2014 Offseason Thread

[redsoxfan3]

Obviously, signing Lester is crucial to building our rotation. Right now, Buchholz and Kelly are no better than #4 and #5 starters in our rotation in my mind. I am not big on us signing Justin Masterson. I believe that would just add another #4 starter to our rotation. I don't want a rotation of Lester, Masterson, Buchholz, Kelly, and one of Ranaudo, De La Rosa, Webster, Barnes, etc. I believe we need to sign Lester and Ross, then call it quits with signing FA's.

 

We have too many OF's and too many AAAA pitches who have not lived up to their potential. I know that I might get a lot of people that might disagree with what I am about to propose. Sign Lester and trade for Hamels. If we sign Lester, we have our ace. If we trade for Hamels, we have a great #2 pitcher. Gordon Edes said that it will take three top prospects to trade for Hamels. Offer Barnes, Cecchini, and Marrero (or something similar) for Hamels. Obviosly, guys like Ranaudo or De La Rosa could be substituted for Barnes. Rafael Devers, Manuel Margot, or even Jackie Bradley could be substituted for Cecchini or Marrero. Cecchini and Barnes would offer the Phillies two prospects almost ready for the majors. Just choose three of the prospects previously mentioned to land Hamels if that is what it takes. The three untouchables are Betts, Owens, and Swihart in my opinion.

 

The next trade should be Yoenis Cespedes and one of Webster, Workman, Ranaudo, or De La Rosa for Rick Porcello. I don't think Porcello for Cespedes will happen straight up. We could request a mid-level prospect back in return to make the deal fair. The Tigers will need a SP in return. We have Webster, Barnes, Ranaudo, and De La Rosa who could be potentially be fighting for the 5th rotation spot if we don't trade for or sign three SP's. We also have a surplus of OF's and AAAA SP depth, so losing Cespedes is bound to happen and losing two of Webster, Workman, Ranaudo, De La Rosa, and Barnes will not hurt us, especially with Rodriguez, Owens, and Johnson still waiting in the wings.

 

Our rotation would be Lester, Hamels, Porcello, Buchholz, and Kelly. That is a hell of a lot better then it currently is. There would be no real need to try to extend Porcello during the season. We would have a AAA rotation possibly of Owens, Rodriguez, Johnson, and two of De La Rosa, Barnes, Webster, or Ranaudo (depending on who is actually traded for Porcello and Hamels). There is also the option that Workman, De La Rosa, and/or Webster could pitch out of the oen. I would say that our AAA rotation would be great. That would allow us to have enough time to see if one of the five separate themselves to be able to compete for the 5th spot in the roation for 2016. Also, we would be able to assess if Buchholz will get his s*** together. If not, we have some depth in the minors. Also, this does not make extending Porcello a priority. We would be able to have Lester, Hamels, Buchholz, Kelly and one of the five AAA pitchers competing for a rotation spot in 2016.

 

The trades will also clear up some room in the OF by trading Cespedes. We would need to trade Craig as well. We would have an OF of Ramirez, Castillo, and Betts starting, with Victorino, Nava, and Holt on the bench. We could send Middlebrooks and Bradley back to AAA to hope that they can rebuild some trade value if they are not traded this offseason. Victorino will not be happy being the 4th OF'er, so I could see a mid-season trade in the works. That would leave Holt as the super-utility and Nava as our 4th OF'er. Our lineup would look like this:

 

Castillo - CF

Pedroia -2B

Ortiz - DH

Ramirez - LF

Sandoval - 3B

Napoli - 1B

Bogaerts - SS

Vazquez - C

Betts - RF

 

Rotation:

Lester

Hamels

Porcello

Buchholz

Kelly

 

Bench:

Holt - Utility

Nava - OF

Ross - C

Victorino - OF

 

I don't know how realistic it is to sign Lester, trade for Hamels, and trade for Porcello, but I think this team could be positioned to really make a run for the WS in 2015.

[d-money]

I just can't believe Lester would pick the cubs over us.The cubs are cursed lol

[Bellhorn04]

I don't know how realistic it is to sign Lester, trade for Hamels, and trade for Porcello, but I think this team could be positioned to really make a run for the WS in 2015.

 

I'll drink to that idea but at this point I don't think Lester and Hamels is realistic.

[redsoxfan3]

I'll drink to that idea but at this point I don't think Lester and Hamels is realistic.

 

I can't disagree with that. Having a salary of $25M for Lester each year and adding Hamels' salary on top of that would be something that is likely improbable.

[Bellhorn04]

The Lester watch has turned into quite the eleventh-hour melodrama. It's reported the Red Sox had another meeting with his agents not long ago.

[Palodios]

It seems like every report is referring to Lester leaning to the Cubs. I think that means it is highly unlikely he will actually end up there.

 

The other thing that keeps getting pointed out is that California income tax is 13%, versus Mass/Illinois 5%

Edited December 10, 2014 by Palodios

[User Name]

I'll take Masterson over Porcello anyday, but that's just me.

[User Name]

Obviously, signing Lester is crucial to building our rotation. Right now, Buchholz and Kelly are no better than #4 and #5 starters in our rotation in my mind. I am not big on us signing Justin Masterson. I believe that would just add another #4 starter to our rotation. I don't want a rotation of Lester, Masterson, Buchholz, Kelly, and one of Ranaudo, De La Rosa, Webster, Barnes, etc. I believe we need to sign Lester and Ross, then call it quits with signing FA's.

 

We have too many OF's and too many AAAA pitches who have not lived up to their potential. I know that I might get a lot of people that might disagree with what I am about to propose. Sign Lester and trade for Hamels. If we sign Lester, we have our ace. If we trade for Hamels, we have a great #2 pitcher. Gordon Edes said that it will take three top prospects to trade for Hamels. Offer Barnes, Cecchini, and Marrero (or something similar) for Hamels. Obviosly, guys like Ranaudo or De La Rosa could be substituted for Barnes. Rafael Devers, Manuel Margot, or even Jackie Bradley could be substituted for Cecchini or Marrero. Cecchini and Barnes would offer the Phillies two prospects almost ready for the majors. Just choose three of the prospects previously mentioned to land Hamels if that is what it takes. The three untouchables are Betts, Owens, and Swihart in my opinion.

 

The next trade should be Yoenis Cespedes and one of Webster, Workman, Ranaudo, or De La Rosa for Rick Porcello. I don't think Porcello for Cespedes will happen straight up. We could request a mid-level prospect back in return to make the deal fair. The Tigers will need a SP in return. We have Webster, Barnes, Ranaudo, and De La Rosa who could be potentially be fighting for the 5th rotation spot if we don't trade for or sign three SP's. We also have a surplus of OF's and AAAA SP depth, so losing Cespedes is bound to happen and losing two of Webster, Workman, Ranaudo, De La Rosa, and Barnes will not hurt us, especially with Rodriguez, Owens, and Johnson still waiting in the wings.

 

Our rotation would be Lester, Hamels, Porcello, Buchholz, and Kelly. That is a hell of a lot better then it currently is. There would be no real need to try to extend Porcello during the season. We would have a AAA rotation possibly of Owens, Rodriguez, Johnson, and two of De La Rosa, Barnes, Webster, or Ranaudo (depending on who is actually traded for Porcello and Hamels). There is also the option that Workman, De La Rosa, and/or Webster could pitch out of the oen. I would say that our AAA rotation would be great. That would allow us to have enough time to see if one of the five separate themselves to be able to compete for the 5th spot in the roation for 2016. Also, we would be able to assess if Buchholz will get his s*** together. If not, we have some depth in the minors. Also, this does not make extending Porcello a priority. We would be able to have Lester, Hamels, Buchholz, Kelly and one of the five AAA pitchers competing for a rotation spot in 2016.

 

The trades will also clear up some room in the OF by trading Cespedes. We would need to trade Craig as well. We would have an OF of Ramirez, Castillo, and Betts starting, with Victorino, Nava, and Holt on the bench. We could send Middlebrooks and Bradley back to AAA to hope that they can rebuild some trade value if they are not traded this offseason. Victorino will not be happy being the 4th OF'er, so I could see a mid-season trade in the works. That would leave Holt as the super-utility and Nava as our 4th OF'er. Our lineup would look like this:

 

Castillo - CF

Pedroia -2B

Ortiz - DH

Ramirez - LF

Sandoval - 3B

Napoli - 1B

Bogaerts - SS

Vazquez - C

Betts - RF

 

Rotation:

Lester

Hamels

Porcello

Buchholz

Kelly

 

Bench:

Holt - Utility

Nava - OF

Ross - C

Victorino - OF

 

I don't know how realistic it is to sign Lester, trade for Hamels, and trade for Porcello, but I think this team could be positioned to really make a run for the WS in 2015.

 

Sell the future for 2015 when there are viable options to avoid that route? No thanks.

[d-money]

Idk where this masterson love is coming from.This team needs two decent starters.Our pitchers from the minors pretty much disappointed when they had a chance to prove themselves.

[cp176]

I really am sick of the drama this story has created. I would like to see Lester back in Boston but he really isn't the answer to our pitching issues. He would be a start. Grossly overpaid but hey whatever the market dictates right. Once again, I think that he is the best #2 starter out there. He is a horse - an innings eater who will probably be an effective pitcher in a decent rotation for 3 maybe 4 years. if he goes elsewhere, something else will develop. One window closes another one opens. I will be glad when this one is over.

[cp176]

I hate to admit it but I had forgotten about the Maddon factor as well. if he goes to the Cubs, good luck to him and them.

[User Name]

Idk where this masterson love is coming from.This team needs two decent starters.Our pitchers from the minors pretty much disappointed when they had a chance to prove themselves.

 

He's a mid-rotation starter to slot AFTER the two decent starters. Or do you think the rotation can consist of four pitchers? And even worse, Buch is often injured and can be downright terrible. They need three pitchers who can eat innings, and Masterson can eat innings, and will only cost money. It's common sense.

[dupree]

The Giants are out on Jon Lester. I'd say the Dodgers made the offer for 7 years. It's gonna come down to the Cubs and Red Sox. I think he comes back here instead of the Cubs. It's probably gonna be close to 160M. I think he wants to be here and he can win more Championships here than there. The meeting early tonite with the Sox FO is a good sign in my opinion.

 

I'd say within the next two hours he will sign. They it will be a trade frenzy as soon as the announcement is made.

 

I like the Masterson offer. At 2 years I like it. And a trade for a Porcello/Latos or the big fish in Hamels would be awesome. With the financial commitments the the up coming years the Sox could afford two aces in Lester and Hamels.

 

Work your magic Ben.

In Ben we Trust.

[redsoxfan3]

Sell the future for 2015 when there are viable options to avoid that route? No thanks.

 

Sell the future? lol my proposal is not selling the future. We have eight pitchers who could all start in the rotation in AAA or go to the pen. Let me know how trading two of those away is selling the future. Marrero is blocked by Bogaerts (assuming he can improve his offense like he showed in the last couple months of the season). Cecchini is blocked by Panda and is already in AAA. There is really no room for either of them in the near future. Margot and Devers are nowhere close to the majors. We would get four years of Hamels. We would only get one for Porcello, but we only have one year of Cespedes. That seems pretty fair. I specifically said we will keep Owens, Betts, and Swihart. Also, we would keep Johnson and Rodriguez. The last time I checked, we can only start 5 pitchers and we potentially have 8 in AAA. Trading two away, having 5 in AAA, and moving one to the pen in no way jeapordizes our future. So I guess selling the future means only trading two from a surplus of pitching depth in the minors and trading two guys that are blocked for at least the next six years. I am glad you are not the GM, otherwise we would be as good as the Astros or Cubs for years to come. We need a healthy balance of prospects and veterans.

Edited December 10, 2014 by redsoxfan3

[User Name]

Yeah there's always a "pitching surplus" until the injuries start piling up and/or you trade the young pitcher that winds up becoming a superstar. There are plenty of options that cost only money. Sign two FA's, trade for the other pitcher.

[redsoxfan3]

Porcello's 3.43 ERA last year and Masterson's 5.88 ERA last year are reasons enough for me to choose Porcello. Not to mention Porcello's 1.231 WHIP and Masterson's 1.632 WHIP last year proves Porcello is the better option.

[a700hitter]

Screw Theo! I suspect that Lester is playing the former Boy Blunder and John Noodle Hug Henry, but we will win the $150 million boobie prize.

[iortiz]

My initial idea was sign Lester and Shields and trade/sign for a mid-rotation arm, and DO NOT TRADE anyone "talented". We have the money and chips to get it done.

[User Name]

Porcello's 3.43 ERA last year and Masterson's 5.88 ERA last year are reasons enough for me to choose Porcello. Not to mention Porcello's 1.231 WHIP and Masterson's 1.632 WHIP last year proves Porcello is the better option.

 

You can't compare one-year production in this scenario, because not only was Masterson injured (and this is common knowledger) but Porcello greatly outpitched his peripherals last year, which were similar to the rest of his 4.30 ERA career.

 

Compare the three years prior to 2014 for both pitchers:

 

Porcello average : 178 IP, 4.56 ERA, 96 ERA+, 1.4 (!) WHIP, 5.9 K/9.

 

Masterson average: 205 IP, 3.85 ERA, 100 ERA+, 1.3 WHIP, 7.5 K/9.

 

So you're basically looking at two league-average pitchers, but one is only going to cost you money and people in the industry believe he's bound to bounce back to his pre-injury performance since he has no arm-related issues.

 

I'm also not buying Porcello to the Red Sox because his peripherals just aren't that good.

[iortiz]

On ESPN deportes are saying that Lester will pick up Boston if Cub's ofer is close to the Red Sox. I'm not sure what "close" mean, but seems like Boston at least has the edge. We'll se though.

[example1]

This is going to be one of those nights where the Twitter sphere and this board should be pretty active. I bet we hear in the next hour who he's going to.

[example1]

I really hope it's the Red Sox. At this point just get it done.

[User Name]

He should hurry this s*** up. I need my beauty sleep.

[SeanJohn93]

I keep on refreshing mlb trade rumors every 15 minutes. There is nothing like the Hot Stove season.

[iortiz]

I keep on refreshing mlb trade rumors every 15 minutes. There is nothing like the Hot Stove season.

 

Me too hahaha.

[SeanJohn93]

The longer this goes down, I like the red sox chances, Luchinno doesn't want to lose to Theo Epstein.

[Bellhorn04]

I keep on refreshing mlb trade rumors every 15 minutes. There is nothing like the Hot Stove season.

 

I'm probably going to find about it by opening up the BDC forum and seeing 5-10 threads about it already going.

[Bellhorn04]

The longer this goes down, I like the red sox chances, Luchinno doesn't want to lose to Theo Epstein.

 

Yes, but I think this is in Lester's hands only now.

[SeanJohn93]

I`m sure Ortiz and Pedroia have been in his ear as well.

[iortiz]

Thing is, with Lester aboard, the offseason for us would be most likely easier since a lot of pitchers still out there and we will have more room to negotiate better.