..

 

They were worried about Ells leaving 3+ years later?

[moonslav59]

True.

 

Chalk me up as one who gets overly critical of many FA signings. But sometimes I will admit the failure is on the part of the player and not on the notion of bringing him to Boston. Carl Crawford was a massive flop, but I did understand why they signed him. Or at least I had my own completely unsupported theory as to why the move made sense...

 

I hated the signing from day one.

 

CC had bad splits and 7 years was 3-4 years too long. (I remember calling him a "glorified platoon player" on that other blog.)

 

Now, I never expected him to be THAT bad.

[mvp 78]

I hated the signing from day one.

 

CC had bad splits and 7 years was 3-4 years too long. (I remember calling him a "glorified platoon player" on that other blog.)

 

Now, I never expected him to be THAT bad.

 

Never trust the "sign that guy because he's a Red Sox killer" guys.

[moonslav59]

Never trust the "sign that guy because he's a Red Sox killer" guys.

 

That, too.

 

Had we not traded CC, we might be looking at that signing as the worst ever.

[moonslav59]

Martin Perez. Please, let this not be one of our major winter moves.

[notin]

They were worried about Ells leaving 3+ years later?

 

 

Ellsbury was a Boras client who followed his agent’s advice about reaching free agency. If the Sox wanted another leadoff hitting replacement, Crawford was one of the best in the game at the time and was coming off an MVP caliber season. Should the Sox have waited a couple years for a lesser player?

[moonslav59]

ellsbury was a boras client who followed his agent’s advice about reaching free agency. If the sox wanted another leadoff hitting replacement, crawford was one of the best in the game at the time and was coming off an mvp caliber season. Should the sox have waited a couple years for a lesser player?

 

yes!

[moonslav59]

Chatham traded to Phillies for P.T.B.N.L...

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/01/red-sox-trade-c-j-chatham-prospect-phillies.html

 

Makes room for Perez.

[Bellhorn04]

Chatham traded to Phillies for P.T.B.N.L...

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/01/red-sox-trade-c-j-chatham-prospect-phillies.html

 

Maybe this is a move to make room for a signing or trade addition.

 

I think it made room for Perez.

[moonslav59]

I think it made room for Perez.

 

Yes. I amended my post.

[mvp 78]

chatham traded to phillies for p.t.b.n.l...

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/01/red-sox-trade-c-j-chatham-prospect-phillies.html

 

makes room for perez.

rip

[Larry Cook]

Another season of watching Perez pitch in Boston. The hitters throughout the rest of the division are ecstatic!

[Sox75]

Realistically?

 

https://www.masslive.com/redsox/2021/01/andrew-benintendi-trade-rumors-boston-red-sox-outfielders-66m-salary-should-temper-any-expectations-of-a-strong-return-report.html

 

The headline is likely pretty accurate.

 

https://www.yardbarker.com/mlb/articles/red_sox_chairman_we_expect_to_be_competitive_next_year/s1_13237_32897294

 

https://www.radio.com/weei/sports/red-sox/tom-werner-we-spend-and-were-not-a-small-market-team

 

TW:

"We don’t have any excuses. We’ve got a lot of assets and, as everybody knows, we spend and we’re not a small-market team. We’re going to be back next year."

 

I'm kinda thinking this was ********.

 

We are clearly selling off & rebuilding from the ground level.

 

Just managing my expectations.

Edited January 19, 2021 by Sox75

[jacksonianmarch]

Another season of watching Perez pitch in Boston. The hitters throughout the rest of the division are ecstatic!

 

Perez vs the RH bashers in Toronto and NY. Oh boy, looking forward to that

[Sox75]

Perez vs the RH bashers in Toronto and NY. Oh boy, looking forward to that

 

LOL :0 now that's just flat mean spirited

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Mike Lowell, as quoted today by Rob Bradford, about the recruitment of free agents:

 

'"It’s the winning," said Lowell regarding one of the chief factors when it comes to free agents choosing their next homes. "The fact that you’re kind of projected to not be one of the better teams, and you’re in that market, it does affect you. How do you change it? Get the good players and start winning it will be a snowball effect, trust me."'

 

Let it flurry.

[notin]

Mike Lowell, as quoted today by Rob Bradford, about the recruitment of free agents:

 

'"It’s the winning," said Lowell regarding one of the chief factors when it comes to free agents choosing their next homes. "The fact that you’re kind of projected to not be one of the better teams, and you’re in that market, it does affect you. How do you change it? Get the good players and start winning it will be a snowball effect, trust me."'

 

Let it flurry.

 

Yep that’s exactly what Mike Minor said as he signed the largest contract for a SP this off-season. With Kansas City.

 

Probably a big factor in Kevin Gausman accepting his QO. The Giants should win 40% of the time, after all. It adds up...

[Bellhorn04]

Mike Lowell, as quoted today by Rob Bradford, about the recruitment of free agents:

 

'"It’s the winning," said Lowell regarding one of the chief factors when it comes to free agents choosing their next homes. "The fact that you’re kind of projected to not be one of the better teams, and you’re in that market, it does affect you. How do you change it? Get the good players and start winning it will be a snowball effect, trust me."'

 

Let it flurry.

 

Seems to set up a classic Catch-22: in order to be able to get good players, you have to get good players first!

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Seems to set up a classic Catch-22: in order to be able to get good players, you have to get good players first!

 

Easier said than done; last year Number 22 was worn by Chris Mazza...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Yep that’s exactly what Mike Minor said as he signed the largest contract for a SP this off-season. With Kansas City.

 

Probably a big factor in Kevin Gausman accepting his QO. The Giants should win 40% of the time, after all. It adds up...

 

Admittedly, there are other factors. Clemens refused to play for a team that made him carry his own luggage. Adrian Gonzalez couldn't tolerate a big market so popular that national TV forced him to play on Sunday nights. Cut these guys some slack.

[oldtimer]

Yep that’s exactly what Mike Minor said as he signed the largest contract for a SP this off-season. With Kansas City.

 

Probably a big factor in Kevin Gausman accepting his QO. The Giants should win 40% of the time, after all. It adds up...

 

He wasn't saying it was the only factor, but it is one of many. Contract offered, weather, location of family, etc. will all bear upon where they go but if I was making a choice, I would opt for a winning organization if all other things were close to equal.

[Bellhorn04]

Perez vs the RH bashers in Toronto and NY. Oh boy, looking forward to that

 

Perez pitched against both the Jays and Yanks in September and gave up 1 run in 12.2 innings.

[Bellhorn04]

He wasn't saying it was the only factor, but it is one of many. Contract offered, weather, location of family, etc. will all bear upon where they go but if I was making a choice, I would opt for a winning organization if all other things were close to equal.

 

I'm a bit cynical, I think most players take the highest dollar offer.

 

I'm reasonably sure Boston was not David Price's first pick of destinations. But $217 million overcame that quite nicely.

 

Last offseason there were reportedly 3 teams bidding on Gerrit Cole: Yankees, Dodgers and Angels. The Dodgers and Angels hung in there at 8 years * 36 mill. The Yankees bumped it to 9 years and won the auction. That's how Cole picked his favorite destination.

[notin]

He wasn't saying it was the only factor, but it is one of many. Contract offered, weather, location of family, etc. will all bear upon where they go but if I was making a choice, I would opt for a winning organization if all other things were close to equal.

 

But where does winning fall? And how often are all things equal?

 

Money and/or years appear to definitely take precedence over winning organizations. Some aging players who have already bankrolled enough money to last several lifetimes occasionally go to a team they think can get them a chance, but players in their prime on that one deal that they have been working for their entire lives seem to prioritize winning far lower on that list, despite what they say to the press...

[notin]

Admittedly, there are other factors. Clemens refused to play for a team that made him carry his own luggage. Adrian Gonzalez couldn't tolerate a big market so popular that national TV forced him to play on Sunday nights. Cut these guys some slack.

 

I'd say there are lots of other factors. In fact, a lot of players seem to think they can be the one who turns a bad organization into a winner, even if their actual history says otherwise...

[moonslav59]

Money has to be the number one factor- by far.

 

If two offers are very close, then other factors play a role.

 

There are exceptions to this, of course, but it's about the money.

[notin]

I'm a bit cynical, I think most players take the highest dollar offer.

 

I'm reasonably sure Boston was not David Price's first pick of destinations. But $217 million overcame that quite nicely.

 

Last offseason there were reportedly 3 teams bidding on Gerrit Cole: Yankees, Dodgers and Angels. The Dodgers and Angels hung in there at 8 years * 36 mill. The Yankees bumped it to 9 years and won the auction. That's how Cole picked his favorite destination.

 

Exactly.

 

Think "winning" was on Price's mind when he joined a team coming of two consecutive last place finishes? Based on 2015 record alone, one would think 19 other teams should have offered a "better chance to win"...

[notin]

Money has to be the number one factor- by far.

 

If two offers are very close, then other factors play a role.

 

There are exceptions to this, of course, but it's about the money.

 

My point, and it seems to run counter to Mike Lowell's point.

 

For every free agent who signed for less dollars to play for a winner, I can name 100 who did not. Probably more, but 100 should get the point across...

[moonslav59]

My point, and it seems to run counter to Mike Lowell's point.

 

For every free agent who signed for less dollars to play for a winner, I can name 100 who did not. Probably more, but 100 should get the point across...

 

Plus, the few that signed for the "winner" or "home town team" they want to play with, usually did NOT leave a heap of money on the table. either.