Do Not Trade The Big 3

[Bellhorn04]

Who are the Oakland Raiders?

 

That's what they were called when they mattered.

[notin]

That's what they were called when they mattered.

 

Back when they had evil in their hearts…

[Bellhorn04]

A couple things that probably should have been mentioned about Vlad Jr.:

 

Career vs. Yankees

83 GS .879 OPS 19 HR 63 RBI

 

Career at Fenway

40 GS 1.054 OPS 10 HR 41 RBI

[Dipre]

Cool. Still not worth what they will ask for him, as a bat-only player.

[notin]

A couple things that probably should have been mentioned about Vlad Jr.:

 

Career vs. Yankees

83 GS .879 OPS 19 HR 63 RBI

 

Career at Fenway

40 GS 1.054 OPS 10 HR 41 RBI

 

I don’t think the opportunity is going to present itself.

 

Toronto will likely try to get under the tax threshold, but they also might need a marketable player if they want to see some tickets at some point.

 

Plus Casas comes back soon…

[Bellhorn04]

I know. But you gotta like those numbers.

[notin]

I know. But you gotta like those numbers.

 

I don’t like those Fenway numbers. It turns out all of them took place against the Red Sox…

[Bellhorn04]

I don’t like those Fenway numbers. It turns out all of them took place against the Red Sox…

 

OK Mr. Groaner.

[moonslav59]

A couple things that probably should have been mentioned about Vlad Jr.:

 

Career vs. Yankees

83 GS .879 OPS 19 HR 63 RBI

 

Career at Fenway

40 GS 1.054 OPS 10 HR 41 RBI

 

So, what would his OPS be without facing Sox pitchers, anymore?

[Maxbialystock]

That's what they were called when they mattered.

 

The Oakland Athletics hearken back to the Philadelphia Athletics, owned and managed by Connie Mack. The Oakland Athletics won three straight WS, 1972-74, which only one other MLB team, the Yankees, have done.

 

The Oakland (now Las Vegas) Raiders began in the old AFL and were at their best under Coach John Madden, who led them to a bunch of conference championships in the 1970s and winning the Super Bowl in 1976.

[moonslav59]

I don’t think the opportunity is going to present itself.

 

Toronto will likely try to get under the tax threshold, but they also might need a marketable player if they want to see some tickets at some point.

 

Plus Casas comes back soon…

 

How Soon Is Now?

 

[Bellhorn04]

So, what would his OPS be without facing Sox pitchers, anymore?

 

Yeesh.

 

His numbers against the Yankees are pretty good, and they've had considerably better pitching than us during his career.

[Maxbialystock]

A couple things that probably should have been mentioned about Vlad Jr.:

 

Career vs. Yankees

83 GS .879 OPS 19 HR 63 RBI

 

Career at Fenway

40 GS 1.054 OPS 10 HR 41 RBI

 

Fool's gold, pure and simple. Vlad so far is a one season wonder--2021, age 21, when he hit 48 dingers and had an OPS of 1.002.

 

In his other 5 seasons, his OPS's have been .772, .791, .818, .788, and now .815, and his dingers have totaled 15, 9, 32, 26, and now 14.

 

In 2013 the Yankees signed Jacoby Ellsbury for 7 years and $153M, largely on the basis of one freaking season, 2011, when he had 32 dingers and an OPS of .928. He never had another season remotely as good before or after 2011.

 

I think Vlad's a lot better than Jacoby turned out to be, but I think he and his agent are expecting a long term contract based entirely on his 2021 season (48 dingers, 1.002 OPS). In addition, because I think Vlad could be a fan favorite in Toronto, I'm assuming he and his agent will use that fact to demand a big contract, which officially doesn't have to be offered until after the 2025 season, but will definitely come into play if Vlad is headed for the Sox.

 

Then there's the little matter of Vlad's weight, which is currently 245 lbs. Anyone here remember Sandoval? Anyone? The Sox swept in and took him away from the Giants and paid him $17M/year for doing basically nothing.

[moonslav59]

Yeesh.

 

His numbers against the Yankees are pretty good, and they've had considerably better pitching than us during his career.

 

My response was somewhat tongue in cheek, but other than Vladdy's one big season, he has been very good but not great. Take out 2021 and his numbers vs Sox pitching, and what is his OPS? Good but not great.

 

Of course, I'd prefer him over D Smith at 1B for 2024 (and maybe shared DH, with Casas when he returns) and Yoshida at DH in 2025, but that means eating Yoshi's contract- making Valddy very expensive.

[mvp 78]

I have 10/10 rights then.

 

I don't know. You've sat out a few seasons!

[mvp 78]

Talksox is like the Oakland Raiders of baseball forums. We're the last resort, baby!

 

No mess. Not fuss. Just pure impact.

[dgalehouse]

I am sure that the Sox have their own internal evaluations of their minor league prospects. Who would know them better than their minor league managers and coaches ? Some fans freaked out about some of the prospects that Dombrowski traded away. But apparently Sox management saw Devers as the real deal, while some of the other highly touted guys were seen as flawed and less likely to achieve stardom in MLB. Of course, you can always make a mistake. But you can't just say the so-called " Big 3" are untouchable. You have to trust your baseball people to be smart about it.

[mvp 78]

I am sure that the Sox have their own internal evaluations of their minor league prospects. Who would know them better than their minor league managers and coaches ? Some fans freaked out about some of the prospects that Dombrowski traded away. But apparently Sox management saw Devers as the real deal, while some of the other highly touted guys were seen as flawed and less likely to achieve stardom in MLB. Of course, you can always make a mistake. But you can't just say the so-called " Big 3" are untouchable. You have to trust your baseball people to be smart about it.

 

Yup, they'll probably come to the correct conclusion that Mayer can be moved. Not for a rental though!

[notin]

I am sure that the Sox have their own internal evaluations of their minor league prospects. Who would know them better than their minor league managers and coaches ? Some fans freaked out about some of the prospects that Dombrowski traded away. But apparently Sox management saw Devers as the real deal, while some of the other highly touted guys were seen as flawed and less likely to achieve stardom in MLB. Of course, you can always make a mistake. But you can't just say the so-called " Big 3" are untouchable. You have to trust your baseball people to be smart about it.

 

 

I would add that just because a prospect was traded away doesn’t mean he was viewed as flawed; it just means they wanted the player they were acquiring more. And sometimes a prospect is dealt because of a redundancy at his best position…

[vegasbob]

I don’t think the opportunity is going to present itself.

 

Toronto will likely try to get under the tax threshold, but they also might need a marketable player if they want to see some tickets at some point.

 

Plus Casas comes back soon…

 

I would be thrilled if Casas can come back sometime in early August and step back into his role as a starter. But , just a guess, I think it will take him a while ( 3-4 weeks) to get back to MLB speed. If so, the issue becomes, can Cora afford to keep a guy in the lineup who isn't yet productive over Dom Smith, who is on a run but can be inconsistent, .836 OPS last 15.

 

Same issue arises if and when Grissom ever returns. Personally, I would not play him over DHam or Romy . But probably won't need to worry much, since Vaughn may have to recover at Worcester for awhile.

[Hugh2]

I would add that just because a prospect was traded away doesn’t mean he was viewed as flawed; it just means they wanted the player they were acquiring more. And sometimes a prospect is dealt because of a redundancy at his best position…

 

Exactly, just because a team is trading away a guy doesn't mean they don't think highly of them. You have to give something to get something.

 

But it is also certainly true that every team has their own evaluation method and metrics and some teams are going to value guys in our system higher than we do (and lower).

[MADSTORK]

Noah Dean was drafted out of college and is working on his second straight full year in Salem. Must have a high ceiling!

 

For reference, Early and Mullins were drafted out of college last year and started at Greenville this year. Must not be as good as Dean though?

 

 

Lazy arse post

Do your homework

Better yet, stay off of Sox Prospects.com who has a 24 year old beer leaguer as the #8 prospect which is laughable

 

Dean LHP with a high K rate , walks have been cut in half since 23 , lefty specialist do not grow on trees, he should have been promoted by now

Jordan controls the zone low K rate , 40% of hits are for extra bases which shows gap power, contact hitter, you don’t trade those prospects

 

Far as Yorke the numbers speak for themselves

 

Facts are facts pink hats

[moonslav59]

Lazy arse post

Do your homework

Better yet, stay off of Sox Prospects.com who has a 24 year old beer leaguer as the #8 prospect which is laughable

 

Dean LHP with a high K rate , walks have been cut in half since 23 , lefty specialist do not grow on trees, he should have been promoted by now

Jordan controls the zone low K rate , 40% of hits are for extra bases which shows gap power, contact hitter, you don’t trade those prospects

 

Far as Yorke the numbers speak for themselves

 

Facts are facts pink hats

 

Noah Dean; LMAO!!!

[moonslav59]

Lazy arse post

Do your homework

Better yet, stay off of Sox Prospects.com who has a 24 year old beer leaguer as the #8 prospect which is laughable

 

Dean LHP with a high K rate , walks have been cut in half since 23 , lefty specialist do not grow on trees, he should have been promoted by now

Jordan controls the zone low K rate , 40% of hits are for extra bases which shows gap power, contact hitter, you don’t trade those prospects

 

Far as Yorke the numbers speak for themselves

 

Facts are facts pink hats

 

Forget soxprospects.com. there are at least 10 pitchers in our system more promising than Dean.

[notin]

Forget soxprospects.com. there are at least 10 pitchers in our system more promising than Dean.

 

According to soxpropects.com, the Sox have 22 pitchers more promising than Noah Dean.

 

Granted, that means counting MLB vet Bailey Horn and IL Resident Bryan Mata…

[moonslav59]

According to soxpropects.com, the Sox have 22 pitchers more promising than Noah Dean.

 

Granted, that means counting MLB vet Bailey Horn and IL Resident Bryan Mata…

 

I was trying to conservative, and I do think Dean passes some in the next rankings.

 

He is 14th in IP on the Sox farm and only Wehunt has more IP and a better OPSA than Dean's .541. His 4.08 ERA would be better if he didn't walk 29 batters in 57 IP. Only 27 hits allowed is rather astounding.

 

My pitcher rankings might be:

1. Perales

2. Fitts

3. Sandlin

4. E R-C

5. Dobbins

6. Early

7. Mullins

8. Monegro

9. Portes

10. Bastardo

 

Close calls to Dean: Penrod, Wikelman, Wehunt, Gambrell, Reyes, Horn, Mata, Paez

 

[moonslav59]

According to soxpropects.com, the Sox have 22 pitchers more promising than Noah Dean.

 

Granted, that means counting MLB vet Bailey Horn and IL Resident Bryan Mata…

 

Dean has the second best OPSA out of our top 37 pitchers in IP for 2024.

[Tedballgame]

I am sure that the Sox have their own internal evaluations of their minor league prospects. Who would know them better than their minor league managers and coaches ? Some fans freaked out about some of the prospects that Dombrowski traded away. But apparently Sox management saw Devers as the real deal, while some of the other highly touted guys were seen as flawed and less likely to achieve stardom in MLB. Of course, you can always make a mistake. But you can't just say the so-called " Big 3" are untouchable. You have to trust your baseball people to be smart about it.

 

The baseball people haven’t gotten much right since 2018.

[Hugh2]

Lazy arse post

Do your homework

Better yet, stay off of Sox Prospects.com who has a 24 year old beer leaguer as the #8 prospect which is laughable

 

Dean LHP with a high K rate , walks have been cut in half since 23 , lefty specialist do not grow on trees, he should have been promoted by now

Jordan controls the zone low K rate , 40% of hits are for extra bases which shows gap power, contact hitter, you don’t trade those prospects

 

Far as Yorke the numbers speak for themselves

 

Facts are facts pink hats

 

He’s 23 mowing down low a batters. Good college players go to high a nowadays.

 

Dean might become a big leaguer one day, but calling him good because of his stats vs kids in low A is like calling me the next Pedro Martinez because I’m striking out 100% of t ballers.

 

And Yorke? I like Yorke, I’m hoping he can become an everyday player but you’re not selling me on a guy who had one good month after TWO WHOLE YEARS of sub par to crappy play. You don’t start baking that guy into your future plans just yet. Especially because his defense isn’t great.

[dgalehouse]

The baseball people haven’t gotten much right since 2018.

 

Yes. That is why Bloom is out and Breslow is in. We have to give him a chance.