9/29 @ the guys who will be golfing tomorrow

[jung]

Well I know I mentioned this before spring training when people were discussing Felix out of the pen. He can't work out of the pen IMO. He does not know how to do it. I know he has done some pen work in the past but he is terribly uncomfortable doing it and he does not prepare well for it.

 

Wake sounds like he is ready to pounce on Felix for not enthusiastically accepting the pen role. I think that is just Felix knowing his limitations. Just because Wake could go back and forth between pen and rotation does not mean Felix can. Hey I am as ticked off as anybody when Felix shows up out of shape for spring training. However, this is different. Trying to shove a square peg in a round hole is neither good for the peg or the hole.

 

I believe Demps will help us out of the pen...but not Felix.

[SeanJohn93]

I hope we play the Guardians in the playoffs in the 1st round

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

I hope we play the Guardians in the playoffs in the 1st round

 

Idk, they're pretty hot right now.

[Navafan29]

Idk, they're pretty hot right now.

 

Guardians' record vs over .500 teams is very low this year though.

[SoxSport]

Doubront's situation is a reminder that there are still some prima donna attitudes left on the Red Sox from the country club Francona days. Most players in this situation would carry a pail of water in the playoffs if asked. Heck, there's a ton of money at the end of the rainbow. The stakes are high. You do whatever you can to get there--as part of the team. It really isn't a question of "I start better than I relieve". It's a question of we need a pitcher who can come in and shut down the other team because the starter just doesn't have it today. We need starters in reserve. How about that kind of a pitch, Farrell? This reliever////starter division is carried to excess on the Red Sox.

 

I see the Globe is semi-promoting Tito as MOY. Farrell obviously is the clear choice--best AL record, tied for best record in Baseball. Team finished last, last year. The Guardians didn't even win their division. Plus it's hard to tell what the big change with Tito is in Cleveland. Is it Tito?, his bench coach Alomar?, or having Brad Mills back as a coach? Or is it the FO pushing the right buttons? Tito undoubtedly has learned a few lessons which I suspect are not in his book.

[User Name]

I see you're still adept at spouting nonsense.....

[SoxSport]

I see Sveum got fired by the the Cubs. Epstein's buddy, and the guy Cherington wanted to hire last year. So the hiring of Valentine turned out to be a savior for the Red Sox. They didn't have to fire Sveum to get Farrell this year--something Cherington would have found tough to do. In fact, maybe they would have kept Sveum if they had a reasonable year in'12, instead of a disaster, and then where would the Sox be now? Hard to see them on top without Farrell and his coaches. Plus some of those FA signings which might not have happened without a disastrous season. The fortunes of fate.

[seabeachfred]

Doubront's situation is a reminder that there are still some prima donna attitudes left on the Red Sox from the country club Francona days. Most players in this situation would carry a pail of water in the playoffs if asked. Heck, there's a ton of money at the end of the rainbow. The stakes are high. You do whatever you can to get there--as part of the team. It really isn't a question of "I start better than I relieve". It's a question of we need a pitcher who can come in and shut down the other team because the starter just doesn't have it today. We need starters in reserve. How about that kind of a pitch, Farrell? This reliever////starter division is carried to excess on the Red Sox.

 

I see the Globe is semi-promoting Tito as MOY. Farrell obviously is the clear choice--best AL record, tied for best record in Baseball. Team finished last, last year. The Guardians didn't even win their division. Plus it's hard to tell what the big change with Tito is in Cleveland. Is it Tito?, his bench coach Alomar?, or having Brad Mills back as a coach? Or is it the FO pushing the right buttons? Tito undoubtedly has learned a few lessons which I suspect are not in his book.

 

It is possible that Francona operated with a freer hand in Cleveland than he did in Boston. I mean, how many GM's are meeting with their manager every damned day before games as Epstein did with Tito? And knowing how inept Boy Wonder was in judging talent and knowing how meddling Lucchino and Henry were in Francona's last few years, it is possible Tito was working under extreme pressure, something maybe that he doesn't have to deal with in Cleveland. Now all of this wasn't the front office's fault. Francona was a very stubborn person, and his "I DON'T WANT TO LOSE HIM" routine that he used constantly to offer succor to players who weren't performing became more sickening as the y ears went by. He also seemed to make the same mistakes in the dugout over and over again so perhaps he either learned from that or we will see a redux of this as he keeps managing in Cleveland. HOWEVER, fair is fair, and in my opinion he should get American League Manager of the Year. At least the Red Sox were respectable the past decade, save for one month in '11 and the 2012 season. Aside from 2007 it seemed the Guardians were always locked up in the outhouse.

[iortiz]

Mike, I lost the bet and I'm here to pay. PM and let me know what to write in my sig.

 

Regards.

[sk7326]

Doubront's situation is a reminder that there are still some prima donna attitudes left on the Red Sox from the country club Francona days. Most players in this situation would carry a pail of water in the playoffs if asked. Heck, there's a ton of money at the end of the rainbow. The stakes are high. You do whatever you can to get there--as part of the team. It really isn't a question of "I start better than I relieve". It's a question of we need a pitcher who can come in and shut down the other team because the starter just doesn't have it today. We need starters in reserve. How about that kind of a pitch, Farrell? This reliever////starter division is carried to excess on the Red Sox.

 

I see the Globe is semi-promoting Tito as MOY. Farrell obviously is the clear choice--best AL record, tied for best record in Baseball. Team finished last, last year. The Guardians didn't even win their division. Plus it's hard to tell what the big change with Tito is in Cleveland. Is it Tito?, his bench coach Alomar?, or having Brad Mills back as a coach? Or is it the FO pushing the right buttons? Tito undoubtedly has learned a few lessons which I suspect are not in his book.

 

How did Cleveland win 92 games? Let me count the ways.

 

1. 17-2 against the White Sox

2. 2-1 against the Marlins

3. 6-1 against the Astros

4. 4-2 against the Angels

5. 13-6 against the Twins

6. 2-1 against the Mets

7. 3-1 against the Phillies

8. 5-2 against the Mariners

9. 4-2 against the Blue Jays

 

That is a combined 56-18 against the garbage of their schedule ... they went 36-52 against the "decent or better" cohort. They did it by winning the games they should win at a higher rate than anybody else.

 

Tito is a legitimately great manager, in all of the areas that get checked off. But this team feasted on a timber of team which they will not be able to hide from now. This doesn't mean they can't win the World Series - but this is the reality of their season.

[SoxSport]

It is possible that Francona operated with a freer hand in Cleveland than he did in Boston. I mean, how many GM's are meeting with their manager every damned day before games as Epstein did with Tito? And knowing how inept Boy Wonder was in judging talent and knowing how meddling Lucchino and Henry were in Francona's last few years, it is possible Tito was working under extreme pressure, something maybe that he doesn't have to deal with in Cleveland. Now all of this wasn't the front office's fault. Francona was a very stubborn person, and his "I DON'T WANT TO LOSE HIM" routine that he used constantly to offer succor to players who weren't performing became more sickening as the y ears went by. He also seemed to make the same mistakes in the dugout over and over again so perhaps he either learned from that or we will see a redux of this as he keeps managing in Cleveland. HOWEVER, fair is fair, and in my opinion he should get American League Manager of the Year. At least the Red Sox were respectable the past decade, save for one month in '11 and the 2012 season. Aside from 2007 it seemed the Guardians were always locked up in the outhouse.

 

Hard to say who was pulling Tito's strings in Boston. The FO does like to control the manager--that's pretty obvious after last year. Valentine was left to hang in the breeze last year. Big difference this year--everybody pulling in the same direction. Plus a much stronger coaching staff.

 

I do think Farrell will win MOY. The Guardians spent a lot of money signing FAs in the offseason--probably as much as the Sox did. Farrell and Tito both had expensive teams to manage, and Farrell won more games. The MOY ballot, I believe is taken before the playoffs, so the playoffs don't count--though they should.

[seabeachfred]

How did Cleveland win 92 games? Let me count the ways.

 

1. 17-2 against the White Sox

2. 2-1 against the Marlins

3. 6-1 against the Astros

4. 4-2 against the Angels

5. 13-6 against the Twins

6. 2-1 against the Mets

7. 3-1 against the Phillies

8. 5-2 against the Mariners

9. 4-2 against the Blue Jays

 

That is a combined 56-18 against the garbage of their schedule ... they went 36-52 against the "decent or better" cohort. They did it by winning the games they should win at a higher rate than anybody else.

 

Tito is a legitimately great manager, in all of the areas that get checked off. But this team feasted on a timber of team which they will not be able to hide from now. This doesn't mean they can't win the World Series - but this is the reality of their season.

 

It is stark reality sk7. And the script is being played that way in Cleveland tonight as Francona's forces are on the wrong side of a 3-0 game with two outs and one on in the home half of the 8th. They have left about nine runners on base in this game and once again he is stuck or wedded to his station-to-station strategy that he used in Boston. Fort he record, he has done a solid job in Cleveland this season considering how lousy they were last year, but it looks like the prince will turn into a pumpkin within the next half hour. And BTW, Nick Swisher has to be as bad a post-season choke up artist as there is in baseball. He has stunk again tonight going 0 for 4 with two strikeouts and at least four runners left on base.

[jung]

Well the way things are going, it looks like we will get the Rays instead of the Guardians for the usual reasons....The Rays can pitch. Frankly I would prefer Cleveland and I don't care how "hot" they were going in. They played s*** teams and won....big deal.

[seabeachfred]

Hard to say who was pulling Tito's strings in Boston. The FO does like to control the manager--that's pretty obvious after last year. Valentine was left to hang in the breeze last year. Big difference this year--everybody pulling in the same direction. Plus a much stronger coaching staff.

 

I do think Farrell will win MOY. The Guardians spent a lot of money signing FAs in the offseason--probably as much as the Sox did. Farrell and Tito both had expensive teams to manage, and Farrell won more games. The MOY ballot, I believe is taken before the playoffs, so the playoffs don't count--though they should.

 

From what I can see, this year the front office, especially the meddling Lucchino was kept at bay and let Farrell and his coaching staff run the show without any interference. To be sure, Cherington and Farrell seem to work well together and get along very well. You can't minimize that importance. Our friend Jung might have hit the nail on the head though. The Guardians were what, 56-18 against the dog shits in the league? Compare that to their record against teams over 500. Big difference right? My complaint against Francona has always been his stubbornness in adhering to that boring station-to-station philosophy which could be a reason we led the league in hitting into double plays six of the eight years he ran the Red Sox. However, he does have a good chance to win the MOTY this season. Maybe.

[seabeachfred]

Well the way things are going, it looks like we will get the Rays instead of the Guardians for the usual reasons....The Rays can pitch. Frankly I would prefer Cleveland and I don't care how "hot" they were going in. They played s*** teams and won....big deal.

 

Well said Jung....BIG DEAL!!!!!! Of course, good teams have to be alble to beat the crappy teams and break even with the contenders. The Guardians were adept at the first thing and totally inept in the other, and tonight is a good example why they will be going golfing this weekend. Let's just make sure we are ready for the Tampas.

[jung]

See ya' later tribe. Not sure I like this. I don't like seeing f*** face Madden and that damned Rays pitching staff. We can surely beat them....but Madden will be his usual Madden-ing self and so will his dick-head team.

[seabeachfred]

See ya' later tribe. Not sure I like this. I don't like seeing f*** face Madden and that damned Rays pitching staff. We can surely beat them....but Madden will be his usual Madden-ing self and so will his dick-head team.

 

Doesn't matter my friend. They are in the way and we have to take care of them. We are NOT Cleveland; we are better and we can and should win.

[Youk Of The Nation]

*Maddon

[Thunder]

The Sox were 12-7 against the Rays this year. We've beaten Price at least twice and Matt Moore at least once (correct me if I'm wrong). We have one of the best playoff rotation. Lester is our ace again, and he's going game 1. Lackey has had a great year, and he'll go game 2. Buchholz, who has been good since returning, goes game 3. When you have a strong rotation like this, it really builds team morale and gives them the feeling that they can do it.

[seabeachfred]

*Maddon

 

Gracias!!!!

[SoxSport]

The Red Sox should be favored off their record against the Rays. But Price was off form early in the season, and the Rays have gotten better 2nd half. It all boils down to pitching, whether they can hit Price and Moore, and whether their own starters can pitch well. The CBS NY guys are lining up for the Rays on the tweets. It figures.

 

I see Doubront changed his tune about relieving, and is now the 25th man. That improves the BP vs Thornton.

 

The other guys sent to Florida (Bradley et al) I assume may still be called up if needed the next series. Not sure how that works. Vic and Ells have to stay healthy, or the OF will take a hit defensively without Bradley. That would be important with a team like the Rays. You figure Bradley wouldn't be used against the lefties anyways, though he has a pretty good eye and hit a HR off a leftie at Fenway in Sept.

 

Can't figure rookies Perez and Salazar starting for Texas and Cleveland in a one game showdown. Both failed the first few innings, and left their teams behind. You have to go with your veterans--your best starters. The Cards won today with Wainright. Burnett, who had a bad record pitching in St Louis, had another bad game. You have to watch your matchups and play percentages all the time.