2022 Bullpen Thread

[moonslav59]

You really think playing Story at SS is going to fix the problem? If Story can't hit because he's playing second base then he needs to forfeit his contract and gtfo of Boston.

 

Kimmi was talking about the night they gave Bogey off and played Arroyo at SS- not playing Story at SS FT.

[redsoxrules]

The only SS controversy between Bogey, and Story seems to be on here.

 

Yeah, making excuses for him why he's not hitting so far

[redsoxrules]

Kimmi was talking about the night they gave Bogey off and played Arroyo at SS- not playing Story at SS FT.

 

Sorry, my bad

[Old Red]

Kimmi was talking about the night they gave Bogey off and played Arroyo at SS- not playing Story at SS FT.

 

Cora had already explained the only reason that Story would only play SS this year.

[Kimmi]

Maybe, but I doubt one game would stir the pot.

 

Arroyo is clearly better at 2B than SS, and Story is better at SS than Arroyo.

 

I'm not bashing Cora for the choice, but just stated it "was an option."

 

I just posted in the other thread that my choice would still be to have Story at SS and Bogaerts at 2B. With that being said, Cora knows what he is doing, and if he feels the current alignment is the best one to go with, then it's probably the best one to go with.

[Kimmi]

Not only will the blasts find some gaps, but the liners off pitchers' legs will bounce into no-man's land, and one-stitch bleeders will stay fair, and clutch pop-ups will fall in...

 

... the key to a turnaround may be how many of these benefit Red Sox hitters, instead of opponents.

 

A man after my own heart.

 

The outcome of close games really has more to do with random factors or luck than it has to do with skill. We've been on the wrong end of that so far.

 

And I don't have to point out to you that last night's loss came on another defensive miscue.

[Kimmi]

Whitlock should be the closer. Whitlock should be the closer. Whitlock should be the closer. Come on man!

 

Despite the blown saves, pitching has not been the problem.

[Kimmi]

You really think playing Story at SS is going to fix the problem? If Story can't hit because he's playing second base then he needs to forfeit his contract and gtfo of Boston.

 

No, I'm not saying that at all. Story playing 2B is not the problem. I was just commenting on a post about Arroyo and Story.

[Kimmi]

Yeah, making excuses for him why he's not hitting so far

 

Stop. No one has made any excuses for why he isn't hitting.

[Bellhorn04]

Despite the blown saves, pitching has not been the problem.

 

The other teams' pitching has been a problem.

[Old Red]

Despite the blown saves, pitching has not been the problem.

 

No pitching has not been the problem, but do you think the Red Sox would have won the game last night if Whitlock had been there for a 4 out save?

[Kimmi]

The other teams' pitching has been a problem.

 

No kidding. Who knew there were so many Cy Youngs out there?

[notin]

The other teams' pitching has been a problem.

 

Sadly, no.

 

Right now in don’t think it matters who pitches against them. This team has less firepower than the Salvation Army…

[Kimmi]

No pitching has not been the problem, but do you think the Red Sox would have won the game last night if Whitlock had been there for a 4 out save?

 

Possibly. We'll never know.

 

At the same time, we could just as easily ask if the Sox would have won the game if they scored 5 runs. Or even 2 runs, which likely would have meant not going to extra innings.

[Old Red]

Possibly. We'll never know.

 

At the same time, we could just as easily ask if the Sox would have won the game if they scored 5 runs. Or even 2 runs, which likely would have meant not going to extra innings.

 

We’ll never know is right, but with Whitlock closing is was a greater possibility to win than to lose. I’m not telling you anything you don’t know, but I’m taking my chances with Whitlock over Barnes, or the Sour Man 7 days out of the week. Even though the RED SOX only scored 1 run last night the game was there for the taken, and for Evol, and Cora, and the Red Sox did not take it, and it’s not the first game the Sox could have won this year despite not scoring runs by not having a closer, and it won’t be the last. Unlike Moon I’m not afraid to say I don’t agree with Cora, and I think Cora is wrong by not having Whitlock close games.

[Bellhorn04]

We’ll never know is right, but with Whitlock closing is was a greater possibility to win than to lose. I’m not telling you anything you don’t know, but I’m taking my chances with Whitlock over Barnes, or the Sour Man 7 days out of the week. Even though the RED SOX only scored 1 run last night the game was there for the taken, and for Evol, and Cora, and the Red Sox did not take it, and it’s not the first game the Sox could have won this year despite not scoring runs by not having a closer, and it won’t be the last. Unlike Moon I’m not afraid to say I don’t agree with Cora, and I think Cora is wrong by not having Whitlock close games.

 

That's something that's not necessarily Cora's decision. Whitlock is obviously a very important guy to the team and they have a plan on how to use him and develop him.

 

The fact we don't have an obvious closer (given Barnes's uncertain status) was Bloom's call.

[Kimmi]

We’ll never know is right, but with Whitlock closing is was a greater possibility to win than to lose. I’m not telling you anything you don’t know, but I’m taking my chances with Whitlock over Barnes, or the Sour Man 7 days out of the week. Even though the RED SOX only scored 1 run last night the game was there for the taken, and for Evol, and Cora, and the Red Sox did not take it, and it’s not the first game the Sox could have won this year despite not scoring runs by not having a closer, and it won’t be the last. Unlike Moon I’m not afraid to say I don’t agree with Cora, and I think Cora is wrong by not having Whitlock close games.

 

I get it. I really do.

 

Francona used to always say that you can't chase wins. Cora says the same thing. I believe that the current plan on using Whitlock is to have him starting games. Deciding to deviate from that plan at the last minute to win one game might cost the team 2 or more games next week. As the saying goes, you have to manage the marathon.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

That's something that's not necessarily Cora's decision. Whitlock is obviously a very important guy to the team and they have a plan on how to use him and develop him.

 

The fact we don't have an obvious closer (given Barnes's uncertain status) was Bloom's call.

 

It's definitely part of the problem, as is the non-existent offense. It's May, so it's no longer early. A good line in today's Globe said the Sox went into the season with a roster that looked about 85% complete... and still waiting. Obviously, it's not how much is being spent, but on what it's being spent on.

[Old Red]

I get it. I really do.

 

Francona used to always say that you can't chase wins. Cora says the same thing. I believe that the current plan on using Whitlock is to have him starting games. Deciding to deviate from that plan at the last minute to win one game might cost the team 2 or more games next week. As the saying goes, you have to manage the marathon.

 

Ok I get what your saying too, but I guess we’ll have just have to agree to disagree. If Frail hadn’t gone down again Whitlock would have been in the pen to start the season, and if Houck would have been vaxed Whitlock wouldn’t have made his last two starts anyway, so the plan was already deviated from, and the last report I had heard was that Whitlock wasn’t penciled in to start the next two weeks. I can’t confirm that though.

[notin]

Ok I get what your saying too, but I guess we’ll have just have to agree to disagree. If Frail hadn’t gone down again Whitlock would have been in the pen to start the season, and if Houck would have been vaxed Whitlock wouldn’t have made his last two starts anyway, so the plan was already deviated from, and the last report I had heard was that Whitlock wasn’t penciled in to start the next two weeks. I can’t confirm that though.

 

 

Most recent report is the opposite.

 

https://www.masslive.com/redsox/2022/04/garrett-whitlock-will-start-again-for-boston-red-sox-on-wednesday-tanner-houck-to-remain-in-bullpen-for-now.html

 

Now it’s Houck in the bullpen. Houck could very be a formidable closer, but probably was not available yesterday due to Cora’s insanely and questionably quick hook of Hill on Friday…

[moonslav59]

Updated. The starters are catching up.

 

Most recent report is the opposite.

 

https://www.masslive.com/redsox/2022/04/garrett-whitlock-will-start-again-for-boston-red-sox-on-wednesday-tanner-houck-to-remain-in-bullpen-for-now.html

 

Now it’s Houck in the bullpen. Houck could very be a formidable closer, but probably was not available yesterday due to Cora’s insanely and questionably quick hook of Hill on Friday…

 

I have always leaned towards Houck as the closer and Whitlock starting, but if Whitlock is on a strict innings count for the season, then I'm not so sure.

 

Of course, since Houck is never allowed to see a batter 3 times in a game, it doesn't help his case to start over Whitlock.

 

Ideally, both would be great in the pen, but we'd need Pivetta to turn things around, and quickly, and Hill to build off is last start or two, and someone from the farm to start for us. I'm not sure anyone is ready, right now.

 

Big Nate seems to be finding his groove, and Wacha has been a very pleasant surprise. Hoping for Sale is not a winning strategy.

[Old Red]

Most recent report is the opposite.

 

https://www.masslive.com/redsox/2022/04/garrett-whitlock-will-start-again-for-boston-red-sox-on-wednesday-tanner-houck-to-remain-in-bullpen-for-now.html

 

Now it’s Houck in the bullpen. Houck could very be a formidable closer, but probably was not available yesterday due to Cora’s insanely and questionably quick hook of Hill on Friday…

 

Thanks for the info, and I’m all for giving Houck a shot at closing, but I just think Whitlock is just more consistent.

[notin]

Thanks for the info, and I’m all for giving Houck a shot at closing, but I just think Whitlock is just more consistent.

 

I’d like them both nailing down the ends of games. But the Sox have multiple pitching needs and Houck and Whitlock can only fill two. I have faith in both of them in just about any role, but still, only two roles.

 

But either way, this team (or any team) shouldn’t get 7IP of 1H 0ER starting pitching and yet still leave the bullpen with a mere single run lead to protect. Especially against an Orioles’ staff featuring no starters most people ever heard of, including many Orioles’ fans and possibly some Orioles’ players…

[moonslav59]

Game by Game Breakdown (Updated after 4/30)

 

Starters IP/ER vs Relievers IP/ER

 

SP- RP

L 5.0/3 - 5.0/1 (2 ghost runs allowed)

L 5.2/4 - 2.1/0

W 3.1/3 - 5.2/1

L 4.1/1 - 3.2/2

W 4.1/3 - 4.2/0

W 5.0/2 - 4.0/5

L 2.0/5 - 7.0/4

W 5.2/0 - 3.1/0

W 5.0/0 - 4.0/1

L 4.2/4 - 4.1/4

W 4.2/1 - 4.1/1

L 4.0/5 - 5.0/1

L 5.0/2 - 4.0/1

W 5.0/2- 4.0/0

L 4.0/0- 5.2/3

L 4.0/ 0- 4.0/5

L 7.0/2- 1.0/4

L 4.2/2- 5.0/3 (plus 1 ghost runner)

W 6.0/1- 3.0/0

L 3.0/0- 5.0/0

W 4.0/0- 5.0/1

L 7.0/0- 2.0+/1 (+ ghost runner scored)

 

The pen has done better in 10 games.

The starters have done better in 10.

They did about the same in 2 games.

 

The pen as done okay to well in 14 games.

The starters have done okay to well in 15 games.

[moonslav59]

Our staff has allowed 3 ERs in the last 4 days, and we are 2-2.

[Larry Cook]

Our staff has allowed 3 ERs in the last 4 days, and we are 2-2.

 

If we had a stud closer, we probably have a winning record at the this point in the season, despite the attic offense.

[notin]

If we had a stud closer, we probably have a winning record at the this point in the season, despite the attic offense.

 

If we had an offense, we'd have a winning record. A closer? Maybe a better record, but even that depends on how Cora used him. (For example, if he did not bring him in for 4 outs last night, no difference, But this team has not been giving up 8th and 9th inning leads. They do it much earlier and never get it back..

[moonslav59]

No way.

[Larry Cook]

At the end of the day, we are too far down this road as of may 1st to cry about the spilled milk.

 

Hernandez and story need to get their timing down. Bradley needs to be a late inning replacement only,

[Old Red]

If we had an offense, we'd have a winning record. A closer? Maybe a better record, but even that depends on how Cora used him. (For example, if he did not bring him in for 4 outs last night, no difference, But this team has not been giving up 8th and 9th inning leads. They do it much earlier and never get it back..

 

A good manager would know enough to bring stud closer in for a 4 out save last night, or any night he was available. Of course that takes Cora off the hook last night, because he wasn’t available.