Sox extend Whitlock

[moonslav59]

Nope, can't be done. Arms would fall off quickly.

 

It's the same IP, more or less. I'm not s sure.

 

Maybe pitchers would throw harder, knowing they are not going 5-7 innings.

 

Did Bob Stanley's arm fall off?

[Bellhorn04]

One problem might be, if it was Whitlock's "day to pitch," but we were up by 8 or down by 8. It would be a waste to pitch him, but not pitching him would upset the routine and force him to pitch less over a full season, assuming this happens multiple times.

 

Yep, too hard to manage.

[Bellhorn04]

It's the same IP, more or less. I'm not s sure.

 

Maybe pitchers would throw harder, knowing they are not going 5-7 innings.

 

Did Bob Stanley's arm fall off?

 

Did Bob pitch 3-4 innings every third day?

[Bellhorn04]

Stanley did have a rubber arm, no doubt. I don't think he threw that hard, though.

 

Anyway, the modern trend is that guys throw a lot harder and throw less innings.

[mvp 78]

Did Bob pitch 3-4 innings every third day?

 

1982 - 168.1 innings, no starts

1983 - 145.1 innings, no starts

[mvp 78]

Stanley did have a rubber arm, no doubt. I don't think he threw that hard, though.

 

Anyway, the modern trend is that guys throw a lot harder and throw less innings.

 

Hard to really say what the modern trend is just yet. Snell being pulled from the WS was less than 2 years ago.

[Bellhorn04]

Hard to really say what the modern trend is just yet. Snell being pulled from the WS was less than 2 years ago.

 

Max innings thrown by a relief pitcher each year would say a lot.

[mvp 78]

Max innings thrown by a relief pitcher each year would say a lot.

 

I've looked at it before. It was 150 in the 80's. Dropped to about 100 in the 90's. Dropped to 80/90 from then on.

[Bellhorn04]

I've looked at it before. It was 150 in the 80's. Dropped to about 100 in the 90's. Dropped to 80/90 from then on.

 

That's a pretty clear trend.

[moonslav59]

Did Bob pitch 3-4 innings every third day?

 

Not all year long, but pretty much, yes... 3 IP every 3rd game comes to about 162 IP, and he had 168 in 1982.

 

That year he had these stretches:

 

IP date

4.0 5/1

4.0 5/3

5.0 5/6

3.2 5/9

(That's 4 times in 9 days and more than avg 4 IP per outing!)

 

5.0 5/16

6.0 5/19

8.1 5/29

4.2 5/29

3.2 5/31

(This stretch is off the charts crazy! 5 times in 16 days and 27.2 IP- almost 6 IP per outing!)

 

He, then went fewer innings for most of the remainder of the season, but pitched 2.1 to 5 innings a lot.

 

9 times in June 25.2 IP (just under 3 IP per outing)

7 times in July 24.0 (about 3 and a half IP per outing)

11 times in AUG 35.0 (3.1 IP per outing)

8 times in SEP 27.2 (3.1+ IP per outing)

 

He ended the year pitching in 48 out of 162 games (29.6%), which is pretty close to once every 3 days on average. He averages 3.92 innings per outing, so he basically went about 4 IP every 3rd day!

[Bellhorn04]

Stanley averaged 3.7 K's per 9 for his career LOL

[mvp 78]

That's a pretty clear trend.

 

Ok? I'm just saying maybe we see a reversal as pitching usage has changed.

[mvp 78]

Stanley averaged 3.7 K's per 9 for his career LOL

 

And Eichhorn had 9.52 in 86 when he pitched 157 innings.

[moonslav59]

Maybe it is not trending to more RP'ers going more IP... maybe it is...

 

Most IP thrown by RP'er with 0 GS'd:

 

2019 or 2021

96 Gaviglo

92 Beeks

85 LeBlanc

84 Green

84 Huerra

83 3 guys

81-81 5 guys

80 4 guys

(17 over 79.2 IP)

 

2017-2018

119 Yarbrough

95 Chavez

87 Petit

87 Petit

85 Rusin

84 Castro

83 Lorenson

82 N Ramirez

81 Hader & Devinski

80 3 guys

(13 with over 79.2 IP)

 

'15-'16

89 Hand

85 E Ramirez

85 Betances & Devinski

82 Torres

80 4 guys

(only 9 guys)

 

'13-'14

90-96 4 guys

86-89 3 guys

79.2-85 4 guys

(11 total)

 

[Bellhorn04]

And Eichhorn had 9.52 in 86 when he pitched 157 innings.

 

And his innings and K/9 dropped precipitously the next two seasons.

[Bellhorn04]

Maybe it is not trending to more RP'ers going more IP... maybe it is...

 

Most IP thrown by RP'er with 0 GS'd:

 

2019 or 2021

96 Gaviglo

92 Beeks

85 LeBlanc

84 Green

84 Huerra

83 3 guys

81-81 5 guys

80 4 guys

(17 over 79.2 IP)

 

2017-2018

119 Yarbrough

95 Chavez

87 Petit

87 Petit

85 Rusin

84 Castro

83 Lorenson

82 N Ramirez

81 Hader & Devinski

80 3 guys

(13 with over 79.2 IP)

 

'15-'16

89 Hand

85 E Ramirez

85 Betances & Devinski

82 Torres

80 4 guys

(only 9 guys)

 

'13-'14

90-96 4 guys

86-89 3 guys

79.2-85 4 guys

(11 total)

 

 

Yarbrough wasn't a reliever. He generally came in after an "opener".

[moonslav59]

Yarbrough wasn't a reliever. He generally came in after an "opener".

 

Good point, so the trend seems even stronger towards more relief pitchers going 80+ IP over the past few years.

[Bellhorn04]

Gaviglio - after that big innings year in 2019 he has hardly pitched since.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Stanley did have a rubber arm, no doubt. I don't think he threw that hard, though.

 

Anyway, the modern trend is that guys throw a lot harder and throw less innings.

 

Goose Gossage just punched his laptop in the mouth.

[moonslav59]

Gaviglio - after that big innings year in 2019 he has hardly pitched since.

 

So, maybe arms do drop off.

 

You don't see too many repeat names, either.

[Bellhorn04]

Good point, so the trend seems even stronger towards more relief pitchers going 80+ IP over the past few years.

 

What's the leaderboard for 2021 look like?

[moonslav59]

Stanley averaged 3.7 K's per 9 for his career LOL

 

While Bob had a low career K/9 number, his K/9 numbers in those years where he pitched a lot, and the ones afterwards were his highest:

 

5.9 1986

5.0 1988

4.7 1985

4.4 1982 140 ERA+ led the league

4.4 1984

4.0 1983 153 ERA+ (2nd best in career)

7 other seasons between 1.8 and 3.9)

 

His arm seemed to get stronger!

 

[mvp 78]

What's the leaderboard for 2021 look like?

 

Already posted.

[moonslav59]

What's the leaderboard for 2021 look like?

 

They don't count Whitlock's 4 IP in his start, but had we used an opener, it would have, and he'd be tied for the most.

 

13.2 Thompson (4 gms)

13.1 Crowe 6

11.2 Akin 5

10.2 King 5

10.1 Peters 5

10.1 Banks 5

10.1 Ortega 7

10.1 Winder 3

9.2 Whitlock 4

11 guys with 9 to 9.2 IP (7 with 6 or less games)

 

 

[Bellhorn04]

They don't count Whitlock's 4 IP in his start, but had we used an opener, it would have, and he'd be tied for the most.

 

13.2 Thompson (4 gms)

13.1 Crowe 6

11.2 Akin 5

10.2 King 5

10.1 Peters 5

10.1 Banks 5

10.1 Ortega 7

10.1 Winder 3

9.2 Whitlock 4

11 guys with 9 to 9.2 IP (7 with 6 or less games)

 

 

 

I meant 2021, not 2022.

[moonslav59]

I meant 2021, not 2022.

 

84 Green 67 gms

81 Crismatt 45 (the only guy in the top 11 averaging close to 2 IP per outing)

81 Rogers 80

80 Gallegos 73

80 Stammen 79

78 Petit 78

77 Shaw 81

 

12th Whitlock 73.1 in 46 games

[Bellhorn04]

84 Green 67 gms

81 Crismatt 45 (the only guy in the top 11 averaging close to 2 IP per outing)

81 Rogers 80

80 Gallegos 73

80 Stammen 79

78 Petit 78

77 Shaw 81

 

12th Whitlock 73.1 in 46 games

 

Thanks.

[moonslav59]

Thanks.

 

Yusmeiro Petit seems to be the only guy repeating on these lists since moving from a starter to the pen after the 2014 season, but he's no where near Bob Stanley:

 

IP/ games

76-42

62-36

91-60

93-74

83-80

(2020 not counted 22-26 in 60 games)

78-78

[Kimmi]

Great point, but the risk is, what if we go 8 games in a row where we are ahead or behind by 5 runs?

 

True. It's kind of like the idea of leaving your best reliever on the bench for a save situation in the 9th inning that might never come.

[Kimmi]

I'd rather have Whitlock start a game and give them a chance rather then see him languish in the pen as the Sox fall behind early.

 

Yes, me too.