Countdown to the Playoffs - 2017 Edition

[jacksonianmarch]

If you get Stanton, then that’ll cement your cliff. His contract is HUGE money and it would absolutely prevent you from signing some of your core

[Bellhorn04]

If you get Stanton, then that’ll cement your cliff. His contract is HUGE money and it would absolutely prevent you from signing some of your core

 

Yes and no. Stanton's AAV is 25 million. So it might mean we wouldn't be able to extend Mookie. But maybe Mookie wants to go to free agency anyway.

 

I don't think a trade for Stanton is a realistic possibility, it's just message board fodder. I can't see the Marlins trading him to us unless they get Benintendi or Devers back. A straight salary dump by the Marlins makes no sense. If they're in that bad of a shape the franchise is doomed anyway.

[Maxbialystock]

Funny how this thread is no longer about this year and this pennant race. I find the Stanton talk tedious, frankly.

 

Sox are now up 5 on the Yankees and 4 back of Houston, who come to town for their final four games. Sale right now is schedule to pitch the last game on October 1. If he does, he can't start game 1 of the ALDS on Oct 5, but he could still start on Oct 6 and on Oct 11 the scheduled 5th game of the ALDS.

 

Last year talksox raged for weeks over Farrell's apparent unwillingness to "win out, maintain momentum," whatever it took to stay ahead of the Guardians for the home field advantage in the ALDS in which we lost three straight and were out. I think that's nonsense, but can see it happening again this year.

[jacksonianmarch]

There is zero chance Sale isn’t starting game 1 of the ALDS. They’ll rearrange his schedule

[BstHcpr]

I'd bet $10,000 Sale doesn't start the last game of the year

[cp176]

Regardless of how they do in the playoffs, I think that this team has over achieved greatly. I say that but I also think that they have done it by playing the game the way I like to see it played. They have played with heart, with courage, with grit. The have come through in so many "clutch" situations that it is almost unbelievable. They have contributions from too many players to give credit to. They would be the last team that I would want to play if I was the manager of an opposing team. They could go out early but they could also go all the way.

As much as I believe in balance if it boiled down to an either or - strengthening an already good pitching staff or somehow signing Stanton long term, I would go with pitching all day. Historically we have been able to develop our big hitters from within. Not so much with our pitchers.

[illinoisredsox]

Funny how this thread is no longer about this year and this pennant race. I find the Stanton talk tedious, frankly.

 

Sox are now up 5 on the Yankees and 4 back of Houston, who come to town for their final four games. Sale right now is schedule to pitch the last game on October 1. If he does, he can't start game 1 of the ALDS on Oct 5, but he could still start on Oct 6 and on Oct 11 the scheduled 5th game of the ALDS.

 

Last year talksox raged for weeks over Farrell's apparent unwillingness to "win out, maintain momentum," whatever it took to stay ahead of the Guardians for the home field advantage in the ALDS in which we lost three straight and were out. I think that's nonsense, but can see it happening again this year.

 

Max, assuming the Sox have clinched by then, if Sale goes on the 1st it will be for 2-3 innings and maybe 30-35 pitches, just to stay sharp. He would still be available to start game 1.

[moonslav59]

Max, assuming the Sox have clinched by then, if Sale goes on the 1st it will be for 2-3 innings and maybe 30-35 pitches, just to stay sharp. He would still be available to start game 1.

 

On 3 days rest? (Oct 1 to 5 gives him just 3 days rest.)

 

No way.

[moonslav59]

Are these statements based on actual historical data?

 

Yes.

 

Teams that score 800 and let up 800 win less than teams that score 650 and let up 650. I researched it once, a long time ago.

 

[illinoisredsox]

On 3 days rest? (Oct 1 to 5 gives him just 3 days rest.)

 

No way.

 

Yes moon, he's going to throw on the side anyway. 30-35 pitches isn't going to tax him to the point where he couldn't come back 3 days later.

 

And note that I said if he pitches. There is a lot to be said for skipping the turn, and even more so if they are going to face the Astros in the first round. No sense giving them potentially 3 looks at him in a 10 day period.

[Thunder]

So the magic number is down to 3, meaning that, no matter what happens, we can't clinch tonight. Assuming we win tonight though, tomorrow is Sale's turn in the rotation, with a chance to go out and lock up the division for us. I assume that will be his last start, so that he can get a solid week and a half of rest before game 1

[moonslav59]

Yes moon, he's going to throw on the side anyway. 30-35 pitches isn't going to tax him to the point where he couldn't come back 3 days later.

 

And note that I said if he pitches. There is a lot to be said for skipping the turn, and even more so if they are going to face the Astros in the first round. No sense giving them potentially 3 looks at him in a 10 day period.

 

I really believe, he's not pitching the last game of the season, if we've clinched.

[moonslav59]

So the magic number is down to 3, meaning that, no matter what happens, we can't clinch tonight. Assuming we win tonight though, tomorrow is Sale's turn in the rotation, with a chance to go out and lock up the division for us. I assume that will be his last start, so that he can get a solid week and a half of rest before game 1

 

I'd give him 2 extra day's rest before his next start and then rest him until October 5th.

[OH FOY]

This ^^^

Does the 2 extra days rest, let him pitch against Toronto? Don't want Sale facing Astros in this series. Don't want Astro hitters gaging on him for a start in the season.

Edited September 25, 2017 by OH FOY!

[cp176]

Yes.

 

Teams that score 800 and let up 800 win less than teams that score 650 and let up 650. I researched it once, a long time ago.

 

 

Thank you for this piece of info Moon. I compiling my most important useful statistical data list and this one has to be up near the top. We just need a 3 letter abbreviation to identify it.

[Thunder]

This ^^^

Does the 2 extra days rest, let him pitch against Toronto? Don't want Sale facing Astros in this series. Don't want Astro hitters gaging on him for a start in the season.

 

I agree completely. There's something to be said about not having faced a guy all year. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe he pitched in the series in Houston in June either.

[Thunder]

He has been officially listed as the starter for the game tomorrow night, however.

[Maxbialystock]

There is zero chance Sale isn’t starting game 1 of the ALDS. They’ll rearrange his schedule

 

I consider it unlikely as well, but stated it simply because of the slim possibility that the October 1 game might determine who has home field advantage for the ALDS--us or the Astros. I like the home field advantage, but don't think it is as important as leading with Sale in game 1 on October 5.

 

Illinoisredsox thinks Sale could start October 1 and maybe go 2 or 3 innings as a tune up for October 5, but I would prefer the Astros seeing him for the first time since mid-June.

[Maxbialystock]

I agree completely. There's something to be said about not having faced a guy all year. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe he pitched in the series in Houston in June either.

 

You are correct. Sale did not pitch against the Astros in June.

[Maxbialystock]

Regardless of how they do in the playoffs, I think that this team has over achieved greatly. I say that but I also think that they have done it by playing the game the way I like to see it played. They have played with heart, with courage, with grit. The have come through in so many "clutch" situations that it is almost unbelievable. They have contributions from too many players to give credit to. They would be the last team that I would want to play if I was the manager of an opposing team. They could go out early but they could also go all the way.

As much as I believe in balance if it boiled down to an either or - strengthening an already good pitching staff or somehow signing Stanton long term, I would go with pitching all day. Historically we have been able to develop our big hitters from within. Not so much with our pitchers.

 

Guys have played with a lot of grit this year, no question. I am anti-Stanton as well, plus I think several will bounce back next year. Meanwhile they have been fun to watch especially now that the have a good shot at 95 wins this year.

 

If I were to single out players, it would probably be Sale, Betts, and Kimbrel in that order. Sale for his stunning ability and numbers, but also because he is a complete player and willing to make adjustments in his pitching. Betts because in a down year he still leads the Sox in hits, total bases, runs, OPS, rbi's, dingers, SB's, you name it. Kimbrel because he has mostly been lights out when closing out a game.

[cp176]

I like your post here Max. Sale to me is a great example of a great pitcher who I knew very little about other than the fact that he could pitch when he came to Boston. I think he represents what every team wishes they had more of - Winner. I think that you are right about betts and I think Kimbrel has many of the same qualities that Sale has. They are big time team players who want to win.

[oldtimer]

Guys have played with a lot of grit this year, no question. I am anti-Stanton as well, plus I think several will bounce back next year. Meanwhile they have been fun to watch especially now that the have a good shot at 95 wins this year.

 

If I were to single out players, it would probably be Sale, Betts, and Kimbrel in that order. Sale for his stunning ability and numbers, but also because he is a complete player and willing to make adjustments in his pitching. Betts because in a down year he still leads the Sox in hits, total bases, runs, OPS, rbi's, dingers, SB's, you name it. Kimbrel because he has mostly been lights out when closing out a game.

 

I don't think Stanton is a good fit for us either, even though he is a special player. Personally, I can't see giving any player a long contract with mega bucks involved. Talking about signing just a designated hitter under those circumstances makes less sense to me. Better to sign a very good power hitter who can also play in the field for a shorter and more reasonable contract. Sale and Kimbrel have turned out to be very smart pickups while Price, no so much at this juncture. While DD has thinned out our minors, most of his acquisitions have made sense. I trust him to make the best moves for the organization.

[Maxbialystock]

wrong thread.

[moonslav59]

I like your post here Max. Sale to me is a great example of a great pitcher who I knew very little about other than the fact that he could pitch when he came to Boston. I think he represents what every team wishes they had more of - Winner. I think that you are right about betts and I think Kimbrel has many of the same qualities that Sale has. They are big time team players who want to win.

 

Remember when some were questioning Sale's attitude because of the cutting the uniform thing?

 

I mean, we're talking....

 

Chris Freakin' Sale!

 

[cp176]

Remember when some were questioning Sale's attitude because of the cutting the uniform thing?

 

I mean, we're talking....

 

Chris Freakin' Sale!

 

 

Yes I do remember that. That is why we all have to be a little careful with the judgemental comments I think . I'm as a guilty as the next guy of making them but I'm going to try to keep my future comments directed at what I actually see on the field.

[moonslav59]

Yes I do remember that. That is why we all have to be a little careful with the judgemental comments I think . I'm as a guilty as the next guy of making them but I'm going to try to keep my future comments directed at what I actually see on the field.

 

Plus, haven't we all done dumb things at some point in our lives (not that what Sale did was dumb), and yet we all know what fine and upstanding people we are!

 

[Slasher9]

Plus, haven't we all done dumb things at some point in our lives (not that what Sale did was dumb), and yet we all know what fine and upstanding people we are!

 

 

i'm glad he did it. made him tradeable.

[Maxbialystock]

Plus, haven't we all done dumb things at some point in our lives (not that what Sale did was dumb), and yet we all know what fine and upstanding people we are!

 

 

What did Sale do with his uniform? I feel like I just fell off the rutabaga truck.

[Maxbialystock]

Remember when some were questioning Sale's attitude because of the cutting the uniform thing?

 

I mean, we're talking....

 

Chris Freakin' Sale!

 

 

Exactly. To me it also means he is the complete professional on the mound and and in working on his pitching between starts. He takes nothing for granted despite his immense talent.

[mvp 78]

What did Sale do with his uniform? I feel like I just fell off the rutabaga truck.

 

He cut up some retro jerseys in Chicago because he didn't want to play when wearing them. He's been great in Boston.