Yankees Trade Rumors

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Think of the Sale trade, I guess we agree that Sale >> deGrom, they have similar control years 3 to 2.5 with Sale with a better track record, he was basically a safer bet to trade for, the Sox gave the following

 

Sale for Moncada, Kopech, Basabe and Diaz, at the time of the trade Moncada was BA No. 3, Kopech No. 32, the other two not ranked.

 

If Sale is much better than deGrom at the time of the trade it means that Florial BA No. 38 & Sheffield No. 41 plus to minor pieces it's a fair trade proposal for deGrom, we might not need to include Medina at all.

 

Based on that a very good package would be Florial, Sheffield & Adams (BA No. 81). By the way, I doubt Cashman gives that much for deGrom.

 

There is a comparison to be made between the Sale trade (Moncada, Kopech) and one of your proposals for Degrom (Florial, Sheffield). One of the differences, though, is that Moncada already had success at Double A (a .900 OPS) before moving on to the White Sox. The jump from Single A to Double A is huge, some say it is a harder jump than Triple A to the Major Leagues. It is hard to place a ton of value on a raw prospect like Florial when he already has contact issues and he has never played an inning in Double A. I realize that Florial is an excellent prospect, but there is so much risk associated with him as well.

 

With that said, Kopech didn't have Double A experience when the White Sox acquired him, and thus took on tremendous risk with a raw prospect.

 

If I'm the Mets, and I'm trading Degrom, I'm looking for two top prospects who have had success at Double A or above. The Yankees aren't going to be the only team interested in Degrom.

 

Interestingly, if the Mets use the Sale trade as a model, that might be a disincentive to trade Degrom for Florial and Sheffield. That is, the Sale trade doesn't look all that great for the White Sox right now. Moncada is having problems at the major league level and the rawness of Kopech is catching up to him. Sure, he has a great fastball but he is walking too many batters. Again, the White Sox took on a big risk when they traded for Kopech, who didn't have any Double A experience. Thus, if the Mets use the Sale trade as a model, they will likely conclude that the White Sox didn't get enough for Sale, or didn't get enough proven talent in return for Sale, which is why the Mets should demand Andujar or no trade at all.

 

C.Frazier has experience at the upper levels, but again there is no room for Frazier on the Mets. Frazier would be blocked on the Mets more than he is blocked on the Yankees. The Mets are stuck with Cespedes and Bruce, and have young guys like Conforto, Nimmo, and maybe D.Smith if they move him off 1b.

[jacksonianmarch]

The sox also sent two guys with Kopech and Moncada who had no experience above A ball. Basabe had just finished his first long season in A and was ok. Victor Diaz was coming off his first long season experience as a reliever as well. The sox didn't send them a third and fourth guy who had upper level experience. This is where I think you sell the Yanks short. They have a lot of pitchers with upper level experience, or at least more experience than Basabe and Cruz had at the time of the deal. We might be able to keep two of Sheff, Frazier and Florial when considering the rest of the packages available. We could package Acevedo, Tate, Florial and Swanson or Whitlock and still get the job done. NY has so many upper level pitchers that we have to move some. The question is, who are the mets gunning for and who do they absolutely need in return. They might get two top prospect and a pile of s*** or they can get one top prospects and three guys with proximity who will be in Queens within a few months

[Carpin]

There is a comparison to be made between the Sale trade (Moncada, Kopech) and one of your proposals for Degrom (Florial, Sheffield). One of the differences, though, is that Moncada already had success at Double A (a .900 OPS) before moving on to the White Sox. The jump from Single A to Double A is huge, some say it is a harder jump than Triple A to the Major Leagues. It is hard to place a ton of value on a raw prospect like Florial when he already has contact issues and he has never played an inning in Double A. I realize that Florial is an excellent prospect, but there is so much risk associated with him as well.

 

With that said, Kopech didn't have Double A experience when the White Sox acquired him, and thus took on tremendous risk with a raw prospect.

 

If I'm the Mets, and I'm trading Degrom, I'm looking for two top prospects who have had success at Double A or above. The Yankees aren't going to be the only team interested in Degrom.

 

Interestingly, if the Mets use the Sale trade as a model, that might be a disincentive to trade Degrom for Florial and Sheffield. That is, the Sale trade doesn't look all that great for the White Sox right now. Moncada is having problems at the major league level and the rawness of Kopech is catching up to him. Sure, he has a great fastball but he is walking too many batters. Again, the White Sox took on a big risk when they traded for Kopech, who didn't have any Double A experience. Thus, if the Mets use the Sale trade as a model, they will likely conclude that the White Sox didn't get enough for Sale, or didn't get enough proven talent in return for Sale, which is why the Mets should demand Andujar or no trade at all.

 

C.Frazier has experience at the upper levels, but again there is no room for Frazier on the Mets. Frazier would be blocked on the Mets more than he is blocked on the Yankees. The Mets are stuck with Cespedes and Bruce, and have young guys like Conforto, Nimmo, and maybe D.Smith if they move him off 1b.

 

If you look at the trade today it looks like Boston beat the c.. out of Chicago, but back in the day it was a huge package, in my opinion it was way too much for him, at the end it worked out for Boston. I get your point regarding unproven players, I agree that the safest bet for whoever trades premium players is to get talent at or above AA, bellow that is most of the time a lottery ticket, for example Torres was still a class A player which succeed at the upper levels and the so far in ML, the other side of the coin is the case you mentioned in Kopech (still can be successful case, but as you said he's having issues with his control)

 

If I were on the Mets side I'd ask for Sheffield and Frazier, I doubt Cashman makes the deal but that would be a good package. By the way, the Mets could find some takers for Cespedes and Bruce during the offseason for some minor pieces

[Carpin]

The sox also sent two guys with Kopech and Moncada who had no experience above A ball. Basabe had just finished his first long season in A and was ok. Victor Diaz was coming off his first long season experience as a reliever as well. The sox didn't send them a third and fourth guy who had upper level experience. This is where I think you sell the Yanks short. They have a lot of pitchers with upper level experience, or at least more experience than Basabe and Cruz had at the time of the deal. We might be able to keep two of Sheff, Frazier and Florial when considering the rest of the packages available. We could package Acevedo, Tate, Florial and Swanson or Whitlock and still get the job done. NY has so many upper level pitchers that we have to move some. The question is, who are the mets gunning for and who do they absolutely need in return. They might get two top prospect and a pile of s*** or they can get one top prospects and three guys with proximity who will be in Queens within a few months

 

In any case I don't see the Mets trading their guy to the Yanks without including one or two of Sheffield, Frazier and Florial. remember there's a "premium" required if they are shipping somebody to the Bronx

[jacksonianmarch]

If I’m Cash, I offer Florial, Acevedo, Tate and Whitlock. I agree that you have to send one big prospect. We don’t need to send two

[jacksonianmarch]

Sonny has to go

[jacksonianmarch]

So Sonny Gray had been on a pretty good run until he saw the sox and got smashed. So be it. But today, in Toronto, away from the stress of Yankee Stadium, he lays another egg. He is not even competitive out there. Every pitch in the zone is down the heart. The only guy who cannot hit him is Martin. He's been here a full year. He's halfway through his first full year in NY. It's getting late early here Sonny. I think Cashman needs to seriously consider sending him elsewhere. He's Jeff Weaver, Ed Whitson, Denny Neagle. He has worth with another year of control and a heck of a track record. His stuff hasn't change. His FB velocity is the highest of his career at 93.2mph. He just cannot cut it in NY. Time to go

[moonslav59]

So Sonny Gray had been on a pretty good run until he saw the sox and got smashed...

 

You mean the 2 game stretch before getting shelled against the Sox on Apreil 12th?

 

I guess he did get his ERA down from 6.92 to 4.93 before the next Sox shellacking, but in those 12 games between, he allowed....

 

5 ERs 3 times

4 ERs 2 times

 

5 out of 12 is kind of sketchy.

[jacksonianmarch]

No, the 3.17ERA he had in 5 June starts prior to getting shelled by the Sox.

[moonslav59]

No, the 3.17ERA he had in 5 June starts prior to getting shelled by the Sox.

 

Yeah, that's pretty good.

 

That's a "pretty good" little run. (I added the word "little" for you.)

[dgalehouse]

Maybe this can be Cashman's trade promo : " Sonny is like a frightened little rabbit in New York , but he probably could pitch better for your team." I'm sure that will net something good in return.

[dgalehouse]

If you look at the trade today it looks like Boston beat the c.. out of Chicago, but back in the day it was a huge package, in my opinion it was way too much for him, at the end it worked out for Boston. I get your point regarding unproven players, I agree that the safest bet for whoever trades premium players is to get talent at or above AA, bellow that is most of the time a lottery ticket, for example Torres was still a class A player which succeed at the upper levels and the so far in ML, the other side of the coin is the case you mentioned in Kopech (still can be successful case, but as you said he's having issues with his control)

 

If I were on the Mets side I'd ask for Sheffield and Frazier, I doubt Cashman makes the deal but that would be a good package. By the way, the Mets could find some takers for Cespedes and Bruce during the offseason for some minor pieces

 

The Mets have underachieved , but they do have some talent . The N.L. is , arguably , the weakest it has been in years. There is an outside chance that the Mets could run off a hot streak before the deadline , get back in the race and not be sellers after all.

[jacksonianmarch]

Yanks in on Hand and Britton. I wonder if they’re considering a pen day akin to the Rays.

 

Imagine a playoff game where we go Warren for 2, Green for 2, Holder, Hand, KRob, Betances, Chapman

[OH FOY]

Starters in the Post-Season go max 6 innings. That's the difference. Going BP is the smarter move in todays game. You get a Starter, he pitches, then for 4 days, contributes in no other game. Reliever can effect up to 3 games in that span.

In the Play-offs a reliever effects more games, especially because its a short series than a Starter.

This worries me about Cashman, he sees the importance of this.

You will get a Starter, probably pretty cheap, but if invest in another dynamic Reliever, this is going to be a very scary team.

If Tanaka comes back strong you might not even need a Starter. Move Gray to 5th spot, or German, against these bad teams both the Sox and Yanks face in 2nd half, most Starters are adequate, for the Season, both teams got.

Dombrowski should be thinking this way, but he has no wiggle room, or not enough Proven Prospects.

Edited July 9, 2018 by OH FOY!

[jacksonianmarch]

The Yanks interest in a Machado/Britton package is “heating up”. I call BS. I bet the O’s are feeding that to get a better offer from the Dodgers

[bkzwhitestrican]

I'm sure Cashman asked about him as part of his due diligence as GM. But seems highly unlikely that he lands him.

[OH FOY]

The Yanks interest in a Machado/Britton package is “heating up”. I call BS. I bet the O’s are feeding that to get a better offer from the Dodgers

 

Yep.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Unless Cashman is thinking big. Trade Andujar & Sheffield to the Mets for Degrom. Acquire Machado to replace Andujar. I'm not sure what it would take, probably Florial. The Yankees resign Machado (for 3b) after the season. That would add two elite pieces to the Yankees and they would then be the best team in baseball, not only this year but over the next few seasons.

[jacksonianmarch]

It makes absolutely no sense to deal Andujar. He’s been a very solid contributor on this club. He’s not Machado, but Andujar has five more years of control attached. I wonder if they’re dabbling in the Machado market because the price is dropping. Maybe they get Machado for akin to what the DBacks got JMart for and push Andujar to AAA for enough time for us to get another year of control?

 

I’m also as convinced as ever that we aren’t getting DeGrom. With Wilpon more concerned about the back pages than rebuilding his club, I doubt he’d deal to the Yankees without getting a premium just because they share a city. The Yanks don’t need to pay it. I like the idea of stealing Britton and effectively asking your starter to go 3-4 innings in the playoffs

[Fan_since_Boggs]

I don't buy the argument that the Yankees intend to trade for Machado and then send Andujar down. If they are motivated to acquire Machado, I'm guessing they are considering moving Andujar in a trade for a starting pitcher. They would then resign Machado in the offseason. It's not a bad idea. Championships are more important than prospects.

[moonslav59]

I hope the Yanks trade some of their best young talent for a guy they could just sign this winter.

[Carpin]

I hope the Yanks trade some of their best young talent for a guy they could just sign this winter.

 

That's the reason I don't think it's going to happen, it's a very long shot unless there are more players involved like Britton and the Yankees unload Ellsbury on them.

 

If not, what's the point to trade for him if they can have him for only money in the offseason?

[moonslav59]

That's the reason I don't think it's going to happen, it's a very long shot unless there are more players involved like Britton and the Yankees unload Ellsbury on them.

 

If not, what's the point to trade for him if they can have him for only money in the offseason?

 

The O's will not take Ellsbury, unless the Yanks add another top prospect or young player.

[Carpin]

The O's will not take Ellsbury, unless the Yanks add another top prospect or young player.

 

I know, that's why this trade is not happening, not enough motivation on the Yanks side, we are covered in the IF even if Machado is a top talent, Britton will be just for insurance no because of a current need. Cashman should stay on the SP market, need a TOTR pitcher

[jacksonianmarch]

I disagree on the TOTR starter. I think we need an innings eater type to save our pen come post season. Once we get into the postseason, that innings eater or Gray (whomever is sucking the least) can “start” game 4 of any series we play with the pen rescuing them at the first sign of trouble.

 

We’re going to follow the 2015 Royals method of playoff staff management. Sevy, CC and Tanaka will get a few innings leash then will go batter by batter with the pen coming in for the rescue. The fourth slot will be filled by a “starter” who’ll get bounced after a couple innings at the first sign of trouble.

 

Also, in the playoffs, the spacing is different. You can use a reliever literally every game and they’ll still get standard rest as long as they’re only going one inning a game. As it stands, we’ve got Holder, Green, Warren, KRob, Betances, and Chapman who are all pitching well. Kahnle should be back up soon as he’s dominating in the minors again. That’ll be 7 guys with lights out stuff and numbers. We can take the game from the 3rd inning on and have our pen shut it down

[Bellhorn04]

As it stands, we’ve got Holder, Green, Warren, KRob, Betances, and Chapman who are all pitching well. Kahnle should be back up soon as he’s dominating in the minors again. That’ll be 7 guys with lights out stuff and numbers. We can take the game from the 3rd inning on and have our pen shut it down

 

How'd they make out getting those last 9 outs with a 5-3 lead last night?

 

Sorry man, there was just no way to resist that.

[Slasher9]

How'd they make out getting those last 9 outs with a 5-3 lead last night?

 

Sorry man, there was just no way to resist that.

 

Lol. That post you replied to was the biggest piece of Pollyanna BS I have seen on talksox in my limited time here....

I think you just made me realize something. Jacksonianmarch isn’t just a troll.

Jacksonianmarch is a Yankees Pollyanna Pink Hat.

Edited July 11, 2018 by Slasher9

[Kimmi]

I really think the Yankees' need for a starter is greater than any of our needs,

 

^^This.

[SoxnCycles]

I disagree on the TOTR starter. I think we need an innings eater type to save our pen come post season. Once we get into the postseason, that innings eater or Gray (whomever is sucking the least) can “start” game 4 of any series we play with the pen rescuing them at the first sign of trouble.

 

We’re going to follow the 2015 Royals method of playoff staff management. Sevy, CC and Tanaka will get a few innings leash then will go batter by batter with the pen coming in for the rescue. The fourth slot will be filled by a “starter” who’ll get bounced after a couple innings at the first sign of trouble.

 

Also, in the playoffs, the spacing is different. You can use a reliever literally every game and they’ll still get standard rest as long as they’re only going one inning a game. As it stands, we’ve got Holder, Green, Warren, KRob, Betances, and Chapman who are all pitching well. Kahnle should be back up soon as he’s dominating in the minors again. That’ll be 7 guys with lights out stuff and numbers. We can take the game from the 3rd inning on and have our pen shut it down

 

Good god, Yankee playoff games will be 5 hours long.

[dgalehouse]

Here is the reality: Right now , the Sox have a better team than the Yankees. I am sure that Cashman realizes this and will do something to try and improve his team. That will not be easy unless he agrees to deal some top young talent. He has to make that decision soon.