Red Sox Sign Masataka Yoshida

[mvp 78]

If the Red Sox were a well oiled smooth running organization the nits would be few, and far between, but we know that’s not the case.

 

There are important things to care about, Yoshida's contract and what he said at the press conference is very low on the list. To me, he's part of the solution, not the problem.

[Old Red]

There are important things to care about, Yoshida's contract and what he said at the press conference is very low on the list. To me, he's part of the solution, not the problem.

 

For all the talk I hear about payroll on here I would think any contract, and the amount of money that contract is would be important.

[Bellhorn04]

For all the talk I hear about payroll on here I would think any contract, and the amount of money that contract is would be important.

 

In this case we're not going to know until we see the guy play.

[Hugh2]

For all the talk I hear about payroll on here I would think any contract, and the amount of money that contract is would be important.

 

It could break both ways with this. If Yoshida is a bust it's a big waste of money. If Yoshida's skills transfer over as some guys do then he's a steal. If a 28-year-old outfielder hit free agency in the MLB and was sporting a .326/.419/.538 slash line he'd be getting 300 million right now in this market. If the deal works out, it could look like a great use of resources to exploit a market inefficiency.

 

It all comes down to the Sox scouting department. They are confident his skills will transfer over. As we've seen before, sometimes they don't.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

There are important things to care about, Yoshida's contract and what he said at the press conference is very low on the list. To me, he's part of the solution, not the problem.

 

Some fans are so frustrated with Bloom that they hammer every move he makes at this point. I like the Yoshida signing, period, and could care less about how much he costs (as if there is such a concept as overpay anymore).

 

Some posters also like to point out that many big money free agents are busts, but for half of those on list, it still looks like you get what you pay for.

 

A few good new players can improve a team more than several mediocre pieces.

 

Bloom just tries too hard to fill many of the holes in his swiss cheese with a can of cheez whiz. Too much of that crap is unhealthy. It's the holidays -- give me a wedge of imported gouda.

[mvp 78]

For all the talk I hear about payroll on here I would think any contract, and the amount of money that contract is would be important.

 

If that were really the case to you, why aren't you also complaining about the Chris Martin contract?

 

The Sox still have money left to spend. They just aren't spending it. The issue isn't Yoshida, it's Sox ownership not spending what it can.

[mvp 78]

Some fans are so frustrated with Bloom that they hammer every move he makes at this point. I like the Yoshida signing, period, and could care less about how much he costs (as if there is such a concept as overpay anymore).

 

Some posters also like to point out that many big money free agents are busts, but for half of those on list, it still looks like you get what you pay for.

 

A few good new players can improve a team more than several mediocre pieces.

 

Bloom just tries too hard to fill many of the holes in his swiss cheese with a can of cheez whiz. Too much of that crap is unhealthy. It's the holidays -- give me a wedge of imported gouda.

 

I've also started to see the narrative switch to be: rival gm's all said they would only pay Yoshida 50% of what he got, but the initial story didn't quote gm's, just international scouts which aren't hired to manage payroll. I think that difference is important.

[moonslav59]

If that were really the case to you, why aren't you also complaining about the Chris Martin contract?

 

The Sox still have money left to spend. They just aren't spending it. The issue isn't Yoshida, it's Sox ownership not spending what it can.

 

We all assumed when they said they'd "get better," it meant they'd spend up to the $80M line.

 

I don't think it's Bloom choosing to not spend the remaining $40M. Maybe we trade for a big contract like A Garcia to get Lopeze without parting with a top 5 or 6 prospects, and then we'd still have enough for Kluber, but who knows, at this point.

[moonslav59]

I've also started to see the narrative switch to be: rival gm's all said they would only pay Yoshida 50% of what he got, but the initial story didn't quote gm's, just international scouts which aren't hired to manage payroll. I think that difference is important.

 

Good point, and any scout that was estimating salary worth might have been going off the 2022 market prices- not this latest explosive one.

[mvp 78]

We all assumed when they said they'd "get better," it meant they'd spend up to the $80M line.

 

I don't think it's Bloom choosing to not spend the remaining $40M. Maybe we trade for a big contract like A Garcia to get Lopeze without parting with a top 5 or 6 prospects, and then we'd still have enough for Kluber, but who knows, at this point.

 

Houck and Yorke for Berti, Lopez and Garcia is an overpay by the Sox, but it makes more sense than dealing Mayer in a trade for Lopez.

 

Per BTV:

 

Lopez 38.7 MTV

Mayer 55.4 MTV

[moonslav59]

Houck and Yorke for Berti, Lopez and Garcia is an overpay by the Sox, but it makes more sense than dealing Mayer in a trade for Lopez.

 

Per BTV:

 

Lopez 38.7 MTV

Mayer 55.4 MTV

 

I'm not for trading Mayer. I just gave him as an example to counter the statement made about Sale and it's always okay to trade prospects for an ace. Change Lopez to a true ace and my point looks better, but I'm still not for doing it, now that we have no SS.

[moonslav59]

Houck and Yorke for Berti, Lopez and Garcia is an overpay by the Sox, but it makes more sense than dealing Mayer in a trade for Lopez.

 

Per BTV:

 

Lopez 38.7 MTV

Mayer 55.4 MTV

 

I would not trade Mayer for Lopez and Berti and probably not even Lopez, berti and Cabrera. I'd want to know more about Cabrera's projected value.

 

I would trade Houck and Yorke for Lopez, Berti (RF/2B) and A Garcia (RF/DH). Then, we sign Kluber and we'd look good. Extend Devers and I walk away from this winter with a slight smile on my face, which might be confused with a smirk.

[mvp 78]

@jcmccaffrey

One Red Sox scout on the ground in Japan felt that Yoshida was the “the best pure hitter he’d seen since Ichiro (Suzuki).”

[moonslav59]

@jcmccaffrey

One Red Sox scout on the ground in Japan felt that Yoshida was the “the best pure hitter he’d seen since Ichiro (Suzuki).”

 

Hard to argue.

 

How he translates is the great unknown.

 

Then again, how well does Boget, Rodon and deGrom do? What happens, if Bogey pouts when asked to move off SS sooner than he wants?

 

Everyone has some sort of risk when signed long term.

[mvp 78]

Hard to argue.

 

How he translates is the great unknown.

 

Then again, how well does Boget, Rodon and deGrom do? What happens, if Bogey pouts when asked to move off SS sooner than he wants?

 

Everyone has some sort of risk when signed long term.

 

And if Bogey's defense slides back and his power doesn't return, that WAR calculation is going to look worse.

[Old Red]

If that were really the case to you, why aren't you also complaining about the Chris Martin contract?

 

The Sox still have money left to spend. They just aren't spending it. The issue isn't Yoshida, it's Sox ownership not spending what it can.

 

I thought the Martin signing, and the Jansen signing were good signings. Maybe a year to late, but still a good signing. They did not cost $100M+ either. My opinion is just that they have overpaid for someone unproven in ML baseball. It’s just my opinion popular, or not on here.

[mvp 78]

I thought the Martin signing, and the Jansen signing were good signings. Maybe a year to late, but still a good signing. They did not cost $100M+ either. My opinion is just that they have overpaid for someone unproven in ML baseball. It’s just my opinion popular, or not on here.

 

I'm not sure why the total $ amount matters, since the AAV of $18M is more important for payroll purposes. That's not a contract that is overly burdensome IMO. He just replaces what JD was paid.

[Old Red]

I'm not sure why the total $ amount matters, since the AAV of $18M is more important for payroll purposes. That's not a contract that is overly burdensome IMO. He just replaces what JD was paid.

 

It’s just my opinion, so I don’t see why it should cause such a stir. I get everything point you are making, but I would have rather spent the money on Senga if the Red Sox were going to chance on someone, which to me would have been a bigger need.

[moonslav59]

It’s just my opinion, so I don’t see why it should cause such a stir. I get everything point you are making, but I would have rather spent the money on Senga if the Red Sox were going to chance on someone, which to me would have been a bigger need.

 

I think the "stir" was more about the point about some scouts thinking we grossly overpaid- not that you think we might have. I think you also said you were okay with the signing, so it seems like we all have mixed feeling about the addition.

 

The thing that bothers me the most, and I'm not losing a wink of sleep over it, was that we spent such a big percent of our winter spending budget on LF/DH. I've already been a crybaby on us hording LF'ers and DH was like 7th or 8th on my high need area Christmas list.

 

I, too, am glad we finally spent on the pen, and enough to safely move Whitlock to the rotation without making the pen a net negative, on paper.

 

I still hope we add more than just Whitlock to a rotation now missing Nate, Wacha and Hill (69 starts in 2022 combined,) but if Whitlock can add 20 GS'd to his 2022 total of 9, we only need 2 more SP'er not 3. Maybe Bello and Houck can take up some of that slack, but taking Whitlock and Houck from the pen, makes that now near a push, which is not good. It comes down to Sale and Paxton or some surprise from Mata/Walter/Murphy/Crawford/Wink/Seabold, and I'm not thrilled about even the combined chances of all of them togther.

[Old Red]

I think the "stir" was more about the point about some scouts thinking we grossly overpaid- not that you think we might have. I think you also said you were okay with the signing, so it seems like we all have mixed feeling about the addition.

 

The thing that bothers me the most, and I'm not losing a wink of sleep over it, was that we spent such a big percent of our winter spending budget on LF/DH. I've already been a crybaby on us hording LF'ers and DH was like 7th or 8th on my high need area Christmas list.

 

I, too, am glad we finally spent on the pen, and enough to safely move Whitlock to the rotation without making the pen a net negative, on paper.

 

I still hope we add more than just Whitlock to a rotation now missing Nate, Wacha and Hill (69 starts in 2022 combined,) but if Whitlock can add 20 GS'd to his 2022 total of 9, we only need 2 more SP'er not 3. Maybe Bello and Houck can take up some of that slack, but taking Whitlock and Houck from the pen, makes that now near a push, which is not good. It comes down to Sale and Paxton or some surprise from Mata/Walter/Murphy/Crawford/Wink/Seabold, and I'm not thrilled about even the combined chances of all of them togther.

 

You would rather have Yoshida over Senga?

[moonslav59]

You would rather have Yoshida over Senga?

 

No, and not so much because I have more faith in Senga over Yoshida, but because SP was near the top of my list of high need areas- LF/DH was like 7th or 8th.

 

I think we could have done both, but I'd still like getting a SP + SS or RF'er better than a SP and LF/DH.

 

That being said, I think the Yoshida signing will be a good one, but maybe my glasses are too pink.

[Old Red]

No, and not so much because I have more faith in Senga over Yoshida, but because SP was near the top of my list of high need areas- LF/DH was like 7th or 8th.

 

Well I guess we agree on this, because I would have rather the Red Sox went after Senga first.

[mvp 78]

No, and not so much because I have more faith in Senga over Yoshida, but because SP was near the top of my list of high need areas- LF/DH was like 7th or 8th.

 

I think we could have done both, but I'd still like getting a SP + SS or RF'er better than a SP and LF/DH.

 

That being said, I think the Yoshida signing will be a good one, but maybe my glasses are too pink.

 

What if Senga could have filled the hole, but Yoshida was just the better value signing? Senga is coming with some control issues from what I've heard. It's interesting that people aren't raising red flags about what Senga's contract looks like.

[Old Red]

What if Senga could have filled the hole, but Yoshida was just the better value signing? Senga is coming with some control issues from what I've heard. It's interesting that people aren't raising red flags about what Senga's contract looks like.

 

Wouldn’t you try to fill the hole first? Both contracts you are taking a chance on. If the Red Sox had signed Senga I would have said the same thing, but the Mets signed him, and money is no object to them. With the Red Sox it’s a different story is it not?

[moonslav59]

What if Senga could have filled the hole, but Yoshida was just the better value signing? Senga is coming with some control issues from what I've heard. It's interesting that people aren't raising red flags about what Senga's contract looks like.

 

Same red flags- maybe more on Senga. I already explained why I'd prefer Senga- knowing full well, I could be wrong.

 

We needed pitching not LF and barely needed a DH. That is my main reason.

[moonslav59]

Well I guess we agree on this, because I would have rather the Red Sox went after Senga first.

 

I've thought all along, this wasn't the FA class to spend big on a FA starter. I've thought the best route was to trade for one, but what to trade?

 

I guess loading up the pen, so Whitlock and Houck can start may be a better risk than signing Senga or the likes of Kluber or Nate, but I had hopes for a better staff by opening day. Those hopes are fading, daily.

[mvp 78]

Wouldn’t you try to fill the hole first? Both contracts you are taking a chance on. If the Red Sox had signed Senga I would have said the same thing, but the Mets signed him, and money is no object to them. With the Red Sox it’s a different story is it not?

 

Sox needed help all over the place. It's foolish to just go for one specific position and put all your focus there. Yes, they should have signed a SP. Maybe they still will? However, signing Yoshida doesn't prevent them from signing a 2b/SS or SP. Other teams were able to sign multiple players. The Sox already signed 4 FA's. It's not like they are empty handed. They just need to keep going.

[Old Red]

Sox needed help all over the place. It's foolish to just go for one specific position and put all your focus there. Yes, they should have signed a SP. Maybe they still will? However, signing Yoshida doesn't prevent them from signing a 2b/SS or SP. Other teams were able to sign multiple players. The Sox already signed 4 FA's. It's not like they are empty handed. They just need to keep going.

I don’t believe it is ever foolish to go for pitching. You never have to much, and most times don’t have enough.Yoshida would have filled a bigger need if he was a RF with some power. I think Story is the SS, and then it becomes a question if you want to go with Kike, or Arroyo at 2B. Even then more parts are needed.

[moonslav59]

Sox needed help all over the place. It's foolish to just go for one specific position and put all your focus there. Yes, they should have signed a SP. Maybe they still will? However, signing Yoshida doesn't prevent them from signing a 2b/SS or SP. Other teams were able to sign multiple players. The Sox already signed 4 FA's. It's not like they are empty handed. They just need to keep going.

 

Yes, we needed 7 slots more than LF/DH and only so much to spend. it's not foolish to not like the fact we spent $18M of the $80M on our 7th or 8th highest need.

 

I never said "one specific position over LF/DH."

 

Yes, we filled 2 of the top 7 slots with Jansen & Martin, so we had 4-5 higher needs than LF/DH when we signed Yoshida (SS, SP 1/2, RF, SP3/4 and maybe C.)

 

Fine to disagree, but I hardly think it's foolish to focus on your highest needs to spend the most resources on.

[mvp 78]

I don’t believe it is ever foolish to go for pitching. You never have to much, and most times don’t have enough.Yoshida would have filled a bigger need if he was a RF with some power. I think Story is the SS, and then it becomes a question if you want to go with Kike, or Arroyo at 2B. Even then more parts are needed.

 

But to go large and long for an untested guy like Senga may not be the best bet. I think the Sox should do a short term deal with Kluber and trade for a front of the rotation starter. Not sure what better options there were this offseason.