Red Sox 2012/2013 Offseason Thread

[a700hitter]

No, absolutely not. I don't think it's implausible that the Marlins were asking for a big haul of prospects from anyone interested in this deal.

Middlebrooks and Bogaerts would be like the Jays giving up Lawrie and their top prospect. What the Jays gave up was far less. I'm not interested in rumors about why the deal fell thru. Maybe that was the Jays starting point, but I am pretty certain that it wasn't their bottom line. Cherries is going to get very skinny if every GM eats his lunch.

[jung]

Just a general statement....I guess to generalize farther, I would be more reluctant to let go of high pitching prospects even if they have sone development time ahead of them cause it is so hard to develop pitchers.

 

Don't know what the heck to think about or the discussion might have been with the Sox....I cannot imagine the Marlins talking about Middlebrooks and Bogaerts...that is a long way from where they were with the Jays. I would not have given Middlebrooks and Bogaerts in that deal. Maybe a couple of guys SFF put in his post would have had me thinkin' but WMB and Bogs....would have been a non starter for me.

[jung]

Wow Price beat out Verlander for AL Cy Young

[SoxFanForsyth]

Now that Hunter is gone, the OF market is getting thin, and Cody Ross can probably be more firm on his desire for a 3 year deal.

 

I think the Sox land Napoli, it's a very good fit for both parties. And I think the Sox will go the extra mile to acquire him (much like they did for David Ross, who is going to surprise a lot of people on this thread. Very good defensive catcher, knows the game well, gets respect from pitchers, calls good games, provides above average offense).

 

Josh Johnson was someone I had on my radar, but that's moot now. I wonder if Cherrington can pry Garza from the Cubs for a deal revolved around Salty and Cecchini?

 

I am getting a bit antsy, though. Thanksgiving always signals the meat of the offseason to me, and usually I'd like to see at least one starting piece added by this time in an offseason that is as demanding as this one is going to be if the Sox want to be competitive.

 

Hope we don't end up in a position like last offseason where we basically make no moves.

 

Salary is only at around $90mm right now. Tons of money to spend, Ben. Don't have to blow it all this offseason, but don't turn us into the Royals either.

[bubbakeg52]

I think the Sox will get Anibal Sanchez, Shane Victorino, and Mike Napoli. Sign Bay to Spring Training. Bradley Jr and Bogaerts are going to be on the team in 2014. Wooooo! That will be a nice change

[bubbakeg52]

The Red Sox got slapped in the face and I expect a big time trade especially with Ellsbury and Lackey leaving next year.

[jung]

I would be OK with those three guys becoming Sox. I would love for them to have another arm but they must think enough of Felix to give him another year to develop. Honestly I can't see Felix as ever making it up past a 4 in the rotation though. So I would be willing to say goodbye to Felix to make room for another solid middle rotation guy.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Why pay for Victorino when you can get almost the same production from Kalish?

[bubbakeg52]

Why pay for Victorino when you can get almost the same production from Kalish?

 

Then why not sign Upton because he is better than both. Kalish isn't going to be their starting outfielder.

[kapsis21]

Why pay for Victorino when you can get almost the same production from Kalish?

 

yep Victorino is a NL league player and mediocre average at best.

 

I would pry Anibal Sanchez and Napoli and sign Cody Ross, then get a trade for Garza going.

that is my wish list anyways.

 

our SS is still a big gaping hole though. not sure who fits the bill.

[kapsis21]

Then why not sign Upton because he is better than both. Kalish isn't going to be their starting outfielder.

 

i like that!!

[bubbakeg52]

yep Victorino is a NL league player and mediocre average at best.

 

I would pry Anibal Sanchez and Napoli and sign Cody Ross, then get a trade for Garza going.

that is my wish list anyways.

 

our SS is still a big gaping hole though. not sure who fits the bill.

 

Garza for Salty and prospects. Sanchez, Napoli, Ross, and Swisher. SS-Drew (he sucks but will be a Starting SS and Iggy can play defensive replacement.

[iortiz]

yep Victorino is a NL league player and mediocre average at best.

 

I would pry Anibal Sanchez and Napoli and sign Cody Ross, then get a trade for Garza going.

that is my wish list anyways.

 

our SS is still a big gaping hole though. not sure who fits the bill.

 

I wouldn't pay for a SS right now... nothing worthy is out there. You got Ciriaco anyway, who can be at least an average one with an interesting upside. Invest in pitching; 2 real SP, then get Ross, an OF and a 1B.This is all I ask this offseason.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Then why not sign Upton because he is better than both. Kalish isn't going to be their starting outfielder.

 

Upton is going to demand 5/70mm, I think that's way too much for him myself.

 

I'd much rather take a flier on Melky Cabrera for 1 year/7-8mm and see how he rebounds.

[jung]

Upton is in a completely different price category I would think...something around what SFF is talkin' about, maybe even more.

[bubbakeg52]

Napoli,Melky,Swisher,Sanchez, and Garza would be smart moves.

 

You wouldn't have to worry about Ellsbury leaving b/c Bradley Jr and you don't have hurry Brentz even though he will be up 1st. Then Swisher can move over to 1b when Napoli moves to DH (after a 2-3 year period). Then Bogaerts takes LF

[Palodios]

Why pay for Victorino when you can get almost the same production from Kalish?

 

I agree that they have very similar skillsets, but the difference is that Kalish has yet to prove anything, and can't stay healthy. Victorino may end up being the bargain of the offseason.

[bubbakeg52]

2014--- Why not move Middlebrooks to 1b and Bogaerts to 3b.

Does anyone see Middlebrooks being a Shea Hillenbrand?

Does anyone see Jackie Bradley Jr being a Cameron Maybin?

[SoxFanForsyth]

I agree that they have very similar skillsets, but the difference is that Kalish has yet to prove anything, and can't stay healthy. Victorino may end up being the bargain of the offseason.

 

Well, this is also the first time Kalish has been healthy since 2010. And in 2010, as a 22 year old, he showed a lot of promise.

 

Certainly enough promise for Bill James to project him to be a 20/20 guy in 2011, but then he got hurt.

 

I don't think it would be a bad idea at all to line up 2013 with Kalish as your starting RF. He's going to be 25 next year, it's time to see what you've got in him.

 

Just to be clear, too, when I met Kalish, he actually said he moved to Boston this offseason because he was finally healthy for the first time and wanted to train here and at Fenway, so this is from the horses mouth, not from some report.

[Palodios]

The beauty about a guy like Kalish is that he can play every outfield position. While it makes absolutely no sense to risk going into the season with him as a starter, he will have plenty of room to grow as a 4th outfielder. If he proves to be a very good player, there is a good chance there will be an opening in the outfield for him. If not, trade Ellsbury midseason, and move him to center.

 

Kalish as the 4th outfielder is win-win for everyone involved.

[SoxFanForsyth]

http://www.milb.com/index.jsp?sid=t531

 

Off topic, but everyone must see this.

 

They used to be the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees (AAA affiliate).

 

Oh how they've changed.

[mvp 78]

Before that, they were the SWB Red Barons (Phillies affiliate)

[bubbakeg52]

The beauty about a guy like Kalish is that he can play every outfield position. While it makes absolutely no sense to risk going into the season with him as a starter, he will have plenty of room to grow as a 4th outfielder. If he proves to be a very good player, there is a good chance there will be an opening in the outfield for him. If not, trade Ellsbury midseason, and move him to center.

 

Kalish as the 4th outfielder is win-win for everyone involved.

 

Throw in the towel and assume Kalish is going to be better than Reddick. Middlebrooks is going to be a young Mike Lowell. Throw in the towell and pretend Bradley Jr is going to be B.J. Upton. Throw in the towell and pretend Bogaerts is going to be Hanley Ramirez. Throw in the towell and pretend Bryentz is going to Trot Nixon. You guys should go move to single A ownership and have a good time watching that s*** show. Kalish sucks and Melky is better and so is Ross, Ludwick, Young, Swisher, Upton, etc.... Why don't they spend the 150 mil on someone besides Kalish.. I don't care if he singed your comic book. He sucks.

[bubbakeg52]

The number 7 overall pick this year will be better than Kalish at his best in any fantasy world you live in. plain and simple.

[Palodios]

Throw in the towel and assume Kalish is going to be better than Reddick. Middlebrooks is going to be a young Mike Lowell. Throw in the towell and pretend Bradley Jr is going to be B.J. Upton. Throw in the towell and pretend Bogaerts is going to be Hanley Ramirez. Throw in the towell and pretend Bryentz is going to Trot Nixon. You guys should go move to single A ownership and have a good time watching that s*** show. Kalish sucks and Melky is better and so is Ross, Ludwick, Young, Swisher, Upton, etc.... Why don't they spend the 150 mil on someone besides Kalish.. I don't care if he singed your comic book. He sucks.

 

A .600 OPS speedster with defensive versatility is perfectly fine as a 4th outfielder.

[bubbakeg52]

A .600 OPS speedster with defensive versatility is perfectly fine as a 4th outfielder.

2yrs ago he had a -12 OPS plus

ciriaco can play that role worse case.

Problem with Kalish as a 4 is he will end up getting hurt and Nava or Lin will take his ab.

Sands is going to be on the bench to doing his job well.

[mvp 78]

The number 7 overall pick this year will be better than Kalish at his best in any fantasy world you live in. plain and simple.

 

They need to get a pitcher with that pick.

[bubbakeg52]

They are predicting the guy out of HS in GA.

[SoxSport]

A pack of JJ, Buehrle, Reyes and Bonifacio would cost any team top prospects... you bet. I wouldn't ask less, would you?

 

 

This deal looks like the Red Sox salary dump --in reverse. Now why would the Red Sox take on all this salary again after just giving it up? From this standpoint, it makes sense for them to walk away. Buerhle and Reyes were overpaid--though they are a much better fit for Red Sox needs than Crawford or AdGon were at the time. And Josh Johnson would have a major impact on the pitching.

 

You're talking about a ton of money here-- a bad long term deal for Reyes. I can't see Henry wanting to do this deal. I don't think he's willing to get back to surtax territory in one swoop. Not with Red Sox profitability now an important factor for him. He's sitting pretty right now money-wise with the team, and he has seen how money doesn't necessarily buy you championships. It's chemistry and the pitching.

[bubbakeg52]

What do you think of trading both Salty and Lavarnway?

 

CF- Ellsbury

2b-Pedroia

C- Napoli 13

DH-Ortiz

1b-LaRoche 13

3b-Middlebrooks

RF-Swisher 15

LF-Ross

SS-Ciriaco

 

41 mil.

That looks good for the WC