2016 Trade and Roster Move Speculation thread

[moonslav59]

Yankees got a nice couple of prospects for miller.

 

Then, they traded for Tyler Clippard- go figure!

[moonslav59]

Based on the proposed trade between Guardians and Brewers, what would be a comparable trade value for Lucroy to the Sox? Can it be done with Sandy and slew of second tier prospects? Or do we have to throw in Swihart as a piece?

He would be an upgrade for the Sox.

 

But, just for 1.3 years.

 

I just don't see the catcher position as being even close to our weakest link.

 

We need to fix holes and not try to further block or bottleneck positions of strength.

[moonslav59]

They had four prospects on Baseball America's midseason top 100 list, then added the #21, #24, and #69 prospects via the Chapman and Miller trades... suddenly that's a very nice system. They're doing what the Red Sox should have done in the 2014 selloff, which is kind of disgusting.

 

But, the Yanks did it for prospects. We did it for ML talent, except for ERod, Hembree & Marco Hernandez.

 

Cespedes (who turned into Porcello)

Kelly

Craig

[Nick]

Last time I checked Hill is batting .268 with a .745 OPS. Not great, but not bad either. He's also not a starter or a stud on this team he's a platoon player. I agree with southpaw the offense is fine and just in a rut. If you look at any team, even a world series champion you'll see stretches where they lose, even to horrible teams at times. If this team picks it back up and gets hot it will win....even if the competition is tough.

 

The long term problem has been and remains pitching on this team. I don't buy your "we don't put the fear in a pitcher[er] that Toronto hitters do"

 

Good.....I would love other teams to not respect this offense, they will probably continue to put up great numbers overall if they do.

 

Hill is batting below .200 since coming over to Sox. I think I've watched his every at bat and it has not been very impressive.

[Nick]

But, just for 1.3 years.

 

I just don't see the catcher position as being even close to our weakest link.

 

We need to fix holes and not try to further block or bottleneck positions of strength.

 

Moon, I get it....but what will it take? I respect your opinion.

[Hugh2]

This team has zero luck with it's bullpen. Go figure the year we win the world series that Koji Uehera emerges but we have a long list of bringing guys in here with lousy results.

 

Eric Gagne was a failure, Joel Hanaran was a failure, Andrew Bailey was a disaster, then there was Mark Melancon. Melancon was great before he came to Boston and Great when he left but sucked here....go figure. Kimbrel has been ok, but has managed to land himself on the D.L. Carson Smith is a promising young arm but has contributed nothing himself as he's landed himself on the D.L.

[Hugh2]

Hill is batting below .200 since coming over to Sox. I think I've watched his every at bat and it has not been very impressive.

 

Ok so you're talking about 10 games then. Since when does 10 games define an established MLB player?

 

Sure he's been disappointing so far this year but if we are evaluating team needs I think we need to have a little bit more foresight than what's going to happen over a week or two of baseball. The biggest hole on this team is it's missing an ACE.

[Jasonbay44]

This team has zero luck with it's bullpen. Go figure the year we win the world series that Koji Uehera emerges but we have a long list of bringing guys in here with lousy results.

 

Eric Gagne was a failure, Joel Hanaran was a failure, Andrew Bailey was a disaster, then there was Mark Melancon. Melancon was great before he came to Boston and Great when he left but sucked here....go figure. Kimbrel has been ok, but has managed to land himself on the D.L. Carson Smith is a promising young arm but has contributed nothing himself as he's landed himself on the D.L.

Don't forget the legendary Bobby Jenks! He was another reliever who had a wonderful stint here.

[moonslav59]

That and they have a lot of money coming off the books soon as well. We should enjoy the suck while it lasts.

 

No big time pitchers to buy this winter though, so that's maybe a good sign.

 

Here's a look at their big deals:

 

Sabathia ($25M) may become a FA after this year if he does not end 2016 on the disabled list with a left shoulder injury, or does not spend more than 45 days in 2016 on the disabled list with a left shoulder injury, or does not make more than six relief appearances in 2016 because of a left shoulder injury

 

Teixeira- FA next year ($22.5M Avg)

 

Tanaka- FA after 2020 ($22.1M Avg)

 

Ellsbury- FA after 2020 or 2021 ($21.9M Avg.)

 

ARod- FA after 2017 ($27.5M Avg.)

 

McCann- FA after 2018 or 2019 ($17M Avg.)

 

Beltran- FA after this year ($15M Avg.)

 

Gardner- FA after 2018 or 2019 ($13m Avg.)

 

Headley- FA after 2018 ($13M Avg.)

 

Castro- FA after 2019 or 2020 ($8.6M Avg.)

 

 

[Nick]

Ranking positions with no concerns for 2017.

 

1 CF Bradley is outstanding CF. Great coverage, great arm. Adding slugging % to his offense was a big plus.

2 RF Betts has converted to RF seamlessly. Great jump on balls. Has pop on his bat. Good speed.

3 SS Xander has become adequate shortstop defensively. Hits for high average. I'd take Betts over him due to better power numbers.

4 2B Pedey simply needs to stay healthy. Can he do it for another 5 years?

5 1B Hanley would be rated higher if he could provide more power

6 3B Shaw has to learn to hit left handed pitching

7 C Sox currently own 5th best offensive output. Will have Vazquez to replace Hanigan. If Sandy comes down to earth, this position may become question mark.

8 LF Holt love fest continues but to me he's mediocre fielder and his bat does not justify full year start

9 DH Encarnacion or bust.....just refer back to last night's game

 

So we can fix our biggest problem by signing a proven power hitter. Hitters are usually not at risky as pitchers, especially DH's.

 

Sooner we find out about Benintendi and Moncada, better equipped Sox will be to get rid of redundancy/blocked players for needs.

Edited July 31, 2016 by Nick

[Nick]

Toronto ahead 2-0, Sanchez pitching....another loss for Orioles a big possibility....Toronto has the worst 1 run game record among playoff contenders, 11-18. Texas is best at 23-7.

Toronto could have been running away with this.

Edited July 31, 2016 by Nick

[d-money]

Blue Jays look more like a contender for the a.l east title.

[Hugh2]

Don't forget the legendary Bobby Jenks! He was another reliever who had a wonderful stint here.

 

I figured I missed someone in there. I kind of like this bullpen in 2017 though, Kimbrel and Smith should both be back and I'm optimistic with what Barnes can become. I think Light, Hembree, and Martin have potential as well. I would like to see them resign Ziegler as well.

[moonslav59]

But, just for 1.3 years. [Lucroy]

 

I just don't see the catcher position as being even close to our weakest link.

 

We need to fix holes and not try to further block or bottleneck positions of strength.

 

 

Moon, I get it....but what will it take? I respect your opinion.

 

Like I mentioned on another thread, there may not be a viable solution to every problem.

 

We could probably make ourselves a top 2 or 3 favorite this year by trading away a big chunk of our near and extended future, but I doubt I would agree on any deals for Sale or Quintana.

 

We might just have to suck it up and hope for the best with maybe a minor pick-up of another RP'er and maybe a cheap, platoon LF'er.

 

I really would love to get Quintana. I'd be willing to "overpay" for him, but even my suggested overpay would likely fall short, so I'm not sure there is an answer.

 

I like Sale too, and would overpay for him, but again, my top suggested offer would probably not outdo the Dodgers or be enough to get the CWS to say yes.

 

I really want to hold onto Moncada. I don't want to compare him to Trout, Harper or even Betts and Bogey,but I think the sky is the ceiling for this kid. I also really like Benintendi, and our need in LF is great, so I'd like to avoid trading him too, but I realize we'll have to give a lot to get one of these two guys.

 

I've recently upped my suggested offers to something like this (the last ones are close calls for me- meaning I'm not sure I'd do them):

 

Swihart, Devers, Kopech, one from Basabe, Lakins, TBall, Owens or Johnson

 

Benintendi, Devers & one from Lakins, TBall, Owens or Johnson

 

Benintendi & Swihart

 

Benintendi, Kopech & one from Lakins, TBall, Owens or Johnson

 

Moncada and two from Basabe, Lakins, TBall, Owens and Johnson.

 

Moncada and Kopech

 

Once you start getting to these, I'm leaning heavily to no:

 

Beni and 2 from Swihart, Devers & Kopech

 

Moncada & one from Swihart, Devers, Kopech

 

I say no to:

 

Moncada and Benintendi but with serious regrets we missed out on a true ace.

 

[Hugh2]

Ranking positions with no concerns for 2017.

 

1 CF Bradley is outstanding CF. Great coverage, great arm. Adding slugging % to his offense was a big plus.

2 RF Betts has converted to RF seamlessly. Great jump on balls. Has pop on his bat. Good speed.

3 SS Xander has become adequate shortstop defensively. Hits for high average. I'd take Betts over him due to better power numbers.

4 2B Pedey simply needs to stay healthy. Can he do it for another 5 years?

5 1B Hanley would be rated higher if he could provide more power

6 3B Shaw has to learn to hit left handed pitching

7 C Sox currently own 5th best offensive output. Will have Vazquez to replace Hanigan. If Sandy comes down to earth, this position may become question mark.

8 LF Holt love fest continues but to me he's mediocre fielder and his bat does not justify full year start

9 DH Encarnacion or bust.....just refer back to last night's game

 

So we can fix our biggest problem by signing a proven power hitter. Hitters are usually not at risky as pitchers, especially DH's.

 

Sooner we find out about Benintendi and Moncada, better equipped Sox will be to get rid of redundancy/blocked players for needs.

 

I'd rather spend the money on locking up some of our own guys so we can feel better about going out and trading for an ACE. Do you really trust giving the ball to Price, Pomeranz, or even Porcello game 1 of the world series??? I think that takes more priority than the 7th or 8th biggest concern with the offense.

 

A Hill/Shaw combo at 3rd (assuming Panda is done) should be fine for .5-1 years, and Benintendi may be ready by next year and Swihart could still be in the fold for next season in LF. Those aren't sure fire answers but they are pretty darn good when you consider the first 6 hitters in your lineup are pretty darn good.

 

We need pitching, this team has enough rotten assets on it so there is zero reason to go out and start given big bucks to 30 year old DH types.

[jacksonianmarch]

I think Encarnacion is ticketed for Boston. Benintendi is your LF next yr. Moncada will push Shaw. Everyone else in the minors is trade bait. I think you will still have enough to get a middle to top line starter if willing to deal off some painful assets like Devers or Groome

[Nick]

Moncada (2-for-2, 3B, 1B, 3 RS), Dubon (2-run HR), Benintendi (3-for-3, 2 HR, 4 RBI, 2B) Good start for our "CORE" today

[Nick]

I think Encarnacion is ticketed for Boston. Benintendi is your LF next yr. Moncada will push Shaw. Everyone else in the minors is trade bait. I think you will still have enough to get a middle to top line starter if willing to deal off some painful assets like Devers or Groome

 

this

[Jasonbay44]

I think Encarnacion is ticketed for Boston. Benintendi is your LF next yr. Moncada will push Shaw. Everyone else in the minors is trade bait. I think you will still have enough to get a middle to top line starter if willing to deal off some painful assets like Devers or Groome

 

I completely agree with this.

[moonslav59]

1 CF Bradley is outstanding CF. Great coverage, great arm. Adding slugging % to his offense was a big plus.

2 RF Betts has converted to RF seamlessly. Great jump on balls. Has pop on his bat. Good speed.

 

I might flip CF and RF, but since Betts is our back-up CF'er, I think you got the top two right.

 

3 SS Xander has become adequate shortstop defensively. Hits for high average. I'd take Betts over him due to better power numbers.

 

Agreed, and with M Hernandez as his back-up and Dubon way down the road, I like this position here too.

 

4 2B Pedey simply needs to stay healthy. Can he do it for another 5 years?

 

Big question, but I think 2b is Holt's best longterm position and Moncada will be ML ready by 2017, so B-I-N-G-O!

 

5 1B Hanley would be rated higher if he could provide more power

 

I'd put the catcher position 5th. I'm not sold on Leon's bat, but he looks to not be a .180 guy anymore either. I love Vazquez and am not concerned about offense from the catcher position, although I've not given up on Vaquez's offense either. Swihart is also has a possible top catching future. throw in another year of hanigan control, and this position is deep and strong.

 

I think HanRam or Pablo may be our DH's next year, but I'm not counting out the fact that Moncada may have to start at DH until he becomes a better fielder than Shaw at 3B, Beni/Young in LF or hanRam/Shaw at 1B. That may take time. So, HanRam is the likely 1bman next year. We may trade him as his stock has risen a little. I'm not sold on Shaw and never have been. I think he will be a platoon corner IF'er going forward.,

 

6 3B Shaw has to learn to hit left handed pitching

 

He won't. I see Moncada as our FT 3Bman, as soon as his defense is not a big enough minus there. This may not be until 2018, so I see 3B as 8th and LF as 9th.

 

7 C Sox currently own 5th best offensive output. Will have Vazquez to replace Hanigan. If Sandy comes down to earth, this position may become question mark.

 

See above

 

8 LF Holt love fest continues but to me he's mediocre fielder and his bat does not justify full year start

 

I've never viewed Holt as a FT player anywhere but maybe 2B, where he is blocked by Pedey and now Moncada. I think his value would be greater to another team than ours, once Papi retires. I like Hernandez and Benintendi as our subs with Rutledge, Marrero and Travis as contenders for the final slot.

 

I see Young and Beni as our LF'ers next year- not Holt. I like Beni, but am not certain of his ML abilities.

 

9 DH Encarnacion or bust.....just refer back to last night's game

 

I think a mix between HanRam, Shaw, Pablo, Young, Monca and others will no make this our weakest position, but certainly much weaker than it is now with Papi.

 

Encarnacion would probably be a great add, but at what cost?

 

We need pitching, pitching, pitching. In that order!

 

So we can fix our biggest problem by signing a proven power hitter. Hitters are usually not at risky as pitchers, especially DH's.

 

Sooner we find out about Benintendi and Moncada, better equipped Sox will be to get rid of redundancy/blocked players for needs.

 

Agreed, so let's spend all our resources on upgrading pitching. If one of the kids fail, or someone else declines, it's easier to fix thoise problems mid-season than finding quality pitching at reasonable costs.

[bowman]

Agree, This is our core for the next so many years. Try to swing a deal with what ever prospects to get it done. Groom, Kopech, Duben, Travis, Chavis, Swihart, Devers, Vaz, etc. If we traded for a solid left fielder, include Benny.

[Hugh2]

If I'm swinging a deal, I better be getting a TOTRS back. We've given up enough top prospects for #3's and relievers.

 

I understand, and love this core going forward. I could live with Swihart in LF > Benintendi if Benitendi could headline a package for Sale. I'm ok with a Shaw/Hill platoon at 3B for 2 years until Devers is ready if Moncada could headline a Syndergaard (not saying he's for sale) deal.

 

Things could look a lot more bright if Pom, and Price look really good down the stretch and Porcello and Wright continue to do what they've done all year. Things could look even better than that if Erod can pull it together.

 

With the lack of my last point or the failure to land another TOTRS, this team just strikes me as an offensive juggernaut that is always good enough to get to the post season but doesn't have that extra ingredient to win the world series. This core is good enough to be relevant for the next 4-5 years with zero additions but we still have a hole in the rotation. All other holes on this team seem superficial to having a pitcher right now to me.

[Jack Flap]

But, the Yanks did it for prospects. We did it for ML talent, except for ERod, Hembree & Marco Hernandez.

 

Cespedes (who turned into Porcello)

Kelly

Craig

 

I know that was the strategy, but given that at the time I felt we were further away from contention than the FO seemed to think (which was borne out by events in 2015), I question whether it should have been.

 

The Lester/Cespedes/Porcello series of deals I have no real problem with per se, but I've always wondered what kind of prospect packages might have been on the table for Lester if we hadn't insisted on major league talent... the Lackey trade, on the other hand, was a complete farce.

[bowman]

Craig what a flub job that turned out to be.

[moonslav59]

If I'm swinging a deal, I better be getting a TOTRS back. We've given up enough top prospects for #3's and relievers.

 

Short.

 

Sweet.

 

And so complete.

[moonslav59]

I think Encarnacion is ticketed for Boston. Benintendi is your LF next yr. Moncada will push Shaw. Everyone else in the minors is trade bait. I think you will still have enough to get a middle to top line starter if willing to deal off some painful assets like Devers or Groome

 

I'd love to get Encarnacion, and I hope he wouldn't flop like all our other recent major signings, but I'm just not sure spending big on him won't severely tie our hands going forward in regards to acquiring top quality pitching.

 

Even with the loss of Papi, hitting will not be close to our biggest weakness, and to me, fixing your weakest "links" is the best way to improve a team.

 

I don't see a lot of weakness in this 2017 line-up:

 

1) Betts RF

2) Pedey 2B

3) Bogey SS

4) Bradley CF

5) HanRam 1B/DH

6) Moncada 3B/DH

7) Shaw 3B/1B

8) Benintendi LF/Young LF/DH

9) Leon/Vazquez C/Swihart C/LF

UT- Holt (Sandoval/Hernandez/Rutledge/Travis/Marrero)

 

SP) Price, _______, Porcello, Wright, Pomeranz, (swing) Erod

RP) Kimbrel, Smith, ______, ______, Barnes, Kelly, Hembree, Ross/Layne

 

Reserves

SP) Owens, Johnson, Elias, O'Sullivan, Cuevas, Haley (Kopech)

RP) (Sp'er from above),Layne/Ross, Workman, Light, Martin, N Ramirez, Ysla

 

Adding Encarnacion on relying on all of the 5 SP'ers to come through and not get hurt might work:

 

1) Betts RF

2) Pedey 2B

3) Bogey SS

4) Encarnacion DH/1B

5) Bradley CF

6) HanRam 1B/DH

7) Moncada/Shaw 3B

8) Benintendi LF/Young LF/DH

9) Leon/Vazquez

UT- Swihart or Holt (Sandoval/Hernandez/Rutledge/Travis/Marrero)

 

SP) Price, Porcello, Wright, Pomeranz, Erod, (swing Kelly)

RP) Kimbrel, Smith, ______, ______, Barnes, Hembree, Ross, Layne

 

Reserves

SP) Owens, Johnson, Elias, O'Sullivan, Cuevas, Haley (Kopech)

RP) (Sp'er from above), Workman, Light, Martin, N Ramirez, Ysla

 

 

[FredLynn]

I think Encarnacion is ticketed for Boston. Benintendi is your LF next yr. Moncada will push Shaw. Everyone else in the minors is trade bait. I think you will still have enough to get a middle to top line starter if willing to deal off some painful assets like Devers or Groome

 

Given the current mess in minor league SP (or lack thereof), I would add Groom to the off limits list. This is especially true now that Espinosa has been traded. We desperately need pitching in the minors. And there is this: Sandoval is still going to be on the roster for many years. That makes for a logjam at 3B. No one is going to take him off our hands, unfortunately.

[TedWilliams101]

Given the current mess in minor league SP (or lack thereof), I would add Groom to the off limits list. This is especially true now that Espinosa has been traded. We desperately need pitching in the minors. And there is this: Sandoval is still going to be on the roster for many years. That makes for a logjam at 3B. No one is going to take him off our hands, unfortunately.

 

Just f*cking cut him. This is where football gets it right and baseball needs to learn. Don't f*ckup a team just because you gave someone a terrible contract and they can't play. Cut his fat a**, eat the money, and move on. We have cheap options for 3B. There is no room on the roster for him so just get it over with. He doesn't deserve a roster spot.

[a700hitter]

Red Sox are reportedly interested in Beltran.

[d-money]

The birds acquired our old friend wade miley.