Lineup Discussions

[moonslav59]

Perhaps it is overused. My point is that lineup changes are so insignificant that a manager will get a better advantage out of splitting his lefties than he will from worrying about whether someone bats 3rd or 4th.

 

Maybe, but I'd move batters more than one slot in some cases.

[oldtimer]

I think we now know the lineup for the Playoffs will start Holt at 3rd with possibly the left field slot being shared between Beni and Holt. When will the playoff roster for the first series be announced, or will we have to tune into the first game to find out?

[moonslav59]

...will start Holt at 3rd ...

Shows just how low Shaw has sunk.

[mvp 78]

...will start Holt at 3rd ...

Shows just how low Shaw has sunk.

 

We get to look forward to Pablo blocking out the sun again in ST.

[Bellhorn04]

...will start Holt at 3rd ...

Shows just how low Shaw has sunk.

 

He couldn't break the paradigm after all.

[moonslav59]

He couldn't break the paradigm after all.

 

I kind of expected he wouldn't.

 

Not many players soar above their AA & AAA numbers.

[moonslav59]

We get to look forward to Pablo blocking out the sun again in ST.

 

Maybe it will only be a partial eclipse.

[oldtimer]

The Sox may have the lineup with the most shorter players to start in the ALDS. I quote from the roster although actual heights may be less.

 

Pedroia 5'9"

Betts 5'9"

Vazquez 5'9"

Leon 5'10"

Holt 5'10"

Beni 5'10"

JBJ 5'10"

 

That makes 6 of our 9 starters 5'10" or shorter. I don't know what the significance of that may be (smaller strike zone?, Less power?). Just kind of a striking feature of our team.

[moonslav59]

The Sox may have the lineup with the most shorter players to start in the ALDS. I quote from the roster although actual heights may be less.

 

Pedroia 5'9"

Betts 5'9"

Vazquez 5'9"

Leon 5'10"

Holt 5'10"

Beni 5'10"

JBJ 5'10"

 

That makes 6 of our 9 starters 5'10" or shorter. I don't know what the significance of that may be (smaller strike zone?, Less power?). Just kind of a striking feature of our team.

 

Big Papi balances it all out!

[moonslav59]

In all fairness, here's the tiny Guardians:

5-9 Jose Ramirez (5th in PA)

5-9 A Almonte (11th)

5-9 M Martinez (15th)

5-10 R Davis (6th)

5-11 Kipnis (1st)

5-11 Santana (2nd)

5-11 Lindor (3rd)

5-11 R Perez (12th)

 

5 of their top 6 PA players are under 6 feet tall.

 

[Nick]

The Sox may have the lineup with the most shorter players to start in the ALDS. I quote from the roster although actual heights may be less.

 

Pedroia 5'9"

Betts 5'9"

Vazquez 5'9"

Leon 5'10"

Holt 5'10"

Beni 5'10"

JBJ 5'10"

 

That makes 6 of our 9 starters 5'10" or shorter. I don't know what the significance of that may be (smaller strike zone?, Less power?). Just kind of a striking feature of our team.

 

The significance is that they can play in a 6' and under basketball league without any controversy.

[S5Dewey]

This is one of the things I like about baseball. It's not size-dependent. Even an average size person can play and be one of the better players on his team or in the league.

 

IOW, Size doesn't matter.

[moonslav59]

And, even fat guys can be great!

[oldtimer]

If they get into a brawl, at least it will be a fair fight. Funny how so many of the field players are small while the pitchers are so tall.

[moonslav59]

If they get into a brawl, at least it will be a fair fight. Funny how so many of the field players are small while the pitchers are so tall.

 

Tall pitchers help make up for when they lowered the mound after the 1968 season.

[Slasher9]

I kind of expected he wouldn't.

 

Not many players soar above their AA & AAA numbers.

 

yup. you were dead on right about shaw.

[Slasher9]

We get to look forward to Pablo blocking out the sun again in ST.

 

he's in great shape right now. we just need to keep him away from his mom's house over christmas......

[Slasher9]

why is everyone so concerned about the height of our players. smaller strike zone.

[S5Dewey]

why is everyone so concerned about the height of our players. smaller strike zone.

 

Because we're between the regular season and the playoffs, speculation on the roster, lineups, and rotation has been beaten to death, and there's nothing else to talk about?

[mvp 78]

why is everyone so concerned about the height of our players. smaller strike zone.

 

I don't see any posts that show any sort of "concern." Seems that it was just a simple factoid.

[a700hitter]

The lineup is Big Papi and 7 dwarfs.

[mvp 78]

The lineup is Big Papi and 7 dwarfs.

 

Only having an 8 man lineup?

 

That's a bold strategy Cotton. Let's see if it pays off.

[a700hitter]

Only having an 8 man lineup?

 

That's a bold strategy Cotton. Let's see if it pays off.

Hanley is not a dwarf, but he gets to stay in my lineup.

[oldtimer]

Only having an 8 man lineup?

 

That's a bold strategy Cotton. Let's see if it pays off.

 

That way you only need to bat your eight best. Sounds good to me.

[oldtimer]

No one seems to care much about where players bat in the order, but I think grouping your best hitters together is the best bet for scoring. From that point of view I have noticed the recent move of Holt to the 2 spot hasn't resulted in the team scoring. It could just be an aberration based on a small sample or having faced especially good pitching in that period. I wonder if Beni would be better in the 2 spot with Holt moved back.

[Kimmi]

No one seems to care much about where players bat in the order, but I think grouping your best hitters together is the best bet for scoring. From that point of view I have noticed the recent move of Holt to the 2 spot hasn't resulted in the team scoring. It could just be an aberration based on a small sample or having faced especially good pitching in that period. I wonder if Beni would be better in the 2 spot with Holt moved back.

 

Interesting team batting stats:

 

With Mookie batting leadoff: .283/.350/.465/.815, scoring 5.4 runs per game.

 

After Mookie was moved to 3rd or 4th: .278/.346/.452/.798, scoring 5.4 runs per game.

 

Lesson - Don't sweat the batting order.

[moonslav59]

No one seems to care much about where players bat in the order...

 

I do. If only for this reason...

 

PA differential from leadoff to number

 

9> 144

8> 126

7> 122

6> 101

5> 83

4> 47

3> 27

2> 15

 

Grouping you best hitters makes sense with your high OBP up ahead of your high SLG guys.

 

OBP vs RHPs SLG vs RHP

.407 Ortiz .665

.400 Beni .584

.377 Betts .540

.371 Pedey .456

.363 Bradley .538

.347 Bogey .438

.344 HanRam .453

.337 S Leon .427

.336 Holt .426

.325 Shaw .437

.319 Young .446

.319 Hernandez .349

.313 Swihart .316

.262 Hanigan .286

.250 Vazquez .277

.212 A Hill .164

 

Next year, i could see us ending up with this vs RHPs:

1) Beni

2) Pedey

3) Betts

4) HanRam

5) JBJ

6) Bogey

7) Shaw

8) Leon

9) Holt/Pablo/Swihart

 

 

OBP vs LHP SLG

.450 S Leon .612

.420 HanRam .677

.410 Young .589

.397 Pedey .415

.393 Bogey .480

.382 Ortiz .485

.375 Vazquez .429

.357 A Hill .413

.333 Brentz .405

.309 JBJ .356

.302 Betts .512

.250 Beni .179

.244 Holt .105

.138 Hanigan .107

 

Maybe this vs LHPs:

1) Pedey

2) Bogey

3) Young

4) HanRam

5) Betts

6) JBJ

7) Leon

8) Hernandez

9) Beni/Vaz/Swihart/Young

 

(This is just a template and is assuming no acquisitions.)

 

[oldtimer]

No one seems to care much about where players bat in the order...

 

I do. If only for this reason...

 

PA differential from leadoff to number

 

9> 144

8> 126

7> 122

6> 101

5> 83

4> 47

3> 27

2> 15

 

Grouping you best hitters makes sense with your high OBP up ahead of your high SLG guys.

 

OBP vs RHPs SLG vs RHP

.407 Ortiz .665

.400 Beni .584

.377 Betts .540

.371 Pedey .456

.363 Bradley .538

.347 Bogey .438

.344 HanRam .453

.337 S Leon .427

.336 Holt .426

.325 Shaw .437

.319 Young .446

.319 Hernandez .349

.313 Swihart .316

.262 Hanigan .286

.250 Vazquez .277

.212 A Hill .164

 

Next year, i could see us ending up with this vs RHPs:

1) Beni

2) Pedey

3) Betts

4) HanRam

5) JBJ

6) Bogey

7) Shaw

8) Leon

9) Holt/Pablo/Swihart

 

 

OBP vs LHP SLG

.450 S Leon .612

.420 HanRam .677

.410 Young .589

.397 Pedey .415

.393 Bogey .480

.382 Ortiz .485

.375 Vazquez .429

.357 A Hill .413

.333 Brentz .405

.309 JBJ .356

.302 Betts .512

.250 Beni .179

.244 Holt .105

.138 Hanigan .107

 

Maybe this vs LHPs:

1) Pedey

2) Bogey

3) Young

4) HanRam

5) Betts

6) JBJ

7) Leon

8) Hernandez

9) Beni/Vaz/Swihart/Young

 

(This is just a template and is assuming no acquisitions.)

 

 

I like to see speed along with OBP early in the order. I believe our fastest players are Betts, Beni, Bogaerts,JBJ and Young (not ordered for speed). I don't see JBJ as an early in the order guy but the rest are good possibilities. Pedey isn't as fast but he is such a good hitter that he fits in as well.

 

Our current Sluggers are Hanley, Betts and JBJ, so I like them behind our early order guys. Betts fits batting third very well with both speed, power and a high OBP. We may well pick up an additional slugger for 2017. I love to see Beltran in a Red Sox uniform.

 

The really slow guys that we keep on the roster like Leon should be placed where he is less likely to hit into double plays and kill rallies. Down in the lineup with lower oBP guys ahead of him.

[moonslav59]

I like to see speed along with OBP early in the order. I believe our fastest players are Betts, Beni, Bogaerts,JBJ and Young (not ordered for speed). I don't see JBJ as an early in the order guy but the rest are good possibilities. Pedey isn't as fast but he is such a good hitter that he fits in as well.

 

Our current Sluggers are Hanley, Betts and JBJ, so I like them behind our early order guys. Betts fits batting third very well with both speed, power and a high OBP. We may well pick up an additional slugger for 2017. I love to see Beltran in a Red Sox uniform.

 

The really slow guys that we keep on the roster like Leon should be placed where he is less likely to hit into double plays and kill rallies. Down in the lineup with lower oBP guys ahead of him.

 

I agree.

 

We also have to note that guys like JBJ go from a .363 OBP vs RHPs to .309 vs LHPs. His Power (SLG) falls even more (.538> .356).

 

I think the big wild card in next year's line-up will be Beni. Can he lead off? Can he bat 2nd? Can he do this vs LHPs too?

 

Having Beni first would help "lengthen" the line-up, whci would help to minimize the loss of Papi in the middle of the order by allowing Betts, Pedey, Bogey or JBJ to join the 2-6 slots with HanRam. If we have to use Pedey 1st and Bogey 2nd, we shorten the line-up.

 

I'm hoping for something like this:

 

Beni

Bogey

Betts

HanRam

Pedey

JBJ v R / Young v L

3Bman v R/ JBJ v L

DH v R / 3B v L

Leon

Edited October 6, 2016 by moonslav59