Rays (Scholtens) vs Red Sox (Early): 5/8/26, 7:10pm

[FredLynn]

1 minute ago, Old Red said:

I told you they didn’t get it, and they still don’t. Bregman was plan A, and Alonso was the first choice to along with plan A. The Red Sox got neither, and went to cheaper options. It’s really not that difficult to understand?

Apparently it is for some here. Good thing there are astute fans like you and me here 😉

[notin]

12 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I told you they didn’t get it, and they still don’t. Bregman was plan A, and Alonso was the first choice to along with plan A. The Red Sox got neither, and went to cheaper options. It’s really not that difficult to understand?

“Plan A” just means what gets reported first.  No one on here knows all the orders of the conversations and back-and-forths.  I know you’ve tried to establish yourself as bring in the room where it happens, but the issue is you don’t really know how much you don’t really know…

[moonslav59]

I'd prefer Durbin, IKF & Monasterio over DHam, Drohan and maybe Harrison, but I do think we could have gotten Durbin or IKF plus Schwarber or Alonso and been much better.

I do notice you stopped saying Schwarber, Alonso, Breggie or Bichette.

I don't think the $6M spent on IKF prevented one of those signings, and I know you don't either. I'm not sure why you coach it that way.

You were fine with R Suarez, Contreras and Gray, but you wanted at least one more big bat. Some you listed (Schwarber & Alonso) are doing okay or well. Some are doing poorly to okay (Bregman) and some are off to horrible starts (Bichette and ESuarez.) Some of my suggested gets are doing poorly to okay, too.

[notin]

30 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I'd prefer Durbin, IKF & Monasterio over DHam, Drohan and maybe Harrison, but I do think we could have gotten Durbin or IKF plus Schwarber or Alonso and been much better.

I do notice you stopped saying Schwarber, Alonso, Breggie or Bichette.

I don't think the $6M spent on IKF prevented one of those signings, and I know you don't either. I'm not sure why you coach it that way.

You were fine with R Suarez, Contreras and Gray, but you wanted at least one more big bat. Some you listed (Schwarber & Alonso) are doing okay or well. Some are doing poorly to okay (Bregman) and some are off to horrible starts (Bichette and ESuarez.) Some of my suggested gets are doing poorly to okay, too.

This conversation has drifted too far.  The original point was the Sox could have added MULTIPLE elite hitters.  The counter was ALONSO AND BREGMAN ARE NOT ELITE HITTERS.  Just because they are better than 5 or 6 guys on the Sox does not make them elite hitters.  It doesn’t change whether or not they were Plan A or better than IKF.  Alonso and Bregman are above average hitters likely to become average hitters in the next couple of seasons.  I get the current lineup is frustrating.  These two (and Bichette) have been as well, not to mention in two or three years, the same people saying “release Yoshida and bring in someone better” will be spearheading the charge to “release Bregman and bring in someone better.”  And be calling Henry cheap because he isn’t willing to dump a player with $70million left on his deal.

Anyone bringing up IKF is a clear straw man.   And not even a good one.

Bringing Gasper into it caused my IQ to drop 30 points just reading the sentence.  My only hope is “maybe it’s a joke that isn’t funny.  Not every joke is funny.  It happens.”  Anyone seriously bringing up Gasper as the Sox substitute for Schwarber/Alonso should be slapped and sterilized.  We realize there’s no hope for you, but we also need to make sure it ends here.

The only “elite” options this past off-season were Tucker, who didn’t need to be the Sox radar.  And I can see an argument for Bichette.  Bo has struggled the last few seasons with injury, but he has shown himself to be a very good hitter and is the right age for a breakout.  But his recent health issues also make him a huge gamble.

Alonso and Bregman are the types of free agents best avoided.  I’m glad Boston did…

[Old Red]

1 hour ago, FredLynn said:

Apparently it is for some here. Good thing there are astute fans like you and me here 😉

Con Man was cheaper than Alonso. Ranger was cheaper than Bregman, and DUBin was just plain cheap. Some think plan A was just what was reported first. OMG, and Good Golly Miss Molly.🙈

[JoeBrady]

48 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I wanted Alosno, too, and I'd have been okay with Alonso & Contreras, booting Masa and trading an OF'er for a 2B/3Bman (good bat or not.)

I think what some fans don't differentiate is that all these moves are 'okay', but never, ever consider the long-term results.  It's entirely possible that Alonso will out-play Contreras this year.  But over two years, Alonso could even be ahead by 1-2 WAR, but then you are stuck with his salary for three more years.

[JoeBrady]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

It wasn't a signing, and certainly did not prevent another addition. We claimed him off waivers and pay him the minimum.

Every team adds players like this and hope they never need to call them up.

Casual fans don't understand AAA depth.

[Old Red]

1 minute ago, JoeBrady said:

I think what some fans don't differentiate is that all these moves are 'okay', but never, ever consider the long-term results.  It's entirely possible that Alonso will out-play Contreras this year.  But over two years, Alonso could even be ahead by 1-2 WAR, but then you are stuck with his salary for three more years.

I agree, and that’s why I said at the time when the Red Sox first signed Bregman that the money was too much, but the length of 3 years was just right. 5 years was to many for Bregman.

[JoeBrady]

1 hour ago, Old Red said:

Bregman was plan A, and Alonso was the first choice to along with plan A. The Red Sox got neither, and went to cheaper options.

I can't believe that people are still pining for Bregman.  For the price of Alonso & Bregman (1.6 bWAR), we got Contreras, Suarez & Durbin (2.8 bWAR).

[JoeBrady]

1 hour ago, notin said:

No one on here knows all the orders of the conversations and back-and-forths.

Fred & Red apparently have inside sources in the RS FO.

[JoeBrady]

5 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I agree, and that’s why I said at the time when the Red Sox first signed Bregman that the money was too much, but the length of 3 years was just right. 5 years was to many for Bregman.

So we made the right move not signing him?  And I assume everyone agrees that adding Contreras over Alonso was correct as well.

Is it that two rights make a wrong?

[JoeBrady]

35 minutes ago, notin said:

Bringing Gasper into it caused my IQ to drop 30 points just reading the sentence.

Fred thinks we signed Gaspar for minor league pay as some sort of equivalent to spending $42M on Bichette.  But even worse, he is the last person on the planet that still wants Bichette.

[Old Red]

23 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

So we made the right move not signing him?  And I assume everyone agrees that adding Contreras over Alonso was correct as well.

Is it that two rights make a wrong?

I already answered the Bregman question, and I said before the offseason started I would have signed Alonso, so no I don’t agree on Con Man. How it all works out time will tell.

[Old Red]

28 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

Fred & Red apparently have inside sources in the RS FO.

NO ONE had to have inside sources inside the RS FO to know that Bregman was Plan A, and if they did most of RSN knew it. Obviously some on here didn’t.🙈

[FredLynn]

46 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

I think what some fans don't differentiate is that all these moves are 'okay', but never, ever consider the long-term results.  It's entirely possible that Alonso will out-play Contreras this year.  But over two years, Alonso could even be ahead by 1-2 WAR, but then you are stuck with his salary for three more years.

This would have been a great year to go for gold. We have our ace. We have Ranger and other good SPing. We have a stud in Anthony though he’s off to a slow start. We have a great setup man and closer in the pen. Had Henry spent on the pen and obtained a couple of very good offensive players (they were available) we could have made a deep run in the playoffs. Instead he urinated away that chance by once again going cheap and signing bums and also-rans. You don’t waste opportunities like this when you have the basis for a very good team. Unless of course your priority is to make as much money as possible and screw the team and its fans.

[FredLynn]

1 hour ago, notin said:

This conversation has drifted too far.  The original point was the Sox could have added MULTIPLE elite hitters.  The counter was ALONSO AND BREGMAN ARE NOT ELITE HITTERS.  Just because they are better than 5 or 6 guys on the Sox does not make them elite hitters.  It doesn’t change whether or not they were Plan A or better than IKF.  Alonso and Bregman are above average hitters likely to become average hitters in the next couple of seasons.  I get the current lineup is frustrating.  These two (and Bichette) have been as well, not to mention in two or three years, the same people saying “release Yoshida and bring in someone better” will be spearheading the charge to “release Bregman and bring in someone better.”  And be calling Henry cheap because he isn’t willing to dump a player with $70million left on his deal.

Anyone bringing up IKF is a clear straw man.   And not even a good one.

Bringing Gasper into it caused my IQ to drop 30 points just reading the sentence.  My only hope is “maybe it’s a joke that isn’t funny.  Not every joke is funny.  It happens.”  Anyone seriously bringing up Gasper as the Sox substitute for Schwarber/Alonso should be slapped and sterilized.  We realize there’s no hope for you, but we also need to make sure it ends here.

The only “elite” options this past off-season were Tucker, who didn’t need to be the Sox radar.  And I can see an argument for Bichette.  Bo has struggled the last few seasons with injury, but he has shown himself to be a very good hitter and is the right age for a breakout.  But his recent health issues also make him a huge gamble.

Alonso and Bregman are the types of free agents best avoided.  I’m glad Boston did…

Nice rant. But it ignores the fact that bums like IKF, Gaspar, and Durbin are on the roster and more talented players like Schwarber, Alonso, and Bregman are not. BresLOW is incompetent. The end result is another last place team.

Enjoy it

[FredLynn]

27 minutes ago, Old Red said:

NO ONE had to have inside sources inside the RS FO to know that Bregman was Plan A, and if they did most of RSN knew it. Obviously some on here didn’t.🙈

Brady doesn’t read the Flops media articles. If he did he’d have to acknowledge that nearly every media outlet had Bregman as the number one target, whether you agree with that position or not.

[Old Red]

10 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Brady doesn’t read the Flops media articles. If he did he’d have to acknowledge that nearly every media outlet had Bregman as the number one target, whether you agree with that position or not.

I think he was taking the lead from others on here who just can’t comprehend THE POINT. They seem to point in another direction altogether.🤔

[Duran Is The Man]

10 hours ago, notin said:

Story has been a flop, with multiple injuries and by the time he got healthy, straight decline.

He’s not likely to be traded, and he probably won’t be DFAd/released.  If he keeps up the lackluster D with the replacement player offense, will Tracy ever bench him?  IKF at least brings the D.  Monasterio isn’t good at either but is probably better than Story right now.

But that’s sort of the main issue wuth free agency.   Teams spends tons of. O su for players over 30 that see the downside of their careers more easily derailed by injury but still tie up payroll that prevents subsequent improvements.  This happens all the time, yet fans still demand teams do it more often snd for longer contracts…

no doubt the big contracts rarely work out. i won't disagree. Ranger Suarez was over 30 when they signed him. do you think that was a mistake?

[JoeBrady]

2 hours ago, Old Red said:

I already answered the Bregman question, and I said before the offseason started I would have signed Alonso, so no I don’t agree on Con Man. How it all works out time will tell.

Just so I understand:

• Contreras currently > Alonso, but the jury is still out.  Fair enough.
• You agree we should not have signed Bregman.
• I assume that, no matter what your original opinion was (pro or con) you agree that we should not have signed Bichette (.571), Suarez (.663) or traded Tolle or Early ++ for Marte (.614)?

[JoeBrady]

59 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

no doubt the big contracts rarely work out. i won't disagree. Ranger Suarez was over 30 when they signed him. do you think that was a mistake?

Pitching doesn't age like hitting does.  It still ages, mostly hurt, but I think you'll have more successful 34+ pitchers than hitters.

[FredLynn]

4 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

Just so I understand:

• Contreras currently > Alonso, but the jury is still out.  Fair enough.
• You agree we should not have signed Bregman.
• I assume that, no matter what your original opinion was (pro or con) you agree that we should not have signed Bichette (.571), Suarez (.663) or traded Tolle or Early ++ for Marte (.614)?

The jury is still out on Bichette and E Suarez too. The season is early (but not too early to state that the Flops are already dead in the water)

[moonslav59]

5 hours ago, notin said:

This conversation has drifted too far.  The original point was the Sox could have added MULTIPLE elite hitters.  The counter was ALONSO AND BREGMAN ARE NOT ELITE HITTERS.  Just because they are better than 5 or 6 guys on the Sox does not make them elite hitters.  It doesn’t change whether or not they were Plan A or better than IKF.  Alonso and Bregman are above average hitters likely to become average hitters in the next couple of seasons.  I get the current lineup is frustrating.  These two (and Bichette) have been as well, not to mention in two or three years, the same people saying “release Yoshida and bring in someone better” will be spearheading the charge to “release Bregman and bring in someone better.”  And be calling Henry cheap because he isn’t willing to dump a player with $70million left on his deal.

Anyone bringing up IKF is a clear straw man.   And not even a good one.

Bringing Gasper into it caused my IQ to drop 30 points just reading the sentence.  My only hope is “maybe it’s a joke that isn’t funny.  Not every joke is funny.  It happens.”  Anyone seriously bringing up Gasper as the Sox substitute for Schwarber/Alonso should be slapped and sterilized.  We realize there’s no hope for you, but we also need to make sure it ends here.

The only “elite” options this past off-season were Tucker, who didn’t need to be the Sox radar.  And I can see an argument for Bichette.  Bo has struggled the last few seasons with injury, but he has shown himself to be a very good hitter and is the right age for a breakout.  But his recent health issues also make him a huge gamble.

Alonso and Bregman are the types of free agents best avoided.  I’m glad Boston did…

I totally agree, except I think Schwarber is elite, but was too old to give length.

[moonslav59]

5 hours ago, JoeBrady said:

Casual fans don't understand AAA depth.

They don't have to in order to know Gapser was not a major addition.

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, FredLynn said:

The jury is still out on Bichette and E Suarez too. The season is early (but not too early to state that the Flops are already dead in the water)

That pretty much shows the flaw in your thinking.

[FredLynn]

10 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

That pretty much shows the flaw in your thinking.

 

10 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

That pretty much shows the flaw in your thinking.

What “flaw” is that? Getting more talented players than the bums Henry got on the cheap is always a good idea if you want to be competitive.

[notin]

13 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

no doubt the big contracts rarely work out. i won't disagree. Ranger Suarez was over 30 when they signed him. do you think that was a mistake?

I hope not.  But do you think age 34-35 Suarez is going to pitch like he has so far? 

[moonslav59]

32 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

 

What “flaw” is that? Getting more talented players than the bums Henry got on the cheap is always a good idea if you want to be competitive.

No, that players we didn't get will regress to their mean, even though they are on the wrong side of prime, but our players will not, despite most being pre or in prime.

I'm sure you still expect Rafaela to crater, and that's just one example.

[FredLynn]

1 minute ago, moonslav59 said:

No, that players we didn't get will regress to their mean, even though they are on the wrong side of prime, but our players will not, despite most being pre or in prime.

I'm sure you still expect Rafaela to crater, and that's just one example.

I expect players like Schwarber, Bichette, and Alonso will come somewhere close to their career averages, especially their averages over the past three years or so. While I am pleased that Rafaela seems to have improved I am in a wait and see mode with him. I expect that as the season progresses he will lose the shine he has now. The trio of BUMS we signed instead of signing more expensive more talented players will continue to SUCK.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that line of thinking. It is totall rational.

[notin]

11 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

They don't have to in order to know Gapser was not a major addition.

It’s one thing to think a 1 year / $6mill contract was the option overs 5 year $150mill deal.  Most people get the team will have 4 bench players at some point.

But they also Ave roster spots 27-40 to fill on the 40-man.   While I’m not wild about Gasper, I do at least know he was an inconsequential waiver claim roster filler…