The annual Jackie Bradley Jr thread (2019 Edition)

[Slasher9]

No I'm saying in the 7 years that Jacoby Ellsbury wore the Red Sox uniform he was the better player over JBJ.

 

and for 7 years Manny was the better player then Beni. so what? let me know when you invent the time machine. i will head directly to 1946 and scoop up Ted.

[Larry33]

I’m ok with that. But that doesn’t make it a slight to Bradley...

 

It's just prove that JBJ isn't the player that some are trying portraying him to be for the Red Sox.

[moonslav59]

Your stats seem off to me.

 

Baseball Reference site.

[moonslav59]

No I'm saying in the 7 years that Jacoby Ellsbury wore the Red Sox uniform he was the better player over JBJ.

 

Not by much on offense, except for one year, and not as good on defense, though he got better towards the end, when healthy.

 

If you count all the missed time due to hang nails, I'd call 'em close to even.

[Slasher9]

is anyone saying he is anything but the Boston Red Sox best current option at CF?

that is exactly what he has been the past 4 seasons. the best option to play CF.

 

let me know when mike trout is available.

[Larry33]

and for 7 years Manny was the better player then Beni. so what? let me know when you invent the time machine. i will head directly to 1946 and scoop up Ted.

 

It's just prove how overrated JBJ is in the eyes of many here. Who wouldn't keep Beni over JBJ for CF if one had to be traded.

[Larry33]

Not by much on offense, except for one year, and not as good on defense, though he got better towards the end, when healthy.

 

If you count all the missed time due to hang nails, I'd call 'em close to even.

 

Close math is obviously isn't your strong point how even is 21 compared to 11.

 

Over 7 years Ellsbury put up 21.2 WAR during the same span of 7 years JBJ put up 11.8 WAR that's not even remotely close that's almost double the WAR that JBJ was able to put up.

[dgalehouse]

People have their favorite players . They will defend their favorites, root for them , hype them and find stats that support their feelings . And that's okay . It's human nature . Objectivity is not required, nor is it expected. We are fans ...............However , what does bother me a bit is when fans develop and display an obvious dislike , almost bordering on contempt and hatred , for some players on the team . I guess that is human nature also , but not a very good side of it . Edited May 6, 2019 by dgalehouse

[moonslav59]

Close math is obviously isn't your strong point how even is 21 compared to 11.

 

Over 7 years Ellsbury put up 21.2 WAR during the same span of 7 years JBJ put up 11.8 WAR that's not even remotely close that's almost double the WAR that JBJ was able to put up.

 

And, when Ellsbury was on the bench, how much WAR was that worth?

 

My point was that if you take away Ellsbury's big year, they were close to even. I still think that, WAR not withstanding.

[Bellhorn04]

It's just prove how overrated JBJ is in the eyes of many here. Who wouldn't keep Beni over JBJ for CF if one had to be traded.

 

JBJ isn't overrated by anyone. Every year someone starts a thread about getting rid of him, so his supporters just defend his value.

[Slasher9]

It's just prove how overrated JBJ is in the eyes of many here. Who wouldn't keep Beni over JBJ for CF if one had to be traded.

 

beni sucks in CF. i will take JBj. but you know that babe.

[Slasher9]

Close math is obviously isn't your strong point how even is 21 compared to 11.

 

Over 7 years Ellsbury put up 21.2 WAR during the same span of 7 years JBJ put up 11.8 WAR that's not even remotely close that's almost double the WAR that JBJ was able to put up.

lol. your counting 2013 when he only played 37 games + this year that is only 1 month old in JBj's stats.

[Larry33]

And, when Ellsbury was on the bench, how much WAR was that worth?

 

My point was that if you take away Ellsbury's big year, they were close to even. I still think that, WAR not withstanding.

 

My point is if you take Ellsbury best year then take away JBJ best year you'll end up with Ellsbury with double the WAR that JBJ put up even with his 2010 injured season.

[Larry33]

lol. your counting 2013 when he only played 37 games + this year that is only 1 month old in JBj's stats.

 

Well Ellsbury's first year he played less game than JBJ the only big difference Ellsbury put up positive WAR and was hitting .353 compared to .189 and negative WAR no matter how you want to slice it there's no case to made here it's quite obvious looking at the stats over the span of 7 years.

[moonslav59]

Well Ellsbury's first year he played less game than JBJ the only big difference Ellsbury put up positive WAR and was hitting .353 compared to .189 and negative WAR no matter how you want to slice it there's no case to made here it's quite obvious looking at the stats over the span of 7 years.

 

You are counting 2019 as one of JBJ's 7 seasons, when he's actually played 5 seasons.

 

Ellsbury played 6 seasons with the Sox, if you discount the first season.

 

Yes, a 21.1 WAR is 6 seasons is better than a 12.3 in 5 seasons, but it is not double. It's about a 7 to 5 ratio not 10:5.

 

When you factor in all his missed time and unreliability, I still think they are closer than you do.

 

I was glad we let Ellsbury go, and at the time, I said I wouldn't have paid him even half what the Yanks did.

[Slasher9]

Well Ellsbury's first year he played less game than JBJ the only big difference Ellsbury put up positive WAR and was hitting .353 compared to .189 and negative WAR no matter how you want to slice it there's no case to made here it's quite obvious looking at the stats over the span of 7 years.

 

so you wanted Ellsbury as our CFer over bradley jr for the past 7 seasons. what contract should we have given up the past 7 years to pay for ellsbury? who would have played CF last year, this year, next year?

[Maxbialystock]

People have their favorite players . They will defend their favorites, root for them , hype them and find stats that support their feelings . And that's okay . It's human nature . Objectivity is not required, nor is it expected. We are fans ...............However , what does bother me a bit is when fans develop and display an obvious dislike , almost bordering on contempt and hatred , for some players on the team . I guess that is human nature also , but not a very good side of it .

 

I used to root like crazy for JBJ because he replaced--after a trial run that didn't go well in 2014--Ellsbury and for a lot less money. I remember commenting around 1 August 2015 that I was fine with bringing him back up for another shot because it was still possible he would turn things around. Which he did and with a vengeance that lasted thru all of 2016, easily his best season.

 

My heartburn this year centers around the state of the team, which has struggled, and JBJ, who demonstrably hasn't helped bring the Sox out of their slump--other guys did that. Thus I get a little nasty when the Sox are struggling and all the JBJ fans insist he is still the man and his struggles at bat are temporary. We should be patient. I am also told--relentlessly--that he is still the greatest in CF and frankly I'm not seeing it. Moreover, I have formed serious doubts that his defense really affects game outcomes as often as people claim.

[dgalehouse]

I liked Ellsbury. He was an exciting player to watch . Always hustled and played hard and aggressively. I thought he should have been MVP in 2011 . Unfortunately, he was injury prone and that has only gotten worse as he gets older . But JBJ is our centerfielder now . Why not support him ? I don't get the vitriol.

[Maxbialystock]

I liked Ellsbury. He was an exciting player to watch . Always hustled and played hard and aggressively. I thought he should have been MVP in 2011 . Unfortunately, he was injury prone and that has only gotten worse as he gets older . But JBJ is our centerfielder now . Why not support him ? I don't get the vitriol.

 

A fair response. But my rejoinder is that I root like crazy for the team as a whole and thus don't mind criticizing the guys who aren't helping. Last year I went after Pomeranz with a vengeance. Ditto Kimbrel after the postseason. So right now I'm a lot less willing to "be patient" with JBJ when I've seen this good team struggle and JBJ being one of the reasons for the struggle. Speaking of which, I agree with everyone that our biggest problem by far has been with the rotation which now seems to be improving. But there again I finger JBJ because the great majority of "good field, no hit" advocates say that JBJ is so good he makes the pitchers better, to which I say, "show me some evidence of that in 2019."

 

Someone else put up the W-L records for the Sox for the past 10 years, and they showed that the Sox had just one season when they finished with a winning record after having a losing record in their first 33 or so games.

 

In other words, I'm saying, "please don't tell me how great JBJ was last year or in 2017 or 2016, because the need is now and urgent." I am certain that JBJ had bad spells last year, but who cared when the Sox got off to that great start and never looked back?

[Larry33]

so you wanted Ellsbury as our CFer over bradley jr for the past 7 seasons. what contract should we have given up the past 7 years to pay for ellsbury? who would have played CF last year, this year, next year?

 

That's not what I'm saying, JBJ isn't the player everyone trying to make him out to be he's nothing more than a good defensive player one dimensional there's no upside to his game other than a great glove.

[dgalehouse]

A fair response. But my rejoinder is that I root like crazy for the team as a whole and thus don't mind criticizing the guys who aren't helping. Last year I went after Pomeranz with a vengeance. Ditto Kimbrel after the postseason. So right now I'm a lot less willing to "be patient" with JBJ when I've seen this good team struggle and JBJ being one of the reasons for the struggle. Speaking of which, I agree with everyone that our biggest problem by far has been with the rotation which now seems to be improving. But there again I finger JBJ because the great majority of "good field, no hit" advocates say that JBJ is so good he makes the pitchers better, to which I say, "show me some evidence of that in 2019."

 

Someone else put up the W-L records for the Sox for the past 10 years, and they showed that the Sox had just one season when they finished with a winning record after having a losing record in their first 33 or so games.

 

In other words, I'm saying, "please don't tell me how great JBJ was last year or in 2017 or 2016, because the need is now and urgent." I am certain that JBJ had bad spells last year, but who cared when the Sox got off to that great start and never looked back?

 

That's baseball . It's not easy . Everyone has their ups and downs . Their slumps . Bradley more so than most . Look at his career numbers . That will give you a better idea of his ability . In the end , he will come pretty close to that .

[Bellhorn04]

That's not what I'm saying, JBJ isn't the player everyone trying to make him out to be he's nothing more than a good defensive player one dimensional there's no upside to his game other than a great glove.

 

Jeezus.

 

Do you recall who was the 2018 ALCS MVP and why he won it?

[moonslav59]

That's not what I'm saying, JBJ isn't the player everyone trying to make him out to be he's nothing more than a good defensive player one dimensional there's no upside to his game other than a great glove.

 

The guy already hit over .830 for a 2 year stretch of over 900 PAs.

 

I'd say he still has potential to hit in the high .700's again. He also hit .793 in his last 106 games last year.

 

To pretend this is the JBJ we will be stuck with, and that he has no more upside, is not what I call being realistic.

 

Can JBJ end up near .550 to .600 this year? Of course, he can, but my guess is he ends up over .700 again, which would mean he's have to hit hith .790s the rest of the year, and that would make him a plus going forward.

 

I could be wrong, but I'm not writing him off, yet.

[oldtimer]

A fair response. But my rejoinder is that I root like crazy for the team as a whole and thus don't mind criticizing the guys who aren't helping. Last year I went after Pomeranz with a vengeance. Ditto Kimbrel after the postseason. So right now I'm a lot less willing to "be patient" with JBJ when I've seen this good team struggle and JBJ being one of the reasons for the struggle. Speaking of which, I agree with everyone that our biggest problem by far has been with the rotation which now seems to be improving. But there again I finger JBJ because the great majority of "good field, no hit" advocates say that JBJ is so good he makes the pitchers better, to which I say, "show me some evidence of that in 2019."

 

Someone else put up the W-L records for the Sox for the past 10 years, and they showed that the Sox had just one season when they finished with a winning record after having a losing record in their first 33 or so games.

 

In other words, I'm saying, "please don't tell me how great JBJ was last year or in 2017 or 2016, because the need is now and urgent." I am certain that JBJ had bad spells last year, but who cared when the Sox got off to that great start and never looked back?

 

There are those people on this web site who try to paint other people with concerns about underperforming players as alarmists. I for one don't like to see the main burden of the offense be carried by the same 6 guys while we do nothing to upgrade positions that are underperforming. JBJ is one of those chronic underperformers. So is Leon. Other guys are off to a bad start this year. Pearce, Holt, Mumez and Pedroia are in a funkk but at least there is a chance for improvement. There have been opportunities to replace our worst with better quality although we haven't done it.

[moonslav59]

Jeezus.

 

Do you recall who was the 2018 ALCS MVP and why he won it?

 

Short memories.

 

The guy also hit .793 from May 19th to the end of the regular season- perhaps his longest consistent streak of his career, but we are now supposed to believe he has no upside, and this (2019) is who he will be for the remainder.

[moonslav59]

There are those people on this web site who try to paint other people with concerns about underperforming players as alarmists. I for one don't like to see the main burden of the offense be carried by the same 6 guys while we do nothing to upgrade positions that are underperforming. JBJ is one of those chronic underperformers. So is Leon. Other guys are off to a bad start this year. Pearce, Holt, Mumez and Pedroia are in a funkk but at least there is a chance for improvement. There have been opportunities to replace our worst with better quality although we haven't done it.

 

So, no chance for JBJ to improve, even though he's proven his bashers wrong almost every year after a cold streak?

[Larry33]

I used to root like crazy for JBJ because he replaced--after a trial run that didn't go well in 2014--Ellsbury and for a lot less money. I remember commenting around 1 August 2015 that I was fine with bringing him back up for another shot because it was still possible he would turn things around. Which he did and with a vengeance that lasted thru all of 2016, easily his best season.

 

My heartburn this year centers around the state of the team, which has struggled, and JBJ, who demonstrably hasn't helped bring the Sox out of their slump--other guys did that. Thus I get a little nasty when the Sox are struggling and all the JBJ fans insist he is still the man and his struggles at bat are temporary. We should be patient. I am also told--relentlessly--that he is still the greatest in CF and frankly I'm not seeing it. Moreover, I have formed serious doubts that his defense really affects game outcomes as often as people claim.

 

Excellent Post nobody could've said it any better.

 

Easily we can conclude that your vision isn't impaired by Rose Colored Glasses.

[Slasher9]

Excellent Post nobody could've said it any better.

 

Easily we can conclude that your vision isn't impaired by Rose Colored Glasses.

 

what did you think of last seasons ALDS? do you think the Sox should have benched JBj? although i love the way he was singing a little Sinatra "NY, NY" on the bronx infield after the final out of game 5. who knew he had such a good voice? poor yankees fans only got the Liza version that day. bummer, huh?

[Larry33]

Jeezus.

 

Do you recall who was the 2018 ALCS MVP and why he won it?

 

So because he hit 2 HR in a series while hitting .200 avg

 

Why don't you look at his overall postseason stats which will give you more of realistic picture. The only positive you can find is when nit picking the high points.

[notin]

So because he hit 2 HR in a series while hitting .200 avg

 

Why don't you look at his overall postseason stats which will give you more of realistic picture. The only positive you can find is when nit picking the high points.

 

 

He had an OBP of .400 and an OPS of 1.067. Take your own advice...