Who is the Biggest Problem Right Now?

[SoxHop]

Did they not check him out? These are significant investments - they probably had medicals anyway. For them, $9.5M IS chump change for a 1-year hitch by Red Sox standards. That said, I do agree with you that they spent far too much time down this rabbit hole.

 

I couldn't care much about the 9 mil. It's the gamble that every fifth game is going to be a stinker......

[a700hitter]

I couldn't care much about the 9 mil. It's the gamble that every fifth game is going to be a stinker......

 

Yep. If you are going to hand over 20% of your season to guy, I think that is important enough to do a better job of finding out what you are getting.

Edited August 11, 2015 by a700hitter

[SoxHop]

I had one random thought tonight explaining the Red Sox suckness to a Rangers fan........ who isn't all excited about seeing Nap flail away at their playoff run.....

 

I mentioned we traded Lester.......... and then I went into a rant about Lester was really incredible his contract year........... HIS CONTRACT YEAR!!!!!!!!

 

The chump upped the game for the contract year............ where was he the rest of the years.......?

[reYoukilis]

I had one random thought tonight explaining the Red Sox suckness to a Rangers fan........ who isn't all excited about seeing Nap flail away at their playoff run.....

 

I mentioned we traded Lester.......... and then I went into a rant about Lester was really incredible his contract year........... HIS CONTRACT YEAR!!!!!!!!

 

The chump upped the game for the contract year............ where was he the rest of the years.......?

In Boston, being a solid pitcher....which....he still is being. That is except the BEING IN BOSTON PART!!!!

[Kimmi]

It's debatable whether Masterson was a bad risk or not, I guess. But $9.5 million was quite a bit for a dumpster dive. The end results were 59.1 innings and a fWAR of -0.2, for a negative dollar value of $1.7 million, for a net loss of $11.2 million.

 

Perhaps $9.5 mil was a little steep. But again, the idea is that it was for one year. If he reverted back to 2013 form, he would have been a bargain. If he stinks, it's easy enough to cut ties with him.

[Kimmi]

If the rest of the rotation was strong it might have been an acceptable gamble. But when you are gambling on Buch and Kelly also, then I don't think it makes sense. It's too many gambles with a 200 mil team.

 

Yes, there were definitely some question marks going in. But remember, the pitching staff was only supposed to be mediocre. They were not supposed to be the strength of the team.

[Kimmi]

Kimmi, is it possible that they would have learned something if they had watched him throw? I know you keep saying that it is "only" $9.5 million for 1 year. Don't you think it would be worth a couple of plane tickets and some incidental travel expenses to see if he could hit 90? Or is $9.5 million such chump change that it was not worth the organization's time to check out what would be 1 of their 5 starting pitchers for the year. It was lazy and negligent not to check him out. I also challenge your statement that pitchers recovering from arm injuries often regain their velocity. That may be true of TJ surgery, but he didn't have TJ surgery. I would say that recovery from most other injuries to pitchers is not accompanied by a return of velocity.

 

It's possible that they might have learned something from watching him throw. It's also possible that they would not have been able to conclude anything more than what they already knew. It's also possible that they did in fact watch him throw.

 

At the very least, there was a scouting report from watching video that showed a clear change in mechanics (something about the push off leg) pre and post injury. This change in mechanics was due to the injury, and it was the likely cause of Masterson's loss in velocity. The Sox felt that Masterson would regain his velocity now that he was healthy and could revert to his pre-injury mechanics.

[Kimmi]

Did they not check him out? These are significant investments - they probably had medicals anyway. For them, $9.5M IS chump change for a 1-year hitch by Red Sox standards. That said, I do agree with you that they spent far too much time down this rabbit hole. It wasn't as bad one as say, Grady Sizemore last season ... but the warning signs were there early enough to cut bait quickly. I blame the management for not tacking quickly on Masterson who was highly speculative to begin with. This also applies to Kelly who was fringy too and might have been a wipeout bullpen weapon (which would have turned out quite handy).

 

With Koji out for the rest of the season, now is a perfect time to test Kelly out in the closer's role.

[Kimmi]

Yep. If you are going to hand over 20% of your season to guy, I think that is important enough to do a better job of finding out what you are getting.

 

I think they had a pretty good idea of what they were getting.

[User Name]

I still think Miley's going to be ok.

 

Jbay, who hasn't sucked this year in your opinion? All you've done all year is whine about people sucking.

[a700hitter]

I think they had a pretty good idea of what they were getting.

Then they have no excuses.

[iortiz]

I think they had a pretty good idea of what they were getting.

 

That's the thing, they are clueless of what they are getting or doing with this team.

[iortiz]

Then they have no excuses.

 

Your sig about Cherigton should be in Ben's obituaries.

 

It's incredible how many drank and liked that kool aid at the time.

[Kimmi]

Then they have no excuses.

 

They took a reasonable chance on someone and it didn't work out. That's all there is to it. It's similar to the chance they took on Beltre. He worked out, Masterson didn't.

[jd98]

Taking a gamble on Masterson would have been ok if the rest of the rotation was solid. When the other 4 starters were huge question marks, rounding out the rotation with somebody who most likely will suck was a very dumb idea. And $9.5M is too much in either case.

[sk7326]

Taking a gamble on Masterson would have been ok if the rest of the rotation was solid. When the other 4 starters were huge question marks, rounding out the rotation with somebody who most likely will suck was a very dumb idea. And $9.5M is too much in either case.

 

The gamble was not the issue - it was not cutting bait quickly. They had no problem hedging on kiddos in the lineup (to Bogaerts and Bradley's respective detriments) but did not do the same with wobbly veterans who warranted a very very short leash.

[jd98]

The gamble was not the issue - it was not cutting bait quickly. They had no problem hedging on kiddos in the lineup (to Bogaerts and Bradley's respective detriments) but did not do the same with wobbly veterans who warranted a very very short leash.

 

That's where his salary comes in to play. If he was making less, he would have been cut sooner.

[Jasonbay44]

I still think Miley's going to be ok.

 

Jbay, who hasn't sucked this year in your opinion? All you've done all year is whine about people sucking.

 

Like I'm the only person who has bitched, and rightfully so about how awful this team is? This team is in last place, which yeah, means a lot of the players suck, especially pitching wise. I'm not in the Miley fan club like a lot of people seem to be, and I don't get the support or excuses for him, and Porcello. Sorry.

 

There has actually been a lot of guys who haven't sucked in my opinion; Mookie, Xander, Ortiz, De Aza, Hannigan, Pedroia (when healthy), Holt, Buchholz (when healthy), Tazawa, Rodriguez, Swihart, Koji (when he was healthy anyway), and Wright have all "not sucked" in my opinion and there is a number of guys who haven't done that well, but I still like and have hope for, such as JBJ, Castillo, and Hanley, as long as he isn't in left field next season, and I'm sure there is a few others I can't think of at the moment.

[cp176]

The gamble was not the issue - it was not cutting bait quickly. They had no problem hedging on kiddos in the lineup (to Bogaerts and Bradley's respective detriments) but did not do the same with wobbly veterans who warranted a very very short leash.

 

I agree here for sure. It is becoming a bit of a trend for them which does scare me.

[iortiz]

Like I'm the only person who has bitched, and rightfully so about how awful this team is? This team is in last place, which yeah, means a lot of the players suck, especially pitching wise. I'm not in the Miley fan club like a lot of people seem to be, and I don't get the support or excuses for him, and Porcello. Sorry.

 

There has actually been a lot of guys who haven't sucked in my opinion; Mookie, Xander, Ortiz, De Aza, Hannigan, Pedroia (when healthy), Holt, Buchholz (when healthy), Tazawa, Rodriguez, Swihart, Koji (when he was healthy anyway), and Wright have all "not sucked" in my opinion and there is a number of guys who haven't done that well, but I still like and have hope for, such as JBJ, Castillo, and Hanley, as long as he isn't in left field next season, and I'm sure there is a few others I can't think of at the moment.

Do not worry, he loves to bitch about other people bitching who are actually not bitching.

 

Also He is one of those who loves to drink BC Kool Aid.

[Thunder]

Going back to the title question, here's a list. Pick out your favorites.

 

Ogando

Breslow

Taz as closer

Everyone escept Koji who has ever been a part of this bullpen

Cherington

Cherington

Cherington

 

For once, not JBJ

[iortiz]

Going back to the title question, here's a list. Pick out your

 

Porcello

Ogando

Breslow

Taz as closer

Everyone escept Koji who has ever been a part of this bullpen

Cherington

Cherington

Cherington

 

For once, not JBJ

Fixed!

[User Name]

Like I'm the only person who has bitched, and rightfully so about how awful this team is? This team is in last place, which yeah, means a lot of the players suck, especially pitching wise. I'm not in the Miley fan club like a lot of people seem to be, and I don't get the support or excuses for him, and Porcello. Sorry.

 

There has actually been a lot of guys who haven't sucked in my opinion; Mookie, Xander, Ortiz, De Aza, Hannigan, Pedroia (when healthy), Holt, Buchholz (when healthy), Tazawa, Rodriguez, Swihart, Koji (when he was healthy anyway), and Wright have all "not sucked" in my opinion and there is a number of guys who haven't done that well, but I still like and have hope for, such as JBJ, Castillo, and Hanley, as long as he isn't in left field next season, and I'm sure there is a few others I can't think of at the moment.

 

I'm pointing it out because you've never been this bitchy. It's surprising to me. I think they have a chance to be way better in 2016 though. But there's a problem with this team that runs way deeper than the roster, as I've stated before.

[Thunder]

I think they have a chance to be way better in 2016 though. But there's a problem with this team that runs way deeper than the roster, as I've stated before.

 

I'm the top advocate on cleaning house this winter, except for Farrell.

[reYoukilis]

I'm for staying pat except for getting rid of Sandoval. I didn't want Ramirez either but of the two I'd rather he stay mainly because he has performed and I haven't seen any negative press on him.

 

Other than that I think we need to give things more of a chance to succeed than one season.

[Kimmi]

Taking a gamble on Masterson would have been ok if the rest of the rotation was solid. When the other 4 starters were huge question marks, rounding out the rotation with somebody who most likely will suck was a very dumb idea. And $9.5M is too much in either case.

 

When you consider what the FO's philosophy was, that the rotation was not supposed to be lights out, but only decent enough to give the offense a chance to bail them out, I don't think the question marks were as huge as it seems. There was no reason to expect that Porcello, Miley, and Kelly couldn't at least repeat last year's seasons. There were question marks regarding Buchholz and Masterson. but there were also youngsters to step up in case Masterson didn't work out. The problem wasn't so much Masterson not working out as it was Porcello, Miley, and Kelly not performing up to expectations, not to mention our offense being MIA in May.

 

As far as the $9.5 million, the Sox are always willing to overpay in dollars to lessen the number of years. Again, the fact that the deal was for one year only is key.

[Kimmi]

I'm for staying pat except for getting rid of Sandoval. I didn't want Ramirez either but of the two I'd rather he stay mainly because he has performed and I haven't seen any negative press on him.

 

Other than that I think we need to give things more of a chance to succeed than one season.

 

I agree about giving things more than one season to succeed. I have no issue with keeping Pablo at 3B, as I think he will perform closer to contract expectations going forward, even though his contract was too much.

 

That said, if JBJ can hit, I really would like to see an OF of him, Betts, and Castillo. That means Hanley has to play elsewhere. Getting rid of Sandoval would open up 3B for Hanley.

[jacksonianmarch]

Your issues do run deeper than most bad teams, mostly because your GM saddled you with three contracts that appear abhorrent. Coming into the season, you had a real shot at being free of s*** bag contracts which would have allowed your rebuild to proceed unphased. Now, you are stuck with Porcello, Panda, and Hanley, and I am willing to bet that all three are more likely to suck than not. Porcello is probably the only player who would be worth something next year as he couldn't possibly continue to be this bad. Another major issue is that your rotation is terrible. You have Owens and E-Rod as bright futures and maybe Wright makes it as a #5. But if you have 2 "second year" players running your rotation and a knuckler at the back end with a powderkeg in Miley and a dumpster fire in Porcello, then your entire rotation is due to suck. Also, in order to get back to the big time, you need your rookie players and your SS to take the next step and assume leadership roles on the team. You need Ortiz to keep ticking back the clock and you need Pedroia to not perform his best JD Drew impersonation. Panda is 29 and built like he's 49. He cannot move at 3b and his bat has tanked. Hanley has always been about himself and now he has a shiny contract that will pay him whether he tries to go light tower every time or just tries to hit to situation. You have two anchors holding down your team in both the pocket and the field. Your new GM might be better off selling low, eating a boatload of money and trying to change the culture. This team is bad

[cp176]

Your issues do run deeper than most bad teams, mostly because your GM saddled you with three contracts that appear abhorrent. Coming into the season, you had a real shot at being free of s*** bag contracts which would have allowed your rebuild to proceed unphased. Now, you are stuck with Porcello, Panda, and Hanley, and I am willing to bet that all three are more likely to suck than not. Porcello is probably the only player who would be worth something next year as he couldn't possibly continue to be this bad. Another major issue is that your rotation is terrible. You have Owens and E-Rod as bright futures and maybe Wright makes it as a #5. But if you have 2 "second year" players running your rotation and a knuckler at the back end with a powderkeg in Miley and a dumpster fire in Porcello, then your entire rotation is due to suck. Also, in order to get back to the big time, you need your rookie players and your SS to take the next step and assume leadership roles on the team. You need Ortiz to keep ticking back the clock and you need Pedroia to not perform his best JD Drew impersonation. Panda is 29 and built like he's 49. He cannot move at 3b and his bat has tanked. Hanley has always been about himself and now he has a shiny contract that will pay him whether he tries to go light tower every time or just tries to hit to situation. You have two anchors holding down your team in both the pocket and the field. Your new GM might be better off selling low, eating a boatload of money and trying to change the culture. This team is bad

 

Sad but true

[Jasonbay44]

I'm pointing it out because you've never been this bitchy. It's surprising to me. I think they have a chance to be way better in 2016 though. But there's a problem with this team that runs way deeper than the roster, as I've stated before.

 

I'm just frustrated with how the season is gone, and how bad the front office has handled the rotation. I really haven't been bitching lately, I just watch the games for laughs at this point and hope the offense continues progressing because the pitching sure isn't lol.