Mookie Betts and David Price have been traded to Dodgers

[moonslav59]

We must really not want Maeda.

[Larry Cook]

Really wish we could have gotten the Tampa analytics dept to come to Fenway.

 

Desperate Dave ran off all of our brightest and best and now all we have left are a few “D” players, a hand full of high school drop outs, a dozen developmentally challenged kids and a guy running the department who couldn’t get laid in a women’s prison!

 

No wonder Henry cheaped out and got them fake championship rings! Ouch!

[Station 13]

Exactly. Even SD wanted us to take Myers to get Betts.

 

It was never happening. They get Mookie but wants to give us Myers? I would slam a steel door in their face.

[Station 13]

Dodgers really wants Betts. Make them bend backwards.

[moonslav59]

Dodgers really wants Betts. Make them bend backwards.

 

After teasing fans, you'd think they would, and they have plenty of prospects as good as Graterol.

 

They can also trade Maeda for a prospect to replace the one they give us.

[harmony]

Dodgers really wants Betts. Make them bend backwards.

Perhaps not as badly as the Red Sox want to get under the luxury tax threshold (and out from under some of the $96 million owed David Price).

[moonslav59]

Perhaps not as badly as the Red Sox want to get under the luxury tax threshold (and out from under some of the $96 million owed David Price).

 

They both have incentives, but Dodger fans will be pissed. Red Sox fans- not.

 

(Not that this is the main reason for which team blinks first.)

[cp176]

I think it would be rad as heck if the Red Sox were delaying this whole trade because of the backlash but that assumes 1) they didn’t anticipate backlash, which would be truly insane and 2) they care more about backlash than the luxury tax... they for sure *look* bad, which has been their forte for ~18 months

 

Jh is a torn man and regardless of how much discussion there is here about the financial ramifications and obligations of the billion dollar franchise budget, most of the people - the actual people - who love and follow the game could likely give one sweet s*** about going over the luxury tax and all that comes with it. It does not make them less educated either. Ultimately it is about who is going to be playing in the Red Sox uniform. Letting Mookie Betts go for anything less than a haul of bluechip prospects is ridiculous. He is a generational talent - the franchise can afford to pay him. I would also say that if they allow him to walk with expectations of signing him during the next off season - I don't think so. Once he is gone, he'll be gone for good. Like it or not, our ownership has to be concerned about the effect this putrid deal will have on its fan base.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Jh is a torn man and regardless of how much discussion there is here about the financial ramifications and obligations of the billion dollar franchise budget, most of the people - the actual people - who love and follow the game could likely give one sweet s*** about going over the luxury tax and all that comes with it. It does not make them less educated either. Ultimately it is about who is going to be playing in the Red Sox uniform. Letting Mookie Betts go for anything less than a haul of bluechip prospects is ridiculous. He is a generational talent - the franchise can afford to pay him. I would also say that if they allow him to walk with expectations of signing him during the next off season - I don't think so. Once he is gone, he'll be gone for good. Like it or not, our ownership has to be concerned about the effect this putrid deal will have on its fan base.

 

I agree with all of this. The Red Sox have to reconsider their overall fan base (public opinion even supersedes the many rational and statistically-valued proposals proffered by posters here) -- As do the Dodgers, whose title-starved fans already have Mookie pencilled in at the top of their order.

 

Boston cannot settle for anything less than top prospects in exchange for its best homegrown player in half a century. LA has the pieces to get this deal done, but you're right -- Henry and Co. also have the funds to keep the face of the franchise... and then let Bloom really earn his own salary by lopping off everyone else necessary to reset by the end of the season.

[mvp 78]

1st off i love Mookie in boston, generational talent. But mookie in boston @ 12/420 no thanks. One player in todays game doesnt win championships.

 

Mike Trout is the best player we have seen in years and hes not won a championship so yes the game is team and not individual. I think 10/300 is market but big money for long term deals never works out good and franchises suffer for years because of them. So say you tried and mookie just wanted to go year to year well this is boston and we aint letting you go to the highest bidder next off season and just get a draft pick.

 

I love the dodgers prospect. Hes a cocky kid that can f***ing hit and he hits the opposite way off the wall all day and his bat is going to play well in boston. Controllable and a potential 20hrs/30sb guy at the top of the order. Peter gammons put out a lineup the other day and i still think we will contend because hopefully the yanks all get hurt and we need a solid #3 starter and use the twins guy in the setup or closer roll and get under the lux tax and reset and then spend spend spend next year.

 

I think the deal gets done with the dodgers adding a mid tier high reward SP prospect and the deal gets done.

 

Trout’s contract isn’t why the Angels stink. Trout is the only reason they aren’t the Orioles. Bad farm. Bad talent around Trout EVEN BEFORE THE BIG CONTRACT.

[mvp 78]

Any chance bloom gets the twins pitcher replaced by gray so this deal can go through?

 

No.

[mvp 78]

Perhaps not as badly as the Red Sox want to get under the luxury tax threshold (and out from under some of the $96 million owed David Price).

 

Agree

[jung]

The Angels have had a payroll of between $146-$166M the last 5 years. Yes, you can't win by paying anyone Trout money with that payroll, but maybe you can if you spend that much on one guy and also spend $186-$243M the last 5 years.

 

Could the Angels win had they spent $40-100M more on other players around Trout?

 

I get the argument, and I know it's a big risk. Not spending that much on Betts makes sense, but I'd do everything I can to keep him. (I doubt it takes $420/10. He would probably sign for $400/13.)

 

A 13 year contract. Outstanding. How many dead years is that at the end.....3-4?

[jung]

Trout’s contract isn’t why the Angels stink. Trout is the only reason they aren’t the Orioles. Bad farm. Bad talent around Trout EVEN BEFORE THE BIG CONTRACT.

 

 

And the angels are exactly the kind of franchise that will bank on a Trout being their entire marketing effort. The Sox aren't.

[mvp 78]

A 13 year contract. Outstanding. How many dead years is that at the end.....3-4?

 

At least you admit that the first 10 years would be worth it.

[mvp 78]

And the angels are exactly the kind of franchise that will bank on a Trout being their entire marketing effort. The Sox aren't.

 

Trout’c contract has nothing to do with them sucking. That’s all.

[mvp 78]

Just go look at the Angels’ team payroll. No pitching. Overpaid offensive guys not named Trout. Trout is the only contract that makes sense.

[mvp 78]

If Trout’s contract was the reason they sucked, there’d be a correlation between the Angels winning when they paid Trout nothing and losing when they paid him a lot. It’s not the case.

[jung]

I agree with all of this. The Red Sox have to reconsider their overall fan base (public opinion even supersedes the many rational and statistically-valued proposals proffered by posters here) -- As do the Dodgers, whose title-starved fans already have Mookie pencilled in at the top of their order.

 

Boston cannot settle for anything less than top prospects in exchange for its best homegrown player in half a century. LA has the pieces to get this deal done, but you're right -- Henry and Co. also have the funds to keep the face of the franchise... and then let Bloom really earn his own salary by lopping off everyone else necessary to reset by the end of the season.

 

There are five key elements to the Sox marketing effort and none of them involve individual players:

1. Fenway Park

2. Promoting Speculation about the potential greatness of any particular edition of the team

3. The Sox various and sundry charitable efforts and endeavors

4. NESN

5. The other sports endeavors of Fenway Group

 

I am surprised at their willingness to give up on item 2 for this season. Other than that, they give up nothing in the key elements of their marketing effort in giving up Mookie. I happen to think giving up on item 2 is a big one for them. Obviously they think they will survive it and THEY are probably right.

 

When I was a season ticket holder decades ago, most of the fannies in those Loge and Grandstand seats were their for the baseball. Anybody that thinks most of the fannies in those seats now are there for the baseball is dreaming. Most are there for the "experience" or a night on the town with or without the kids in all their cute Red Sox regalia.

Edited February 9, 2020 by jung

[jung]

Trout’c contract has nothing to do with them sucking. That’s all.

 

Are the Angels making money or are they broke? IT IS A BUSINESS just as the Sox are a business. They are a business with a somewhat different market and a somewhat different means to an end but they are making money.

[mvp 78]

Are the Angels making money or are they broke? IT IS A BUSINESS just as the Sox are a business. They are a business with a somewhat different market and a somewhat different means to an end but they are making money.

Typical jung word salad when confronted with a good opposing argument.

[jung]

Typical jung word salad when confronted with a good opposing argument.

 

Word salad? Is it a business or is it not? Are the Angels a business? Are the Sox a business? Its you that don't appear to have an argument.

[jacksonianmarch]

Fans get romantic about players and the names on the back of the jersey. Mookie being dealt, no matter the free agent outcome, will make the Sox better in the long run. It’s all about the name on the front.

 

Listen, if Bloom went out and signed MadBum and Ryu to bolster the rotation and got Will Smith to close and bolster the pen, then you gotta ride with Mookie and see this one out. But they didn’t. You make your bed and you lie in it. Financial restraint is the reason why the Sox are better off getting something for Mookie now rather than getting nothing for him later. And heck, you can get a lot for a one year rental, especially when the team dealing for the rental is desperate (Cubs with Chapman and giving us Gleyber). The Dodgers have to win a title in this window. They know that. Hence why they’re willing to give up 5 yrs of Verdugo for 1 of Betts.

 

Now, the Dodgers are in a bind and they look real bad here with the Angels being pissed at them too. So be it. Bloom has an opportunity now to make this deal AND make the team better for 2020. You know Maeda and Verdugo is the price the Dodgers would pay plus half the deal. Either push them to take a little more money or just take Verdugo and Maeda and go from there. Maeda is a solid, mid rotation pitcher. He jumps into the rotation after ERod and gives you a semblance of a rotation in the wake of this deal. Then you have Maeda under contract for a few years. You know he can be dealt for a top 100 prospect. If 2020 goes off the rails, put him up for auction at the deadline and you might find someone even more desperate, willing to give you something more

[mvp 78]

I agree about the Maeda part for sure. Not getting the trade done makes the FO look rinky dink.

[Kingface]

Fans get romantic about players and the names on the back of the jersey. Mookie being dealt, no matter the free agent outcome, will make the Sox better in the long run. It’s all about the name on the front.

 

Listen, if Bloom went out and signed MadBum and Ryu to bolster the rotation and got Will Smith to close and bolster the pen, then you gotta ride with Mookie and see this one out. But they didn’t. You make your bed and you lie in it. Financial restraint is the reason why the Sox are better off getting something for Mookie now rather than getting nothing for him later. And heck, you can get a lot for a one year rental, especially when the team dealing for the rental is desperate (Cubs with Chapman and giving us Gleyber). The Dodgers have to win a title in this window. They know that. Hence why they’re willing to give up 5 yrs of Verdugo for 1 of Betts.

 

Now, the Dodgers are in a bind and they look real bad here with the Angels being pissed at them too. So be it. Bloom has an opportunity now to make this deal AND make the team better for 2020. You know Maeda and Verdugo is the price the Dodgers would pay plus half the deal. Either push them to take a little more money or just take Verdugo and Maeda and go from there. Maeda is a solid, mid rotation pitcher. He jumps into the rotation after ERod and gives you a semblance of a rotation in the wake of this deal. Then you have Maeda under contract for a few years. You know he can be dealt for a top 100 prospect. If 2020 goes off the rails, put him up for auction at the deadline and you might find someone even more desperate, willing to give you something more

 

^^^^^ What he said....

[jacksonianmarch]

I agree about the Maeda part for sure. Not getting the trade done makes the FO look rinky dink.

 

And getting Maeda plus Verdugo is EXACTLY the kind of deal that the Rays would make. They made far more using veterans and then dealing them, almost like a pyramid scheme. I think the Delmon Young tree is still going.

 

The Rays have made a living dealing stars or core veterans for either aged out rookies or MLB ready prospects plus a veteran. The veteran they get, they utilize them well and deal them off after bumping their value in TB. Happens every time.

 

Maybe Bloom can develop a Mookie Betts tree like Friedman did and Bloom continued with the Delmon Young tree. And that tree saw Young go for Garza. Garza go for Archer. Archer go for Meadows and Glasnow. They got a bunch of other minor contributors along the way, but they’re masters at continuing to get extra value

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

If Bloom was willing to settle for Maeda, the trade would've been done a week ago -- and LA wouldn't have had to drag the Twins in at all. The Maeda tree has a lot of rings in the trunk (but none on the fingers), and Friedman must have seen one of those pilated woodpeckers land on his back. Dodgers need to add another sapling to seal the deal.

[S5Dewey]

And getting Maeda plus Verdugo is EXACTLY the kind of deal that the Rays would make. They made far more using veterans and then dealing them, almost like a pyramid scheme. I think the Delmon Young tree is still going.

 

The Rays have made a living dealing stars or core veterans for either aged out rookies or MLB ready prospects plus a veteran. The veteran they get, they utilize them well and deal them off after bumping their value in TB. Happens every time.

 

Maybe Bloom can develop a Mookie Betts tree like Friedman did and Bloom continued with the Delmon Young tree. And that tree saw Young go for Garza. Garza go for Archer. Archer go for Meadows and Glasnow. They got a bunch of other minor contributors along the way, but they’re masters at continuing to get extra value

 

I'm sure that Jax is very happy with Bloom being GM of the Red Sox and will extol Bloom's virtues loud and long. Bloom was the boss in Tampa Bay for 11 seasons and after walking around the stadium I realized that there are no flags flying there! They made one WS appearance in Bloom's first season in TB so it can be said that those weren't even his players. They won one more division championship two years later and were dispatched in 5 games in the ALDS by Texas. IOW other than that his first year the Rays didn't even appear in the WS during Bloom's tenure there.

 

Bloom probably is the guy to rebuild the farm - which is one heck of a lot easier when you're not finishing at the top of the heap and have money to spend - but I've seen no sign that he's the guy we want to compete with the MFY. I don't want to have to settle for being like the Rays, a team that's often the bridesmaid but never the bride. Yankees fans would disagree.

Edited February 9, 2020 by S5Dewey

[jung]

I'm sure that Jax is very happy with Bloom being GM of the Red Sox and will extol Bloom's virtues loud and long. Bloom was the boss in Tampa Bay for 11 seasons and after walking around the stadium I realized that there are no flags flying there! They made one WS appearance in Bloom's first season in TB so it can be said that those weren't even his players. They won one more division championship two years later and were dispatched in 5 games in the ALDS by Texas. IOW other than that his first year the Rays didn't even appear in the WS during Bloom's tenure there.

 

Bloom probably is the guy to rebuild the farm - which is one heck of a lot easier when you're not finishing at the top of the heap and have money to spend - but I've seen no sign that he's the guy we want to compete with the MFY. I don't want to have to settle for being like the Rays, a team that's often the bridesmaid but never the bride. Yankees fans would disagree.

 

I don't have an issue with building the farm. You just cannot go forward in the modern game with absolutely positively NOTHING down there. The rest of baseball knows it when you don't have anybody that can come up and play making league minimum which means you really don't have the means to fill in around the guys you are actually paying the big money. At that point MLB punishes you by making you overpay for middling talent, let alone prime players.

 

Either that or you get lucky enough to get into the situation the yankees were in with Chapman and you rake in a haul for the one player.

 

I just wish we would get somebody with a balanced approach. Lately we either end up with somebody totally into building the farm or somebody totally committed to using it up to the last man. Somebody in the middle would be a pleasant surprise.

Edited February 9, 2020 by jung

[a700hitter]

The Twins dropping out means nothing to the Dodgers. They were getting nothing from the Twins. The Dodgers are still willing to give up Verdugo and Maeda, so i don't think they will blink. The Red Sox have to decide whether they are willing to get only Verdugo in return for Betts and half price Price.