Did David Ortiz ever use steroids?

[NativeBostonian]

I got in an argument with a Yankees about David Ortiz. More specifically how he tested positive for steroids and how he was no different than Alex Rodriguez. well, this argument got me doing a lot of research. All i remember was David Ortiz being on this list of players that was composed in 2003. This list was composed of players who supposedly tested positive for banned substanc. But, there isn't anything else on David besides this suspect list that was supposed to be destroyed after the results. Is he just blowing smoke because he is mad, or is there truth behind this that I'm missing?

[VA Sox Fan]

I believe he did at one time.

[rjortiz]

I got in an argument with a Yankees about David Ortiz. More specifically how he tested positive for steroids and how he was no different than Alex Rodriguez. well, this argument got me doing a lot of research. All i remember was David Ortiz being on this list of players that was composed in 2003. This list was composed of players who supposedly tested positive for banned substanc. But, there isn't anything else on David besides this suspect list that was supposed to be destroyed after the results. Is he just blowing smoke because he is mad, or is there truth behind this that I'm missing?

 

I think it's highly likely he did.

[BornToRun]

I wouldn't be surprised. I honestly don't really care either, so long as if he's still doing them, he doesn't get caught.

[a700hitter]

I wouldn't be surprised. I honestly don't really care either, so long as if he's still doing them, he doesn't get caught.

I hope that he isn't using them, because Ryan Dempster might start throwing baseballs at him in the clubhouse. We can't have that. I'd rather they just eat chicken and drink beer.

[BornToRun]

I hope that he isn't using them, because Ryan Dempster might start throwing baseballs at him in the clubhouse. We can't have that. I'd rather they just eat chicken and drink beer.

 

At this point, I'd prefer to see Dempster smoking crystal in the dugout than standing on the mound.

[a700hitter]

At this point, I'd prefer to see Dempster smoking crystal in the dugout than standing on the mound.

I'll buy it for him.

[mvp 78]

Just wonder why they leaked Ortiz' name but not Jeter's?

[Thunder]

When Papi reached his peak, the steroid era was almost over. I think he has been clean so far in his career, and always will be. Red Sox players don't do things like that.

[BornToRun]

When Papi reached his peak, the steroid era was almost over. I think he has been clean so far in his career, and always will be. Red Sox players don't do things like that.

Not trying to be a jerk but I think we're forgetting Manny Ramirez.

[rjortiz]

When Papi reached his peak, the steroid era was almost over. I think he has been clean so far in his career, and always will be. Red Sox players don't do things like that.

 

David Ortiz and Manny Ramirez? What about Jose Canseco? It's probable that there are more that we don't know about. I think you're letting your fandom clout your judgement.

[Thunder]

Not trying to be a jerk but I think we're forgetting Manny Ramirez.

 

Who's that???

 

Kidding. He's the lone exception.

[rjortiz]

Who's that???

 

Kidding. He's the lone exception.

 

http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/view/102512-ex-player-red-sox-taught-steroids-use

 

http://www.sportingnews.com/mlb/story/2013-02-07/mlb-steroids-curt-schilling-red-sox-peds-hgh-biogenesis-alex-rodriguez

[sk7326]

Answer is probably yes - at least for a time. But given how the sport was until - let's just say until pretty recently - it is hard to call any champion "clean" or any team having more integrity than others. Haters can hate, but it's not supported by the evidence.

[mvp 78]

David Ortiz and Manny Ramirez? What about Jose Canseco? It's probable that there are more that we don't know about. I think you're letting your fandom clout your judgement.

 

Manny Alexander

[RedSoxNC84]

I still think everyone in sports should just do steroids forever. Then we wouldn't have sports, we'd have SUPER sports. That and they shouldn't use bats, they should use railroad ties.

[Behindenemylines]

Not trying to be a jerk but I think we're forgetting Manny Ramirez.

 

No that was just Manny being Manny. With A-Fraud its that he continued to do them after he came out after the first time and said he only did it for a few years and judge him moving forward. Well moving forward it looks like he continued with them. That is him looking at everyone in the eye and lying. I don't trust a word that comes out of his mouth. My take on it is if his lips are moving he is lying.

[BSN07]

I don't care about PEDS. I rather see guys in top form all season long and recover quicker from injury instead of sputtering through the dog days of summer. The legality issues and trickle down effect to College and High School levels would be an issue tho. As far as the numbers go I don't care. I don't typically compare players to previous generations as it's an act of futility imo. I like to see records broken for the entertainment aspect of it but that's about it when drawing comparisons to players from generations past. There's too many variables to account for. As far as the HOF goes, everyone should be included. It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Numbers. What they should do is distinguish certain generations of the game when telling Baseballs story. pre-segregation, post segregation, Free Agency/expansion period(I think as soon as the money started becoming a real factor is when PED's started moving into the game, it's just my personal opinion) PED Testing period(not the best name lol). If the HOF is really trying to pass baseball's story along to future generations(which is the point right?) separating these periods and explaining them and their players I think would do some HOF's more justice. Everyone only talks about the real big names, there's tons of guys in the HOF who get over looked because people only want to compare the big numbers guys a lot of the time and were absolute monsters in their careers. Ok that's my PED rant for the year

[a700hitter]

I don't care about PEDS. I rather see guys in top form all season long and recover quicker from injury instead of sputtering through the dog days of summer. The legality issues and trickle down effect to College and High School levels would be an issue tho. As far as the numbers go I don't care. I don't typically compare players to previous generations as it's an act of futility imo. I like to see records broken for the entertainment aspect of it but that's about it when drawing comparisons to players from generations past. There's too many variables to account for. As far as the HOF goes, everyone should be included. It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Numbers. What they should do is distinguish certain generations of the game when telling Baseballs story. pre-segregation, post segregation, Free Agency/expansion period(I think as soon as the money started becoming a real factor is when PED's started moving into the game, it's just my personal opinion) PED Testing period(not the best name lol). If the HOF is really trying to pass baseball's story along to future generations(which is the point right?) separating these periods and explaining them and their players I think would do some HOF's more justice. Everyone only talks about the real big names, there's tons of guys in the HOF who get over looked because people only want to compare the big numbers guys a lot of the time and were absolute monsters in their careers. Ok that's my PED rant for the year

I agree with everything you say above with regard to PEDs. I'm not so sure if I like your restructuring of the HOF, but it doesn't seem like a fully formed idea on your part.

 

As for the PEDs, because of the big money in the game there will always be high tech drug cheating on a massive scale. The temptation is too great and the players and the agents etc. have the money to get the stuff. Legalizing it would level the playing field, but as you noted there would be a trickle down effect to college and high school athletes and maybe even overzealous parents of little leaguers looking for an edge. The trickle down effect is the sole reason why I think the pros need to keep the PEDs illegal. But for that, I wouldn't care if they ingested uranium.

[RedSoxNC84]

I agree with everything you say above with regard to PEDs. I'm not so sure if I like your restructuring of the HOF, but it doesn't seem like a fully formed idea on your part.

 

As for the PEDs, because of the big money in the game there will always be high tech drug cheating on a massive scale. The temptation is too great and the players and the agents etc. have the money to get the stuff. Legalizing it would level the playing field, but as you noted there would be a trickle down effect to college and high school athletes and maybe even overzealous parents of little leaguers looking for an edge. The trickle down effect is the sole reason why I think the pros need to keep the PEDs illegal. But for that, I wouldn't care if they ingested uranium.

 

Could you imagine a bunch of jacked up little league beasts? 12 year olds hitting 400ft dingers? I'd actually watch the little league world series then.

[SoxSport]

Since the late 90s, I would say that, for anyone who hit over 50 HRs, the burden of proof is on them to show they didn't use steroids or HGH.

[sk7326]

On some level we have to be grownups about this. The teams are all looking for an edge - and for a time from the resumption of baseball after the 1994 strike to, well, now I suppose - players took a whirl with PEDs, and more than likely teams helped provide them whenever possible. There is a narrative associated with cheating and clean players getting screwed - but without a full accounting of the time period, it is not fair to speculate on who was "enhanced" and who was not. Hell, baseball relies on such specialized skills that the actual positive effects of steroids are not at all set in stone. This doesn't mean I don't think there was an effect - I just don't know what it is. Homeruns are not sufficient evidence - after all the McGwire-Sosa thing happened in the shadows of a two team expansion, and in the history of baseball expansion periods have always had large homerun boosts come with it.

 

Certainly I think the writers essentially passing along rumors like jr high school chicks about who might have used - and using that to base HoF decisions is unconscionable, especially placing a pure guilt by association case on Jeff Bagwell, who should be a lead pipe cinch to get in. Everybody had years to unring the bell and nobody chose to, and that includes the writers and the league itself. It is odd for a museum of baseball to try to deny that the greatest individual offensive performer since the Babe walked the earth - I am sure the drugs helped that as much as racial non-integration helped the Babe. (although the drugs do not explain a truly baffling 232 walks in a season).

 

The effects of steroids are not certain - and I am not really sure HGH helps performance (in a highly skilled world like baseball) much at all. At least the latter has a bonafide medical use, and I don't see why it cannnot be delivered to players by team physicians. Technology to help injury recovery is a good thing. At the end of the day, did the 2004/7 Sox have PED use? Probably - but I have a hard time saying the Red Sox were dirty while the 2003 Marlins or 2000 Yankees were clean. That doesn't square with any sort of laugh test. It was not a "clean" game then (if it ever has been) - no point making judgments on relative cleanliness.

[BornToRun]

Baseball's never been clean. Cheating is a huge part of the game's history. Hank Aaron and Mickey Mantle used Greenies, Gaylord Perry built a HOF career on an illegal pitch, and Bobby Thomson hit his shot with help from a sign stealing operation. I don't see how that's all okay but then steroids are suddenly some moral outrage that causes massive witch hunts by the press.

[a700hitter]

Baseball's never been clean. Cheating is a huge part of the game's history. Hank Aaron and Mickey Mantle used Greenies, Gaylord Perry built a HOF career on an illegal pitch, and Bobby Thomson hit his shot with help from a sign stealing operation. I don't see how that's all okay but then steroids are suddenly some moral outrage that causes massive witch hunts by the press.

If you ain't cheating, you ain't trying.

[Emmz]

Using PEDs isn't even creative or sneaky or anything, it's just cheating.

 

I don't have the same respect for any player who's used PEDs. I'll still like Ortiz as a player, I'll still want him to be successful, but no way he should even be considered for the HOF.

 

Either way, he is different from A-Rod in that he isn't a rat. I think the only player I really dislike more than A-Rod is Braun.

[jad]

Ortiz made the off-hand remark years ago that he had 'no idea' what kind of stuff players in the Domincan R were given. Fair enough. Also, what he's angry about is that his name was leaked in what was supposed to be a confidential study. That's what he means about someone out to get him. As for the rest, who cares whether he's different from A-rod? We're fans; they are professional entertainers. I'm a RS fan, but ARod is one of the greatest hitters I've seen. As long as they aren't murderers, rapists, crass racists, and the like, I really don't care about the personal lives of the players or the precise ways they bend rules about conditioning. The reason pro sports has rightly come down on steroids, is that they realize young stupid kids will be emulating whatever the pro's do; but what they seem to have done in their stupid hysteria is prove that certain kinds of PEDs in fact work.

[a700hitter]

Ortiz made the off-hand remark years ago that he had 'no idea' what kind of stuff players in the Domincan R were given. Fair enough. Also, what he's angry about is that his name was leaked in what was supposed to be a confidential study. That's what he means about someone out to get him. As for the rest, who cares whether he's different from A-rod? We're fans; they are professional entertainers. I'm a RS fan, but ARod is one of the greatest hitters I've seen. As long as they aren't murderers, rapists, crass racists, and the like, I really don't care about the personal lives of the players or the precise ways they bend rules about conditioning. The reason pro sports has rightly come down on steroids, is that they realize young stupid kids will be emulating whatever the pro's do; but what they seem to have done in their stupid hysteria is prove that certain kinds of PEDs in fact work.

PED use creates an uneven playing field, because not everyone does it. Believe it or not, even in the heyday of PEDs before the drug testing, a lot of players were clean. Canseco, who is trying to make money and sell books claims that two-thirds were doing it. That is probably an overstatement, but even if accepted on it's face, there were at least 250 MLB players who were clean at the height of the usage. They had an unlevel playing field and they were cheated. The fans were cheated, because we thought that we were witnesses to something special watching Bonds and the MGWire Sosa HR chase and Clemens and so on. Now, we realize that they just gave themselves an unfair edge. I used to watch the Giants a lot and marvel at Bonds. His plate discipline was unbelievable and when the pitcher threw him a strike, he crushed the ball at a phenomenal rate. He almost never missed his pitch or failed to crush it. He was always great, but earlier in his career, you could get him out with pitches out of the zone. He was playing in an otherworldly manner in his Giant days. It was special to watch. Now, it just seems fake and not special. It's like finding out that Miss America had a boob job before the pageant. Yes, she is a beautiful girl, but she shouldn't have won because she was artificially enhanced, fake.

[Emmz]

PED use creates an uneven playing field, because not everyone does it. Believe it or not, even in the heyday of PEDs before the drug testing, a lot of players were clean. Canseco, who is trying to make money and sell books claims that two-thirds were doing it. That is probably an overstatement, but even if accepted on it's face, there were at least 250 MLB players who were clean at the height of the usage. They had an unlevel playing field and they were cheated. The fans were cheated, because we thought that we were witnesses to something special watching Bonds and the MGWire Sosa HR chase and Clemens and so on. Now, we realize that they just gave themselves an unfair edge. I used to watch the Giants a lot and marvel at Bonds. His plate discipline was unbelievable and when the pitcher threw him a strike, he crushed the ball at a phenomenal rate. He almost never missed his pitch or failed to crush it. He was always great, but earlier in his career, you could get him out with pitches out of the zone. He was playing in an otherworldly manner in his Giant days. It was special to watch. Now, it just seems fake and not special. It's like finding out that Miss America had a boob job before the pageant. Yes, she is a beautiful girl, but she shouldn't have won because she was artificially enhanced, fake.

 

Hit the nail on the head.

 

No way in hell that I can respect what Bonds did the same way that I could respect it had it been done legitimately.

[a700hitter]

Hit the nail on the head.

 

No way in hell that I can respect what Bonds did the same way that I could respect it had it been done legitimately.

I hope that my Miss America analogy was not offensive to our women readers.

[Bellhorn04]

I have a strong suspicion that my boy Bellhorn was a juicer. He hit some pretty impressive shots in that 2004 postseason. Even that one he hit in Game 6. He took an outside pitch and drove it into the left field seats, on a cold and misty night. And the one he hit in Game 7 was an absolute moonshot.