Harper and Machado

[notin]

Name one that has not.

 

It's unprovable, but it you think he sets a good example for the young players on his team that see the star of their team act like he does on the field, then we'll have to just agree to disagree.

 

Look, I had issues with Papi not running out grounders, but with his fragile legs, I gave him a pass. Plus, he didn't play dirty.

 

I would not like Machado on our team, even if he hit 50 HRs. I believe he is a cancer. I believe he will decline for the last 5 years of his deal and be a budget burden even in his prime years.

 

I have no issues with anyone who looks beyond the antics and still likes him, but he's not the type of player I'd want on my team.

 

 

While being lived universally is clearly not high on his list, simply believing Machado to be a cancer just doesn’t make it so. Especially in the wake of all his former teammates offering contrary stories.

 

Sure he plays a questionable brand of baseball. So did Pete Rose, although in a different way. (Rose actually was Charlie (Johnny) Hustle.) While I’m sure many will find that comparison inaccurate, I bet Ray Fosse might offer some support...

[moonslav59]

While being lived universally is clearly not high on his list, simply believing Machado to be a cancer just doesn’t make it so. Especially in the wake of all his former teammates offering contrary stories.

 

Sure he plays a questionable brand of baseball. So did Pete Rose, although in a different way. (Rose actually was Charlie (Johnny) Hustle.) While I’m sure many will find that comparison inaccurate, I bet Ray Fosse might offer some support...

 

I think it was pretty clear my statement is an opinion and not a fact.

 

I fell young players look up to the stars on their teams- the ones getting all the interviews and press coverage. When they see someone can make $300M and not even care about hussling, I think it sens the wrong message and is bound to rub off on some players.

 

It's my opinion. I've played on teams with slackers who had a lot of talent and got to play all the time, because they were good to great. I didn't enjoy it much, and even when we won, it wasn't as much fun.

 

I'm fine with anyone who disagrees, but I'm happy he's not on the Sox, and I would have been happy had the Yanks signed him to more than what the Padres gave him.

 

[Slasher9]

The rumor mill now has it that the Dodgers are making a surprise late push for Harper.

 

before this is over...Satan will have had every team "in on" Harper.

[Jasonbay44]

Name one that has not.

 

It's unprovable, but it you think he sets a good example for the young players on his team that see the star of their team act like he does on the field, then we'll have to just agree to disagree.

 

Look, I had issues with Papi not running out grounders, but with his fragile legs, I gave him a pass. Plus, he didn't play dirty.

 

I would not like Machado on our team, even if he hit 50 HRs. I believe he is a cancer. I believe he will decline for the last 5 years of his deal and be a budget burden even in his prime years.

 

I have no issues with anyone who looks beyond the antics and still likes him, but he's not the type of player I'd want on my team.

 

 

I literally posted numerous articles a few posts ago, where all his former teammates spoke highly of him, including a current Red Sox player in Steve Pearce. Everyone liked him and said he was easily approachable, helpful and really knew the game. These are people who are no longer his teammates and have no need to speak highly of him.. Did Manny Ramirez effect Pedroia and Ellsbury with his antics? I don't think so. I don't think one guy not hustling every play really makes much impact on the teammates. They're all pros and know what they're supposed to do. As long as Machado is a good teammate and club house presence, which his teammates in Baltimore and LA said he was, I don't think he's making any kind of negative impact on the team. I am very glad the Yankees didn't get him.

[Kimmi]

I think it was pretty clear my statement is an opinion and not a fact.

 

I fell young players look up to the stars on their teams- the ones getting all the interviews and press coverage. When they see someone can make $300M and not even care about hussling, I think it sens the wrong message and is bound to rub off on some players.

 

It's my opinion. I've played on teams with slackers who had a lot of talent and got to play all the time, because they were good to great. I didn't enjoy it much, and even when we won, it wasn't as much fun.

 

I'm fine with anyone who disagrees, but I'm happy he's not on the Sox, and I would have been happy had the Yanks signed him to more than what the Padres gave him.

 

 

I am with you 100% on this Moon.

 

Maybe his teammates don't consider him to be a cancer, but he is not setting a good example for all the young players that will be looking up to him, especially those on his team. IMO, he's a punk. I'm glad that he is not on the Red Sox.

[Bellhorn04]

I think San Diego is a wonderful place for him.

[Jasonbay44]

I think San Diego is a wonderful place for him.

I can agree with that. Keep him as far away from AL east as possible.

[Bellhorn04]

Good thing for the Yankees they didn't need Harper's bat.

[dgalehouse]

Good thing for the Yankees they didn't need Harper's bat.

 

The Yankees were lusting after Harper for years . When he finally becomes available, they take a pass . Go figure .

[notin]

The Yankees were lusting after Harper for years . When he finally becomes available, they take a pass . Go figure .

 

 

They re-signed Gardner to take his at bats.

 

I wouldn’t be surprised if the Yankee fascination with Harper died the day they acquired Stanton. How many $300mill corner outfielders can any team handle?

[Bellhorn04]

They re-signed Gardner to take his at bats.

 

I wouldn’t be surprised if the Yankee fascination with Harper died the day they acquired Stanton. How many $300mill corner outfielders can any team handle?

 

The Yankees are probably the only team that could handle two...

[Fan_since_Boggs]

The Yankees had a terrible off-season--they made one mistake after another. They should have signed Corbin, kept Sheffield, and avoided James Paxton. In addition, I don't know how they pass on a future HOF in Machado. They should have signed Machado, a two way player, and traded the hyped M.Andujar while his trade value was high and inflated.

 

Cashman went through a stretch where he made some excellent moves, acquiring DiDi, A.Hicks, Torres. But more recently Cashman has been trending in the other direction and it all started going wrong for him when he traded for numb nuts Geancarlo Stanton.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Michael Kay said on ESPN radio that if George Steinbrenner was still alive, the Yankees would have signed either Machado or Harper. I agree with him.

[Bellhorn04]

Michael Kay said on ESPN radio that if George Steinbrenner was still alive, the Yankees would have signed either Machado or Harper. I agree with him.

 

That's a no-brainer.

[SCM33]

Michael Kay said on ESPN radio that if George Steinbrenner was still alive, the Yankees would have signed either Machado or Harper. I agree with him.

 

That's a no-brainer.

 

Either would have significantly helped at this point.

[kenmeister]

Either would have significantly helped at this point.

 

As of today ...

 

Manny Machado Batting Average .237, On-Base .316, Slugging .432, overall OPS .748, WAR 1.2 (25th overall in the NL for batters)

Bryce Harper Batting Average .231, On-Base .371, Slugging .469, overall OPS .840, WAR 0.2 (114th overall in the NL for batters)

 

I never understood the appeal of signing these guys. Bryce Harper had a 1.6 WAR in 2016, 4.7 in 2017 (better), and 1.3 in 2018. And he gets $330 million? Looks like he got paid for the one aberration year of 2015. Machado had a more reasonable 6.7 in 2016, 3.5 in 2017, and 5.7 in 2018. Still not $300 million worth, but respectable.

Edited May 10, 2019 by kenmeister

[notin]

As of today ...

 

Manny Machado Batting Average .237, On-Base .316, Slugging .432, overall OPS .748, WAR 1.2 (25th overall in the NL for batters)

Bryce Harper Batting Average .231, On-Base .371, Slugging .469, overall OPS .840, WAR 0.2 (114th overall in the NL for batters)

 

I never understood the appeal of signing these guys. Bryce Harper had a 1.6 WAR in 2016, 4.7 in 2017 (better), and 1.3 in 2018. And he gets $330 million? Looks like he got paid for the one aberration year of 2015. Machado had a more reasonable 6.7 in 2016, 3.5 in 2017, and 5.7 in 2018. Still not $300 million worth, but respectable.

 

 

Age.

 

Very, very few players reach free agency at age 26...

[kenmeister]

Age.

 

Very, very few players reach free agency at age 26...

 

That makes sense, except Harper is signed for 13 years. I guarantee you they will have to release him and eat the remainder of the contract long before he gets anywhere close to finishing it. I doubt he even makes it halfway given where his skill set is now.

[Bellhorn04]

That makes sense, except Harper is signed for 13 years. I guarantee you they will have to release him and eat the remainder of the contract long before he gets anywhere close to finishing it. I doubt he even makes it halfway given where his skill set is now.

 

Harper's defensive numbers are bad just as they were last year.

 

It's kind of embarrassing when you look on the Phillies' B-R page and Harper isn't even there because he's not one of the Top 10 in WAR.

 

Machado is at least a defensive plus.

[bkzwhitestrican]

Manny Machado: .237/.316/.432/.748, 101 wRC+, 0.8 WAR

 

Gio Urshela: .354/.416/.532/.947, 156 wRC+, 0.9 WAR

 

This is obviously sustainable over the course of the year. Cashman iz a genius.

[dgalehouse]

Manny Machado: .237/.316/.432/.748, 101 wRC+, 0.8 WAR

 

Gio Urshela: .354/.416/.532/.947, 156 wRC+, 0.9 WAR

 

This is obviously sustainable over the course of the year. Cashman iz a genius.

 

Proof that signing position players is a crap shoot . No reason to spend money on it .

[Slasher9]

Proof that signing position players is a crap shoot . No reason to spend money on it .

 

trout?

[jacksonianmarch]

It is all about signing the right players. Machado and Harper have been two entirely different players with similar WARs. Harper's offensive upside is way higher than Machado's. Machado's defense is far better and far more consistent than Harper's. Machado's defense makes him a pretty good bet to hang with Harper while Harper may have the best individual seasons of the two over the next 10 seasons.

[moonslav59]

It is all about signing the right players. Machado and Harper have been two entirely different players with similar WARs. Harper's offensive upside is way higher than Machado's. Machado's defense is far better and far more consistent than Harper's. Machado's defense makes him a pretty good bet to hang with Harper while Harper may have the best individual seasons of the two over the next 10 seasons.

 

I was really hoping your Yanks would sign one of these bozos.

[redsoxrules]

Age.

 

Very, very few players reach free agency at age 26...

 

So just because hes only 26 it warrants a 330 Million dollar deal?

 

I dont know about you but I would prefer to pay my players based on how they are going to perform and not because of their age.

 

I'm sorry but if you throw 330 million at a guy he best be someone producing over a 6 War year in and year out and not because hes " 26 years old "

 

The guy is overated. He sucks defensively, terrible baserunner. Only thing he provides is offense and even at that he ain't spectacular. He has too many stretches where he's MIA.

 

I said from the beginning the Phillies will regret this deal within a few years of signing him.

[dgalehouse]

By any reasonable standard , Bryce Harper is off to a slow start in his Phillies career . Despite that , he has an OBP of .387 and an OPS of 860 . The Phils are leading the N.L. East by three games and are fourth in MLB attendance , averaging 37,000 per game .

[redsoxrules]

By any reasonable standard , Bryce Harper is off to a slow start in his Phillies career . Despite that , he has an OBP of .387 and an OPS of 860 . The Phils are leading the N.L. East by three games and are fourth in MLB attendance , averaging 37,000 per game .

 

That wont keep up if he continues to be mediocre. Not worth 330 million dollars.

[notin]

So just because hes only 26 it warrants a 330 Million dollar deal?

 

I dont know about you but I would prefer to pay my players based on how they are going to perform and not because of their age.

 

I'm sorry but if you throw 330 million at a guy he best be someone producing over a 6 War year in and year out and not because hes " 26 years old "

 

The guy is overated. He sucks defensively, terrible baserunner. Only thing he provides is offense and even at that he ain't spectacular. He has too many stretches where he's MIA.

 

I said from the beginning the Phillies will regret this deal within a few years of signing him.

 

 

And yet being 26 is a big deal for a free agent.

 

Being 26 with an MVP under your belt is even bigger. As excited as Sox fans get about Chavis, Harper was NL MVP at a younger age than the Sox rookie was for his debut.

 

Find a player who reached free agency by age 26 with 6 years of service time who didn’t cash in enormously. The reason the Sox gave Porcello a huge extension was that he was going to reach free agency at age 26 and they knew if he did, he would be unaffordable...

[Slasher9]

By any reasonable standard , Bryce Harper is off to a slow start in his Phillies career . Despite that , he has an OBP of .387 and an OPS of 860 . The Phils are leading the N.L. East by three games and are fourth in MLB attendance , averaging 37,000 per game .

 

when the weather warms up he will go off in philly. his splits there for his career are ridiculous.

[notin]

Proof that signing position players is a crap shoot . No reason to spend money on it .

 

 

But isn’t your stance typically that you have to spend money to get quality players?

 

If fans think this is representative, maybe the Sox should sign Robbie Grossman over Mookie Betts when the time comes...