The Benintendi Thread

[moonslav59]

My God I hope not. I hope the FO isn't going to waste an option year on a two week trial.

 

How many days can Beni stay with the big club and not lose the year of control?

[a700hitter]

How many days can Beni stay with the big club and not lose the year of control?

Do you really care about that?

[moonslav59]

Do you really care about that?

 

If the call-up was just a stop gap for Young's return, then yes.

 

I doubt that's what the call-up was all about, but I'm curious otherwise.

[bowman]

Being the fact that left field is up for grabs, give the kid a sniff. Maybe he runs with it or maybe he isn't ready. Worst case he goes back down and knows what he has to work on to be ready the next time. He will need some time to adjust, so what. What player doesn't. We have our #1 starter still trying to adjust. He will be a big part of the future so guys don't get too high or low on him right now. F.. Beltran and the Yankees.

[mvp 78]

It's not about that. Young and Beni will platoon when Young is healthy.

[bowman]

When Young is healthy. When is that...

[Nick]

If the call-up was just a stop gap for Young's return, then yes.

 

I doubt that's what the call-up was all about, but I'm curious otherwise.

 

Moon, I read somewhere that Holt will assume the role of utility player. When Young returns, I assume Bryce will be gone. They will have the 4th OF in Holt. With Benintendi, they will have terrific defense in OF.

[bowman]

Just checked the injury report, looks like Young should be ready for a rehab start in 11/2 weeks. Sounds like still a ways off even without setbacks...

[sk7326]

How many days can Beni stay with the big club and not lose the year of control?

 

service time is based purely on days on the roster ... so that he was this late season a callup might not be a big deal. I don't think his service time would have counted if he came as a september call up, so it is an indicator of what they think of him

[bosoxmal]

I disagree. I think the influnce of Ortiz will be of inestimable value. From the stat sheet, he appears to be a contact hitter. Fair K to BB ration. I don't it's possible to get a goodd line on a player until he's faced the best. Then grows. I wouldn't expect too much, however.

[bosoxmal]

Plus he gets the experience getting his critiqus from Papi. I hope, later in the year Mocada does also.

[moonslav59]

Moon, I read somewhere that Holt will assume the role of utility player. When Young returns, I assume Bryce will be gone. They will have the 4th OF in Holt. With Benintendi, they will have terrific defense in OF.

 

When Young comes back, Holt will be the 5th OF'er, unless Beni is sent back.

 

I really like Holt, but the guy is just not cut out to play any position long term or even for more than a few games in a row, except maybe 2B.

 

It's valuable to have a guy that can play 7 positions in an emergency, look how soon we realize he's not even able to cover LF for another 1.5 weeks. He failed at 3B, and that's one reason we signed Pablo. He's certainly not a SS for more than a game or two. He's not a 1Bman for more than a game or two.

 

Once Papi retires, I think Holt's value diminishes. I like Hernandez as our future back-up IF'er and Young as the back-up OF'er. Swihart can be the 3rd catcher, LF'er and maybe 1Bman of the future.

 

 

[moonslav59]

service time is based purely on days on the roster ... so that he was this late season a callup might not be a big deal. I don't think his service time would have counted if he came as a september call up, so it is an indicator of what they think of him

 

This is what I found...

 

" Service time also has an impact on when a player hits arbitration. After three years of service time, a player becomes arbitration-eligible, which is when a salary typically increases from the Major League minimum and is based on a player's individual performance on a market scale, as well as on -- you guessed it -- his service time.

In some cases, certain players -- Super Two players -- can become arbitration-eligible before reaching three full years of service time. The provisions are that they have less than three years of time, but more than two; and they must rank within the top 22 percent of all two-year players in terms of service time. Those players then receive four years of arbitration status, rather than three. "

 

MLBTR says...

"If Benintendi sticks in the big leagues, he could become eligible for arbitration after 2019 and free agency after 2022. "

 

Edited August 3, 2016 by moonslav59

[cp176]

1997 was Nomar's. I'll guess you weren't around for it, but he generated more excitement in Boston than any other player since arguably Ted Williams. It certainly wasn't a "terrible season."

 

Ah sorry - 1975 and the gold dust twins!

[TedWilliams101]

It's not about that. Young and Beni will platoon when Young is healthy.

 

Beni has had no issues hitting LHP, so why platoon. Better for his development to let him play full time. If he starts having trouble or needs a day off (he's 22, lets be real, he can play everday...) then alright. But i hate the idea of platooning just because you want to get other players playing time. Put the best players on the field, period. If Beni plays great, too bad Young, but he took your job. It's the pros.

[Eddy Ballgame]

Ah sorry - 1975 and the gold dust twins!

Fred Lynn was my favorite Sox player of all time, so you'll get no argument here, which is why I initially said "arguably." I just remember Nomar created a hell of a buzz around New England that summer of "97.

[cp176]

Fred Lynn was my favorite Sox player of all time, so you'll get no argument here, which is why I initially said "arguably." I just remember Nomar created a hell of a buzz around New England that summer of "97.

 

He sure did. When Rice and Lynn came on the scene it was other worldly. From a historical perspective, I hope people really appreciate the red Sox teams of the 70's.

[moonslav59]

Beni has had no issues hitting LHP, so why platoon. Better for his development to let him play full time. If he starts having trouble or needs a day off (he's 22, lets be real, he can play everday...) then alright. But i hate the idea of platooning just because you want to get other players playing time. Put the best players on the field, period. If Beni plays great, too bad Young, but he took your job. It's the pros.

 

AA in 2016

vs RHP (194 AB) .865 OPS

vs LHP (43 AB) .900 OPS

 

In single A this year

vs RHP (103 AB) .945

vs LHP (32 AB) 1.069

 

I agree. Let the kid play FT. If he needs a day off, play Young vs a lefty.

[moonslav59]

Fred Lynn was my favorite Sox player of all time, so you'll get no argument here, which is why I initially said "arguably." I just remember Nomar created a hell of a buzz around New England that summer of "97.

 

I always wondered what might have happened if Lynn and Rice were brought up in early 1974 instead of September. They had brought up Evans a year and a half earlier, and he was about the same age as the gold dust twins.

[Jasonbay44]

The thing is though - Chris Young has shown he can consistently kill LHP and that is literally the reason we signed him, if he continues raking against LHP (.340/.404/.638) in the majors, not in AA ball, he will play and I don't see why anyone would argue this

[Slasher9]

Nah, moonslav knows better.

 

Then again, this is and always has been DD's MO.

 

Lol. Look who has their panties in a bunch. Hahaha.

@theyankeesfan - we never wanted that slug Beltran so go pound sand.

[Slasher9]

But but but moon said he's ready!

 

Lol. It's like that itch you just can't seem to scratch I suppose....

[S5Dewey]

Moon asked: How many days can Beni stay with the big club and not lose the year of control?

 

Here's what I've got:

 

Once a player is put on the 40-man roster, the option countdown begins. A player is assigned three options as a rostered player. Each year, when a player who is on the roster gets sent to the Minor Leagues for a stint of more than 20 days, it counts as an option.

 

http://m.mlb.com/news/article/17188016//

 

Here's a simplified version of how I interpret that:

 

If a player is optioned to a minor league team and spends less than 20 days (cumulative - a player can be optioned more than once in a season) on that minor league team it doesn't count as an option year.

 

This means that if Beni is sent back down and he is there for fewer than 20 days it doesn't count as an option year. That 20 days would start as soon as he's sent back down and IIRC once a player is sent down he has to remain there for 10 days, but after that 10 days he could be called back up again - and sent back down again - and as long as he doesn't accumulate more than 20 days on a minor league club 2016 isn't counted as an option year.

 

There are 36 days between when Beni was called up and when the Sox and the Pawsox are both playing so Beni has to stay with the Sox for at least 16 days. Those days may or may not be consecutive.

 

Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer and I don't even play one on television. If someone interprets this differently I'm more than willing to defer to them.

Edited August 3, 2016 by S5Dewey

[Nick]

Per Sox Prospects

 

In calling up Andrew Benintendi after only 63 games in Double-A, the Red Sox clearly see him as an upgrade over what they have in left field right now, at least hitting from the left side. Red Sox left fielders have put up a .258/.324/.397 triple slash this year, so Benintendi doesn’t have to hit much to prove an upgrade over that.

 

With his defense, he really doesn't have to hit much to help the ball club. It's an UPGRADE.

[cp176]

Per Sox Prospects

 

In calling up Andrew Benintendi after only 63 games in Double-A, the Red Sox clearly see him as an upgrade over what they have in left field right now, at least hitting from the left side. Red Sox left fielders have put up a .258/.324/.397 triple slash this year, so Benintendi doesn’t have to hit much to prove an upgrade over that.

 

With his defense, he really doesn't have to hit much to help the ball club. It's an UPGRADE.

 

i don't think that anyone has implied that it won't be an UPGRADE. A healthy Young or Swihart would be as well! We all want the best for Benintendi. We all hope that he is the real deal. Questioning whether or not it is the right move or feeling that it made sense to give someone else the opportunity out there before bringing him up does not in any way imply that people want nothing but the best for him.

[User Name]

Lol. It's like that itch you just can't seem to scratch I suppose....

 

You need some vagisil.

[moonslav59]

lol

[southpaw777]

Does he?

 

Remember this is an org which - since Epstein has left - has:

 

1. Turned the 3B job over to Will Middlebrooks on 4 good weeks of BABIP spiked baseball

2. Put Bradley in CF and then took the job away because Grady Sizemore's entrails had 3 good weeks of pretend baseball

3. Signed Stephen Drew to play SS and bump Bogaerts to 3B (this was more defensible - their 3B production sucked, but was a vote of no confidence for a kid who needed reps)

4. Aggressively promoted Swihart due to injury, and then seemed committed to converting him to LF after a month

5. Sent Christian Vasquez down based on an out of nowhere hot streak from a guy they had cut before (again, more defensible - Vasquez might not actually be able to hit)

 

This is not the team that stood behind Pedroia despite a dreadful first impression.[/

 

They kept JBj when everyone wanted him gone and now hes an AS. That took more patience than pedeys one month slump.

Swihart was up out of necessity. Fact. Allour catcher were hurt. He was switched to LF for the same reasons and he was not a good defender behind the plate yet. Vaz was send back down because Hanny off the DL and leon, whos out of options, was hot...vaz had options.

Not sure what the complaint is with The new FO lineup...

[sk7326]

Does he?

 

Remember this is an org which - since Epstein has left - has:

 

1. Turned the 3B job over to Will Middlebrooks on 4 good weeks of BABIP spiked baseball

2. Put Bradley in CF and then took the job away because Grady Sizemore's entrails had 3 good weeks of pretend baseball

3. Signed Stephen Drew to play SS and bump Bogaerts to 3B (this was more defensible - their 3B production sucked, but was a vote of no confidence for a kid who needed reps)

4. Aggressively promoted Swihart due to injury, and then seemed committed to converting him to LF after a month

5. Sent Christian Vasquez down based on an out of nowhere hot streak from a guy they had cut before (again, more defensible - Vasquez might not actually be able to hit)

 

This is not the team that stood behind Pedroia despite a dreadful first impression.[/

 

They kept JBj when everyone wanted him gone and now hes an AS. That took more patience than pedeys one month slump.

Swihart was up out of necessity. Fact. Allour catcher were hurt. He was switched to LF for the same reasons and he was not a good defender behind the plate yet. Vaz was send back down because Hanny off the DL and leon, whos out of options, was hot...vaz had options.

Not sure what the complaint is with The new FO lineup...

 

An itty bitty sample size caused them to demote their alleged catcher of the future - now if this is a smokescreen for "maybe he is not good" that is one thing - but if that is the actual logic, it is pretty darn silly.

 

It is hard to give them a ton of credit for not selling low on Bradley - and then his second half of 2015 made that obvious. Dustin Pedroia's 31 games in 2006 showed no indicator he could actually play baseball for a living - he was really really bad at most aspects of the game. A lot of the emergency of Bogaerts and Bradley have just been a function of playing and getting reps, things which were monkeyed with unnecessarily in 2014.

 

The post-Epstein management has been more inclined to make decisions with small sample sizes (note that Sizemore beat out Bradley for the CF job in spring 2014, which made no sense on any level ... and Middlebrooks being anointed the future on a small BABIP Spiked sample) - an urge for microwave prospects who fulfill John Sickels predictions instantly, instead of trusting their evaluations and doing the hard PR job of taking the slings and arrows from the press.

[greenwell]

 

An itty bitty sample size caused them to demote their alleged catcher of the future - now if this is a smokescreen for "maybe he is not good" that is one thing - but if that is the actual logic, it is pretty darn silly.

 

It is hard to give them a ton of credit for not selling low on Bradley - and then his second half of 2015 made that obvious. Dustin Pedroia's 31 games in 2006 showed no indicator he could actually play baseball for a living - he was really really bad at most aspects of the game. A lot of the emergency of Bogaerts and Bradley have just been a function of playing and getting reps, things which were monkeyed with unnecessarily in 2014.

 

The post-Epstein management has been more inclined to make decisions with small sample sizes (note that Sizemore beat out Bradley for the CF job in spring 2014, which made no sense on any level ... and Middlebrooks being anointed the future on a small BABIP Spiked sample) - an urge for microwave prospects who fulfill John Sickels predictions instantly, instead of trusting their evaluations and doing the hard PR job of taking the slings and arrows from the press.

 

It was definitely a risk, but there was some merit to it. Sizemore had far more experience and was a very good player for years. Also, in hindsight, Sizemore had a better year in 2014 than Bradley, although they were both bad that year.