Red Sox have fired GM Dave Dombrowski

[moonslav59]

Well said and overdue .

 

He's more of a troll than Jacko.

[Bellhorn04]

He's more of a troll than Jacko.

 

Thank you.

[moonslav59]

Some folks really need to calm down. Just because DD is being replaced doesn't mean we're unloading the whole team.

 

Yes, there's a chance we don't reset and try to win it all in 2020.

[S5Dewey]

Some folks really need to calm down. Just because DD is being replaced doesn't mean we're unloading the whole team.

 

Ok, but if salary is the problem (and I don't think there's much doubt that it is) then big salaries have to be eliminated along with players who may not be making *big* money but are overpaid in the eyes of the FO. The low-hanging fruit there are Betts, JDM, Porcillo, Price, and Sale. The second tier would be Moreland, JBJ (although I don't agree), and Bogaerts would both bring a good return and eliminate salary. Of those eight I expect to see four or five of them gone by next season.

 

The only regulars whom I think are safe are Devers, Benintendi, and Vazquez...and possibly Bogaerts if they're willing to hold onto that salary.

 

Reality Check: This team has a lot of money tied up in a few players and if JD wants to reset below the LT line many of them are going to have to go. This isn't going to be pretty for the fans because the Sox don't have the farm to replace them. That means that they're going to have to go outside the organization and sign lesser talent FA's which will impact the talent on the team. That's how a team with a weak farm system resets.

 

Personally (and hopefully) I'm still believing that whomever fills DD's shoes sees that the position players are still capable of competing with anyone and they don't start cleaning house - but I also believe that may be nothing more than blind optimism.

[Bellhorn04]

Yes, there's a chance we don't reset and try to win it all in 2020.

 

I don't know if trying to win it all in 2020 is realistic or not.

 

A reset does make sense.

 

But that doesn't mean a fire sale.

[S5Dewey]

He's more of a troll than Jacko.

 

There's a Low Bar if I ever saw one.

[Bellhorn04]

Personally (and hopefully) I'm still believing that whomever fills DD's shoes sees that the position players are still capable of competing with anyone and they don't start cleaning house - but I also believe that may be nothing more than blind optimism.

 

There's a cynical reason to think there won't be a house cleaning.

 

I don't think John Henry likes losing seasons and I don't think he likes pissing off the fans. It's not good for the brand, for the market value of the team.

[Elktonnick]

I don't know if trying to win it all in 2020 is realistic or not.

 

A reset does make sense.

 

But that doesn't mean a fire sale.

 

I agree. I think the DD firing has more to do with style than substance in my view. For example various baseball analysts opined last night that unloading Betts with a year to go on his contract is unlikely to net the sox that big a haul in return in light of recent history of similar such deals.

There will be moves of course but Boston fans wouldn't tolerate a fire sale. I see a moderate reset but before that can happen Henry must hire a head of Baseball Operations. Who that will be largely will affect how the Sox reset.

[jung]

There's a cynical reason to think there won't be a house cleaning.

 

I don't think John Henry likes losing seasons and I don't think he likes pissing off the fans. It's not good for the brand, for the market value of the team.

 

I don't see a major sell off either. Nobody is touching those Starting Pitcher contracts for one thing. But beyond the guys that should go, I think our new Pres of Ops will be willing to talk about just anybody on this team other than a select 4 players. Everybody else will be and should be out on the table.

 

He or she should start early and deal hard. Hold onto Betts till the dust settles and he has some feeling for whether a 2020 run is realistic or not. But make the decision on Betts before the 2020 season starts.

 

I am willing to accept just about any decision a new GM makes on the pitchers outside of the contracts that are just hung around our necks now. Any GM that says he has a clue about where MLB pitching is going in this period is LYING! Its a cluster, utter chaos thanks to MLB and its nonsense. Get out your crystal balls and tarot cards.

[SoxnCycles]

Getting rid of Cora would be a mistake, IMO.

 

Yup,it would be.

And Cora would have another managerial job by Nov.

[Bellhorn04]

Yup,it would be.

And Cora would have another managerial job by Nov.

 

The only ones who think Cora should go are card-carrying FOM members.

[OH FOY]

I hope the Sox promote the Woman as permanent GM, and not Romero. I'm serious about this. I can only go by my wife, she is Great, she save's me money, and always get the most bang for our buck.

This is exactly what the Sox need.

Believe me as Male I don't have this quality, just too impatient, don't mind spending and being stupid.

Edited September 10, 2019 by OH FOY!

[jung]

They are not going to get rid of Cora. Henry IMO won't allow it. Cora made mistakes in 2019. The Sox would be out of their minds not to try to take advantage of that. Lets see if Cora learned from his mistakes:

- 2018 was 2018 Alex. You should have put that season to rest before 2019 started. You didn't. In fact you carried on constantly about it

- Pitching and staffs generally are in utter chaos and they were in utter chaos before 2019 started...just validated by the 2019 season. Cora was too cute by a half in how the staff was handled. Put that to bed too. Nobody in MLB is currently capable of figuring their way through the chaotic mess, the utter cluster that MLB has made of MLB pitching. Stick to the basics until MLB gives us some real direction on the Manfred Missile and other aspects of the MLB effort that has made an utter mess of MLB pitching. Manfred is currently unwilling to even admit to MLB culpability regarding the Manfred Missile. We should continue to call it the Manfred Missile until he fesses up and then takes action to fix it. I for one will even except not fessing up and fixing it. But I won't accept doing neither and if MLB is going to lose this 60+ year fan it will be over Manfred's obvious and overt and in fact FAILED machinations.

- oldest maxim in MLB Alex...games lost in April count as much as games lost in September. Once their lost they are lost. Cost us about 8 games at least with the start of season nonsense and then exec MIS-management hung about another 8 losses on your neck at the trade deadline. You probably could not have done anything about the latter but you could have about the former.

 

Heck they gave DD a year to see if he has learned anything or if he was still the same old dog. Don't see any reason not to cut a young promising manager the same slack.

[notin]

There's a cynical reason to think there won't be a house cleaning.

 

I don't think John Henry likes losing seasons and I don't think he likes pissing off the fans. It's not good for the brand, for the market value of the team.

 

The Sox came in last place 3 times in a 4 season stretch and didn't have some crazy off-season housecleaning. The changed the FO and unloaded a few deals that were not working out. They even waited as long as possible before moving the tradable commodities.

 

JUst because Jacko wants to see the Sox unload Rodriguez and Devers and all the good cheap rtalent while retaining the big contracts doesn't mean it's going to happen. And just becuase I think the Sox need to reset and non-tender JBJ doesn't mean that is going to happen either. And Alex Speier probably has a better idea than any of us, but he doesn't know either. There's no way he can. We don't have anyone making those decisions yet.

 

At the end of the day,we here are just a bunch of people making speculative guesses on message boards with varying degrees of information and experience. I don't mind engaging in that type of conversation, ok I enjoy it, but it doesn't mean much in reality. I could say the only way the Sox can get out of this is to have a pagan sacrifice offering up the live flesh of Bobby Dalbec to the Gods of Launch Angle. But it doesn't mean it's going to happen.

 

And I don't think the Sox are going into a rebuild. "Rebuilding" is a euphemism for "being cheap". The Sox might cut a significant chunk of payroll, but they still won't be cheap...

[Larry33]

In Francona's book Terry stated that these owner don't understand or even like baseball they pretend they do but they really don't. Now the Red Sox has had the most front office staff change than any other franchises since 2004. Everyone in baseball is talking that they don't really understand reasoning behind this move. Under his tenure the Red Sox captured 3 divisional titles and a WS Championship one would have to admit that a pretty dam good record for any team. Theo Epstein was the best man the Red Sox ever had in their front office and he had to fight with this ownership constantly to the point he quit one day he eventually came back but that's beside the point. I'm sure the word is out on the Red Sox owners and this could very well deter good candidates from applying or even possibly thinking about working with these nutbars.

 

Did I hear correctly last night from Jerry Remy criticizing and disliking Larry Luccino when he was in the Red Sox front office even though he didn't mention any name he stated that he was the only one the Red Sox didn't fire as he took another position within the organization.

[notin]

I don't know if trying to win it all in 2020 is realistic or not.

 

A reset does make sense.

 

But that doesn't mean a fire sale.

 

I agree.

 

Getting below $198mill doesn't leave you with nothing but unpaid rookies. The reset limit is still extremely high...

[Elktonnick]

The only ones who think Cora should go are card-carrying FOM members.

 

While you may be correct, I do think the subject of the manager and coaching staff will be a major question to whomever is interviewed for Dombrowski's old job. Remember DD didn't fire Farrell immediately when he was first hired. I suspect whomever is eventually hired will be allowed some discretion as to the manager and coaching staff as was allowed Dombrowski.

[notin]

.

 

Did I hear correctly last night from Jerry Remy criticizing and disliking Larry Luccino when he was in the Red Sox front office even though he didn't mention any name he stated that he was the only one the Red Sox didn't fire as he took another position within the organization.

 

Actually, Lucchino was the only one fired last time, wasn't he? Or was it one of those "retirements", as in "Congrats Larry! You're retiring today! Here's $20. Go buy yourself a cake."

[notin]

While you may be correct, I do think the subject of the manager and coaching staff will be a major question to whomever is interviewed for Dombrowski's old job. Remember DD didn't fire Farrell immediately when he was first hired. I suspect whomever is eventually hired will be allowed some discretion as to the manager and coaching staff as was allowed Dombrowski.

 

Not only did he not fire Farrell immediately, he won two division titles with JF as manager...

[oldtimer]

The Sox came in last place 3 times in a 4 season stretch and didn't have some crazy off-season housecleaning. The changed the FO and unloaded a few deals that were not working out. They even waited as long as possible before moving the tradable commodities.

 

JUst because Jacko wants to see the Sox unload Rodriguez and Devers and all the good cheap rtalent while retaining the big contracts doesn't mean it's going to happen. And just becuase I think the Sox need to reset and non-tender JBJ doesn't mean that is going to happen either. And Alex Speier probably has a better idea than any of us, but he doesn't know either. There's no way he can. We don't have anyone making those decisions yet.

 

At the end of the day,we here are just a bunch of people making speculative guesses on message boards with varying degrees of information and experience. I don't mind engaging in that type of conversation, ok I enjoy it, but it doesn't mean much in reality. I could say the only way the Sox can get out of this is to have a pagan sacrifice offering up the live flesh of Bobby Dalbec to the Gods of Launch Angle. But it doesn't mean it's going to happen.

 

And I don't think the Sox are going into a rebuild. "Rebuilding" is a euphemism for "being cheap". The Sox might cut a significant chunk of payroll, but they still won't be cheap...

 

Agreed. Most of us like to reason through what we see as deficiencies and of course we don't know the full story, yet it is interesting to do so and to hear what others are thinking. My view is the ownership will ask for a reset but will still be willing to spend up to the first tier of the competitive balance tax. That is certainly not cheap but does put us in a better place when 2021 comes around. I expect that the FO will try to keep most of the core of good young players while adding from the minors or low cost acquisitions to field a competitive team in 2020. They will also have to let some players go among whom may be one or two some would rather keep. I am looking for the ownership to hire a new GM with a history of farm system development and also one willing to collaborate in making the tough decisions that the current situation will make necessary

[Larry33]

Actually, Lucchino was the only one fired last time, wasn't he? Or was it one of those "retirements", as in "Congrats Larry! You're retiring today! Here's $20. Go buy yourself a cake."

 

No he wasn't fired he stepped down and they made him President/CEO Emeritus of the Boston Red Sox and he was also elected in the Red Sox HOF.

[jung]

No he wasn't fired he stepped down and they made him President/CEO Emeritus of the Boston Red Sox and he was also elected in the Red Sox HOF.

 

As in shuffled off to Buffalo errrrrr.....Pawtucket.

[notin]

No he wasn't fired he stepped down and they made him President/CEO Emeritus of the Boston Red Sox and he was also elected in the Red Sox HOF.

 

Sounds like some sort of honorary thing.

 

I think Lucchino gets a bad rap on message boards as some guy who knows nothing about baseball, but he is a career sports exectuive with World Series rings and a Super Bowl ring and a Final Four championship under his belt. He knws what he is doing.

 

But I don't know if stepping down was his idea or not. Why do so mid-season? And was it a "lucky break" for the Sox that the Tigers had recently fired his replacement?

[oldtimer]

We have a home grown candidate in Mike Hazen. I imagine he will get a look although due diligence has to be done and there are others out there who might fit. Assistants in the Cardinals or A's organization are mentioned as quality options.

[notin]

We have a home grown candidate in Mike Hazen. I imagine he will get a look although due diligence has to be done and there are others out there who might fit. Assistants in the Cardinals or A's organization are mentioned as quality options.

 

Hazen is currently the General Manager of the Arizona Diamondbacks...

[Bellhorn04]

In Francona's book Terry stated that these owner don't understand or even like baseball they pretend they do but they really don't. Now the Red Sox has had the most front office staff change than any other franchises since 2004. Everyone in baseball is talking that they don't really understand reasoning behind this move.

 

I sincerely doubt that no one in baseball understands the reasoning behind this move.

[illinoisredsox]

Hazen is currently the General Manager of the Arizona Diamondbacks...

 

The standard rule of thumb is teams generally don’t allow lateral moves. So if Hazen is a candidate, it would have to be for Dombrowski’s current position rather than a straight up GM job.

[S5Dewey]

 

At the end of the day,we here are just a bunch of people making speculative guesses on message boards with varying degrees of information and experience. I don't mind engaging in that type of conversation, ok I enjoy it, but it doesn't mean much in reality.

 

Post of the day.

[dgalehouse]

We don't know , and may never know , the " real " reason Dombrowski was fired . On the face of it , it seems kind of strange that someone could have that much success , then get whacked for a few mistakes that resulted in a down season .

[Bellhorn04]

We don't know , and may never know , the " real " reason Dombrowski was fired . On the face of it , it seems kind of strange that someone could have that much success , then get whacked for a few mistakes that resulted in a down season .

 

I really don't think it's that complicated. They didn't think he was the guy for what needs to be done next.