Wright gets a start this Tuesday

[notin]

Doubt Swihart ever reaches the level of defensive consistency of either of those two gentlmen -- but I certainly wouldn't turn up my nose at a Scott Hatteberg, if I thought we had one.

 

I thnk he can reach Tettleton's level of defense, which isn't the loftiest goal.

 

Hatteburg would be fine, too. Does that mean Chris Pratt will play him in a movie?

[notin]

Who is calling Swi a good defensive catcher?

 

I am just saying that he is not as terrible as many make him out to be and that he needs a chance to play and to refine his skills.

 

All I am saying is the metrics don't, although it appears some are using them to justify his defense. I haven't seen him catch in over 3 years and I barely remember what he looked like back then.

 

While I think it speaks volumes that the Sox have not asked him to catch even when Vazquez and Leon were struggling heavily, I do think they at the very least need to get him at-bats. He's no Mookie and the plate and will never be one, but at least he has some potential that might show if he gets enough of a chance...

[mvp 78]

Who is calling Swi a good defensive catcher?

 

I am just saying that he is not as terrible as many make him out to be and that he needs a chance to play and to refine his skills.

 

That's all I was saying with my original post about his 5.9 dWAR. He wasn't the worst defensive catcher by that metric. Maybe DRS or whatever have their own faults? I watched Swihart that year and he looked passable. He wasn't great, but I've seen a whole lot worse.

[Maxbialystock]

NESN website says Vazquez is catching tonight and Holt is in RF. No Swihart. Devers at 3B and JBJ in CF.

[mvp 78]

NESN website says Vazquez is catching tonight and Holt is in RF. No Swihart. Devers at 3B and JBJ in CF.

 

DFA Swihart.

[moonslav59]

Who is calling Swi a good defensive catcher?

 

I am just saying that he is not as terrible as many make him out to be and that he needs a chance to play and to refine his skills.

 

How do we know, if he's decent, not so bad, bad or horrible?

 

Even one game won't tell us much.

[Maxbialystock]

DFA Swihart.

 

Pax. No one--almost no one--wants to DFA Swihart. I objected to the notion that 2015 demonstrated Swihart was an above average catcher even as a rookie, which does not comport with what we have seen since, especially this year. I thought having him catch Wright, which is a pain, was a good idea.

[Natick to NC]

NESN website says Vazquez is catching tonight and Holt is in RF. No Swihart. Devers at 3B and JBJ in CF.

 

Good this means Vaz gets to get the irrational criticism....catching a knuckleball an entire game is extremely difficult ...I am pulling for Vaz and wright to be on same page and perform great .

[Natick to NC]

How do we know, if he's decent, not so bad, bad or horrible?

 

Even one game won't tell us much.

 

This ...but my God you can't judge anyone while catching that butterfly ball ...Mirabelli was incredibly gifted at it but not many can do it that well .

[moonslav59]

This ...but my God you can't judge anyone while catching that butterfly ball ...Mirabelli was incredibly gifted at it but not many can do it that well .

 

Exactly. If the only guy Swihart catches is Wright, we may never find out.

[jd98]

Where is the dWAR coming from?

 

I don't think the Defensive component on Fangraphs is straight dWAR.....

 

This. It's not dWAR. It's Defensive Runs Above Average. "...roughly 9-10 runs of DEF is equal to about one win of value"

[Maxbialystock]

Who needs DWAR when we have available to us the collective judgment of the Sox FO, two managers, and two MLB coaching stats, and the Pawtucket coaching staff? All of them appear to have concluded Swihart hasn't got the right skills to be a starting catcher in MLB, which is why he hasn't caught a single game this year despite the hitting struggles of both Leon and Vazquez.

[Kimmi]

There was little room for him anywhere with Ramirez here. I don't think its so much that they "see the value" in him so much as wanting to see what he has...giving him a chance to show management if he is worth keeping. His trade demand probably had something to do with it as well. I have been advocating for him to be given a chance for a long time. If he fails at least we know that he is not worth keeping; if he succeeds then he becomes another cog in the Sox wheel.

 

I am not trying to hate on Swihart here, but rather on management's very poorly handling of the entire situation. I like Swihart and always have. I hope he gets the reps he needs at catcher or elsewhere and can stick with our team.

[Maxbialystock]

Yes. Context sure can help.

 

Context? You want context? How's this for context? Vazquez is twice the defensive catcher Swihart will ever be and you can see it tonight if you bother to watch the game.

[Larry Cook]

Wright pitched a whale of a game against Detroit.

[Maxbialystock]

Wright pitched a whale of a game against Detroit.

 

With just the right catcher of course.

[Spudboy]

I am not trying to hate on Swihart here, but rather on management's very poorly handling of the entire situation. I like Swihart and always have. I hope he gets the reps he needs at catcher or elsewhere and can stick with our team.

 

Boom.

[cp176]

We are not going to find out what Swihart has until he gets regular at bats. Every third, fourth, or fifth day isn't going to get it done. I feel really bad for the kid. if the goal is to trade him, he is going to have to play to show people that he can in fact play. Hanging on to him just for security purposes kind of sucks for him. I wish that they would release or trade this kid if they are not going to play him. If he was given or had been given the same opportunities that Ramirez was given this spring, we might all have been surprised by what he could do. Just hanging on to him looks kind of sad to me.

[Yaz Fan Since 67]

The love Swihart continues to get here is baffling. At some point in time we need to realize that he was a top level prospect who just didn't pan out. His numbers have gone down every year and he has no defensive position. He finally was given extended playing time over the last few weeks and managed 4 hits in 22 at bats.

 

But last night sure was an enjoyable win. I must have backed up that seed to the plate by Bogaerts 5 times. Wright has been amazing out of the pen, and was great before his injury. I expected a good performance last night but that was even better than I imagined. Wife stopped in right before JD's HR. I was calling it before it happened, best power guy in the game against some chump who belongs in the minors. Such fun when a HR happens and you expected it.

[Maxbialystock]

I too am surprised at how rabid the Swihart fan club is and how angry they are at the FO and, indirectly, at Cora for not playing Swihart more. It's like we're back in the 1930's and the WPA and just finding people work--on a MLB club that only has the best record in MLB.

 

Seriously, folks, what's going on with the Swihart adulation? Keep in mind that the Sox are now 9-4 in games Mookie Betts has missed. That's huge--and a little lucky. And it completely overshadows the trials and tribulations of little orphan Swihartie.

[Emp9]

Lol The Rabid Swihart Fan Club? That’s a little over dramatic, no? In fact, I’ve observed the opposite of that all year. The Rabid OMG! What the f*** is going on with the 25th spot on our roster??!!! Fan Club. God forbid the 25th guy doesn’t live up to your expectations. Jesus christ. Holy s***. I thought this thread was supposed to be about Wright anyhow?

[Bellhorn04]

Lol The Rabid Swihart Fan Club? That’s a little over dramatic, no? In fact, I’ve observed the opposite of that all year. The Rabid OMG! What the f*** is going on with the 25th spot on our roster??!!! Fan Club. God forbid the 25th guy doesn’t live up to your expectations. Jesus christ. Holy s***. I thought this thread was supposed to be about Wright anyhow?

 

If you're expecting discussion that is totally logical and always on topic I'm afraid you've come to the wrong place.

[S5Dewey]

If you're expecting discussion that is totally logical and always on topic I'm afraid you've come to the wrong place.

 

LOL

And Emp certainly doesn't belong in the game threads if he's expecting that! During a loss that place can be a cesspool of overreaction and negativity! (Those are the time when I just leave..eventually)

[Emp9]

If Swihart was a former top prospect that happened to be a pitcher, and the sox did everything they could to keep him to see what he had, would we be having this non-stop discussion? I kinda doubt it.

 

Soooo, Wright’s our #5 now w/ Pom hurt? I’m almost delighted. He’s foolin’ batters so hard they forget to run to 1B.

[mvp 78]

If Swihart was a former top prospect that happened to be a pitcher, and the sox did everything they could to keep him to see what he had, would we be having this non-stop discussion? I kinda doubt it.

 

I don't understand. The Sox let Henry Owens go and no one batted an eye.

 

I think Swihart is different because he showed a lot of potential in 2015 and then lost 2 years due to injury but is now languishing on the bench. If the Sox were able to stash him in Pawtucket, we'd never discuss him at all.

[Dojji]

Wright looked really, really solid. The weird thing about Wright compared to most knockleballers is that he throws two different knucklers, a Dickey style harder knuckler and a Wakefield style floater, and they were both dancing last night.

 

Anytime you get through 7 IP on less than 100 pitches you're doing something right. Very encouraging to see him back on his 2016 form in the early going. When he's on his game Wright is a very good starting pitcher with #3 ability. The team has got to find out if he's that guy this year. If he is, he's worth a lot more than if he's just a decent long reliever.

 

If Wright can secure that spot in the rotation and produce quality outings, the rotation as a whole starts to look very sexy indeed.

 

I think Mr. Pomeranz may have just lost his job for the time being. Anyone else agree?

Edited June 6, 2018 by Dojji

[Dojji]

I don't understand. The Sox let Henry Owens go and no one batted an eye.

 

I think Swihart is different because he showed a lot of potential in 2015 and then lost 2 years due to injury but is now languishing on the bench. If the Sox were able to stash him in Pawtucket, we'd never discuss him at all.

 

People were getting starry eyed over his potential back in 15, I honestly was willing to give him a chance but injury prevented that from ever happening. Tough luck for the kid, but the one thing we can not do is pretend it's still 2015 and those injuries never happened.

 

We have two catchers right now that are very good at making the pitching staff look good. People who like to have offense from every position are pulling for Swihart because of that prejudice but we don't have a problem at the catching position now. Leon is an adequate starter, Vazquez is at least a competent backup. That doesn't leave any room to play Swihart at his primary position.

 

And when they've tried to squeeze Swihart into the lineup and give him a chance to play despite not really having a position for him, he hasn't wowed them. That's on Swihart. He's gotten chances. He just hasn't managed to capitalize on them. Personally I think he's headed out of town by 7/31. We don't really need him and can't really play him, so some team that remembers 2015 is probably going to offer more than he's worth to us.

[S5Dewey]

Wright looked really, really solid. The weird thing about Wright compared to most knockleballers is that he throws two different knucklers, a Dickey style harder knuckler and a Wakefield style floater, and they were both dancing last night.

 

Anytime you get through 7 IP on less than 100 pitches you're doing something right. Very encouraging to see him back on his 2016 form in the early going. When he's on his game Wright is a very good starting pitcher with #3 ability. The team has got to find out if he's that guy this year. If he is, he's worth a lot more than if he's just a decent long reliever.

 

If Wright can secure that spot in the rotation and produce quality outings, the rotation as a whole starts to look very sexy indeed.

 

I think Mr. Pomeranz may have just lost his job for the time being. Anyone else agree?

 

I think you may very well be right. With Pom on the DL the rotation looks like....

Sale

Price

Porcillo

Wright

ERod

 

I like it. And I also like Pom - when he's pitching well. The difference between this year and last year is that last year he was always in and out of trouble and this year he's just in trouble and can't get out. If he can work out his issues while on the DL we could have six starters in a five man rotation which is a good thing since you can't have too much pitching. If someone goes down we insert Pom and keep on rolling.

[Dojji]

I think Pomeranz might ease into a relief role. He can play that super important multiple inning relief role, he's done it before. He could be far more valuable pitching quality relief than he is stinking up the last spot in the rotation.

 

At the moment I simply have more faith in the replacement guys like Velazquez and Johnson than in Pomeranz.

[S5Dewey]

 

And when they've tried to squeeze Swihart into the lineup and give him a chance to play despite not really having a position for him, he hasn't wowed them. That's on Swihart. He's gotten chances. He just hasn't managed to capitalize on them. Personally I think he's headed out of town by 7/31. We don't really need him and can't really play him, so some team that remembers 2015 is probably going to offer more than he's worth to us.

I don't disagree with you at all and this is just an observation.

 

I've always believed that there are many people who have the skills to play MLB but haven't performed in crucial moments. Some of them are in the minors and some of them are waiting on tables, selling cars, or building houses. Sometimes it's all about making the best of your opportunities and that's something Swihart hasn't done recently.

I'm in the camp of Swihart not being given enough opportunities so the roster shake up with Hanley's departure is giving him more chances, but if he doesn't make the best of those chances then sooner or later.......