Fire Bloom .

[Larry Cook]

This offseason, Hang’em Chaim has payroll flexibility he never had previously.

He has a fairly well stocked minor league system as trade chips.

He has a plethora of quad “a” guys to trade.

 

He has serious needs;

1.) sign Correa (Cora’s buddy) and let bogey fly.

2.) sign at least two or three quality starters. Thor, wacha and hill?

3.) trade for a right fielder with power.

4.) get a closer for the bullpen and sign a couple scheibner type guys.

 

This is the offseason, that Hang’em Chaim gets thrown into the deep end of the pool, if he does not come out the deep end in a yacht, it might be time for him to go back to Tampa.

[dgalehouse]

Anyone who has been watching baseball should understand just how vital the bullpen is in the game today. The Sox still have a high payroll . There is no excuse for them having one of the worst bullpens in MLB. That has to change if the Sox hope to contend in 2023.

[moonslav59]

Most of us agree the 2020 season was lost from the start, and the Betts trade was forced on Bloom. One can argue about my choice of starting points, but to me the massive budget cuts after 2019 should not be counted against Bloom's winter signings, that year. I'm starting from the 2020 deadline:

 

Major Moves (may not have seemed major, at the time):

Cordero, Winckowski, L de la Rosa, F Valdez & G Gambrell for Beni

Renfroe signed for $3.1M/1 (2 arbs left)

Kike signed for $14M/2

Richards signed for $10M/1

Barnes extended for $18.8M/2

Whitlock drafted Rule 5 and extended $18.8M/4

Schreiber selected off waivers

JBJ, Bineles & Hamilton for Renfroe

Paxton signed for $10M/1 w option

Wacha signed for $7M

Story signed for $140M/6

 

Moderate Moves:

Pivetta & Seabold for Workman & Hembree

Arroyo acquired off waivers

R Hernandez for Springs & Mazza

Marwin Gonzalez signed for $3M/1

Ottavino & German acquired in trade.

M Perez signed for $5M/1

Rich Hill signed for $5M/1

Diekman signed for $8M/2

McGuire for Diekman

Strahm signed for $3M/1

Refsnyder signed as minor league FA

Hosmer + cash, Ferguson & Rosier for Groome

E Valdez & W Abreu for Vazquez

 

Minor Moves that are noteworthy:

Moreland for J Rosario & H Potts

Pillar for J Wallace

Sawamura signed $3M/2

Andriese signed for $2.1M/1

Robles for Alex Scherff (signed for $2.3M/1)

Austin Davis for Chavis (signed for $720K)

Y Rios acquired for cash

K Ort Minor League Rule 5 draftee

T Pham for Northcut

Z Kelly signed as minor league FA

Danish signed as minor league FA

[moonslav59]

This offseason, Hang’em Chaim has payroll flexibility he never had previously.

He has a fairly well stocked minor league system as trade chips.

He has a plethora of quad “a” guys to trade.

 

This is the offseason, that Hang’em Chaim gets thrown into the deep end of the pool, if he does not come out the deep end in a yacht, it might be time for him to go back to Tampa.

 

Bloom may or may not have a directive on trading away top prospects, this winter.

 

My guess is, there might be an organizational guideline that may allow for one moderate to major prospects trade, but only if the player we get back has 3+ years of team control. Totally, speculation, on my part. I think the longer term outlook is still the main priority, but the here and now priority is gaining ground and may pass the future outlook, soon.

[notin]

Bloom may or may not have a directive on trading away top prospects, this winter.

 

My guess is, there might be an organizational guideline that may allow for one moderate to major prospects trade, but only if the player we get back has 3+ years of team control. Totally, speculation, on my part. I think the longer term outlook is still the main priority, but the here and now priority is gaining ground and may pass the future outlook, soon.

 

Bloom might trade Verdugo.

 

We all assumed Benintendi would be playing LF in 2021, but with 2 years of control left, Benintendi was traded.

 

We all assumed Renfroe would be in RF for 2022, but with 2 arbitration years left, Renfroe was traded.

 

We all assume Verdugo will be in LF or RF for 2023. Not sure which but definitely one of them.

 

But Verdugo has two arb years left…

[moonslav59]

Bloom might trade Verdugo.

 

We all assumed Benintendi would be playing LF in 2021, but with 2 years of control left, Benintendi was traded.

 

We all assumed Renfroe would be in RF for 2022, but with 2 arbitration years left, Renfroe was traded.

 

We all assume Verdugo will be in LF or RF for 2023. Not sure which but definitely one of them.

 

But Verdugo has two arb years left…

 

We certainly may see a surprise like that. With OF being a high need area, I'm not so sure about this time, though.

 

If they think someone like EValdez can play LF, or Rafaela will be ML ready sooner than we think, maybe.

 

BTV has Verdugo worth 2.6- the same as Bonaci and close to RHern and McDonough. (I think he's worth more than that, but maybe they expect him to get hefty arb raises.)

[Old Red]

Anyone who has been watching baseball should understand just how vital the bullpen is in the game today. The Sox still have a high payroll . There is no excuse for them having one of the worst bullpens in MLB. That has to change if the Sox hope to contend in 2023.

 

Not only is a good bullpen a must, but having a good reliable closer also. This was a major failure of a bad failed plan by Bloom, and Cora that started the 2022 season down a losing path.

[Bellhorn04]

The bottom line is you need a lot of freaking pitching to succeed. You need at least 3 good starters and probably 5 good relievers now.

[notin]

Not only is a good bullpen a must, but having a good reliable closer also. This was a major failure of a bad failed plan by Bloom, and Cora that started the 2022 season down a losing path.

 

That bullpen flopped but it’sa safe bet they know who the closer is, assuming he’s healthy. They have Houck the chance and he didn’t do anything to lose it except need back surgery.

 

Of course that might be enough to lose it. But that’s nothing anyone knows right now…

[Bellhorn04]

One thing about Dave Dombrowski is that he doesn't mind making moves that are obvious. He doesn't care all that much about being creative. He goes for the prime cuts like Price, Kimbrel, Sale, JDM, Eovaldi. The one time he got a little creative was with the trades for Thornburg and Smith, which sadly didn't work out at all.

[moonslav59]

The bottom line is you need a lot of freaking pitching to succeed. You need at least 3 good starters and probably 5 good relievers now.

 

Agreed. Minimum and healthy.

 

Assuming 100% health in 2022, we might have had 9:

 

Sale

Eovaldi

Wacha

Pivetta

Hill/Paxton combined

 

Whitlock

Houck

Schreiber (was supposed to be Taylor)

Barnes

[Bellhorn04]

This offseason, Hang’em Chaim has payroll flexibility he never had previously.

He has a fairly well stocked minor league system as trade chips.

He has a plethora of quad “a” guys to trade.

 

He has serious needs;

1.) sign Correa (Cora’s buddy) and let bogey fly.

2.) sign at least two or three quality starters. Thor, wacha and hill?

3.) trade for a right fielder with power.

4.) get a closer for the bullpen and sign a couple scheibner type guys.

 

This is the offseason, that Hang’em Chaim gets thrown into the deep end of the pool, if he does not come out the deep end in a yacht, it might be time for him to go back to Tampa.

 

Nicely put, Larry.

[Old Red]

That bullpen flopped but it’sa safe bet they know who the closer is, assuming he’s healthy. They have Houck the chance and he didn’t do anything to lose it except need back surgery.

 

Of course that might be enough to lose it. But that’s nothing anyone knows right now…

 

I don’t believe there is any kind of bet especially a safe one that they know who the closer is going to be, and if it was me it would be someone not on the roster at the moment. You may like Houck as the closer, but that is not something I would do.

[notin]

I don’t believe there is any kind of bet especially a safe one that they know who the closer is going to be, and if it was me it would be someone not on the roster at the moment. You may like Houck as the closer, but that is not something I would do.

 

Here is the thing. It doesn’t matter what you or I would do, or if you or I like or don’t like Houck in that role. Somebody in the Sox organization does. They gave him a chance. He really did nothing to ruin it. Safe bet that if he’s healthy, it’s his job to lose.

 

No prediction on if he loses it…

[Old Red]

Here is the thing. It doesn’t matter what you or I would do, or if you or I like or don’t like Houck in that role. Somebody in the Sox organization does. They gave him a chance. He really did nothing to ruin it. Safe bet that if he’s healthy, it’s his job to lose.

 

No prediction on if he loses it…

 

He was kind of a last option, and he is no Koji who was a pretty much the same. Like I said it may be a safe bet to you, but not to me. Time will tell on who’s going to be right.

[moonslav59]

Here is the thing. It doesn’t matter what you or I would do, or if you or I like or don’t like Houck in that role. Somebody in the Sox organization does. They gave him a chance. He really did nothing to ruin it. Safe bet that if he’s healthy, it’s his job to lose.

 

No prediction on if he loses it…

 

My guess is they go with Houck as the opening day closer, agreed, assuming healthy.

 

They will likely put Whitlock in the rotation, so they can not have to spend big on 2 SP'ers, either in money or by trade capital.

 

SP1 _____

SP2 Sale

SP3 Whitlock

SP4 Pivetta

SP5 Bello

SP6 Crawford, Winckowski, Mata, Walter, Seabold, TWard, Murphy

 

Closer Houck

RP2 _____

RP3 _____

RP4 Schreiber

RP5 Barnes

RP6 Kelly

RP7 (SP6) Taylor, Brasier, Danish, McGee, Reed, German, Ort

 

I'd like to see us add 4 solid pitchers, but my guess is we go with 3. If it means 3 much better pitchers than the 4 they might have added, I'd be fine with that.

 

I hope we trade for a #1/2 SP'er and try to hard sign Montero and Fulmer or someone just as promising.

 

Trading for a SP'er would also leave enough money to fill the SS and RF holes to the point of an overall, combined projected improvement.

 

We may stick with what we have at C (McGuire), 1B (Casas) and DH (Hosmer/Dalbec).

 

The bench would be Wong, Arroyo, Refsnyder and Dalbec/Hosmer (whichever is not DHing.)

[moonslav59]

He was kind of a last option, and he is no Koji who was a pretty much the same. Like I said it may be a safe bet to you, but not to me. Time will tell on who’s going to be right.

 

I think he means a safe bet he is slotted as our closer- not that it's safe he will do well.

[Old Red]

I think he means a safe bet he is slotted as our closer- not that it's safe he will do well.

 

I knew what he meant, and I know what I meant, and after all that I don’t agree. Like I also said we’ll find out who’s right.

Edited October 27, 2022 by Old Red

[moonslav59]

I knew what he meant, and I know what I meant, and after all that I don’t agree. Like I also said we’ll find out who’s right.

 

He responded to your "safe bet" statement, I don’t believe there is any kind of bet especially a safe one that they know who the closer is going to be,... By adding... No prediction on if he loses it…, which clearly in dicates he does not know if Houck is a safe bet to be good, only a safe bet to be the closer when the season starts, but of course, you have your alternative meanings for words shared by none.

[Bellhorn04]

He responded to your "safe bet" statement, I don’t believe there is any kind of bet especially a safe one that they know who the closer is going to be,... By adding... No prediction on if he loses it…, which clearly in dicates he does not know if Houck is a safe bet to be good, only a safe bet to be the closer when the season starts, but of course, you have your alternative meanings for words shared by none.

 

I think Old Red is saying it's not a safe bet the Sox don't sign a closer type like Robertson or whoever and leave Houck as one of the late inning options.

 

It's not like Houck nailed down the closer job going forward based on 2022.

 

Let's face it, there are many ways they could go. We are surely all hoping they acquire some relievers.

[notin]

I think Old Red is saying it's not a safe bet the Sox don't sign a closer type like Robertson or whoever and leave Houck as one of the late inning options.

 

It's not like Houck nailed down the closer job going forward based on 2022.

 

Let's face it, there are many ways they could go. We are surely all hoping they acquire some relievers.

 

I hope they sign a few capable arms. I’ve been recommending Fulmer and Montero for weeks (not sure to who).

[Old Red]

I think Old Red is saying it's not a safe bet the Sox don't sign a closer type like Robertson or whoever and leave Houck as one of the late inning options.

 

It's not like Houck nailed down the closer job going forward based on 2022.

 

Let's face it, there are many ways they could go. We are surely all hoping they acquire some relievers.

 

Well said. Houck Has NOt Nailed down anything.

[Old Red]

He responded to your "safe bet" statement, I don’t believe there is any kind of bet especially a safe one that they know who the closer is going to be,... By adding... No prediction on if he loses it…, which clearly in dicates he does not know if Houck is a safe bet to be good, only a safe bet to be the closer when the season starts, but of course, you have your alternative meanings for words shared by none.

 

Are you his spokesman? As usual you’ve added nothing to conversation that you wasn’t involved in even though you think you have. A gift that you think that you have it is not. Especially when you pull back the curtain.

[Old Red]

Moon and Notin are not the same poster. They are more like a tag team. " The Legion of Bloom ", heel tag team champions.

 

Heel tag team, but definitely not champions.

[moonslav59]

Are you his spokesman? As usual you’ve added nothing to conversation that you wasn’t involved in even though you think you have. A gift that you think that you have it is not. Especially when you pull back the curtain.

 

I didn't realize this site was for exclusive one on one conversations, and nobody ever chimes in with their 2 cents. Once again, I apologize for going against your rules of engagement.

 

Notin clearly stated it was not a "sure bet" Houck would be or would not be a successful closer by saying "nor prediction on if he loses it." You are free to have wrong interpretations, but expect to be called out on them.

 

[moonslav59]

I think Old Red is saying it's not a safe bet the Sox don't sign a closer type like Robertson or whoever and leave Houck as one of the late inning options.

 

It's not like Houck nailed down the closer job going forward based on 2022.

 

Let's face it, there are many ways they could go. We are surely all hoping they acquire some relievers.

 

I know what Red is saying. I know what notin is saying.

 

I actually disagree with notin that the closer role is a "sure bet" to be Houck's on opening day. I was just correcting what I feel was Red's misinterpretation of notin's statement.

[moonslav59]

Heel tag team, but definitely not champions.

 

I don't even agree with notin's position. I was just explaining it to you.

 

Man, you have serious comprehension issues.

[Old Red]

I don't even agree with notin's position. I was just explaining it to you.

 

Man, you have serious comprehension issues.

 

I already knew Notin’s position, and it didn’t need any explaining from you. Comprehension issues? What part of that don’t you understand?

[mvp 78]

This offseason, Hang’em Chaim has payroll flexibility he never had previously.

He has a fairly well stocked minor league system as trade chips.

He has a plethora of quad “a” guys to trade.

 

He has serious needs;

1.) sign Correa (Cora’s buddy) and let bogey fly.

2.) sign at least two or three quality starters. Thor, wacha and hill?

3.) trade for a right fielder with power.

4.) get a closer for the bullpen and sign a couple scheibner type guys.

 

This is the offseason, that Hang’em Chaim gets thrown into the deep end of the pool, if he does not come out the deep end in a yacht, it might be time for him to go back to Tampa.

 

I like the idea, but not the pitcher himself. Thor just isn't the guy he was with the Mets. I think he'll be overpaid and underperform wherever he winds up next. He is more Derick Lowe than Thor. The doesn't strike anyone out anymore and his velo has dropped off the table.

[mvp 78]

Bloom might trade Verdugo.

 

We all assumed Benintendi would be playing LF in 2021, but with 2 years of control left, Benintendi was traded.

 

We all assumed Renfroe would be in RF for 2022, but with 2 arbitration years left, Renfroe was traded.

 

We all assume Verdugo will be in LF or RF for 2023. Not sure which but definitely one of them.

 

But Verdugo has two arb years left…

 

I suggested this last offseason because he was the guy with the most trade value. He's a player that may do better with a change of scenery too.