The 2018 Bullpen Season Thread

[Examiner]

I have a rolled up newspaper ready for the next time he gets in a game.

 

This forum needs a like button.

[moonslav59]

Hembree and Kelly I think will both have their ups and downs - they are not going anywhere. Their good days can be great but on the bad days - oh boy. They both are going to help us but I am rarely comfortable with either one of them coming in when the game is on the line. I might actually feel the same way about Barnes. I think that Smith is going to have an excellent year and nothing else needs to be said about Kimbrel. Walden has a good arm but man oh man has he looked hittable. Poyner is similar to Johnson. they kind of came along together. They both know how to pitch. They can get guys out. If the choice between Poyner and Walden had to be made today - I would send Walden down. I like Johnson as a starter but moving him to the pen could help them become a very very good bullpen. Obviously I'm thinking that Brian Johnson could become a key player for us going forward. You just don't have to have that big power arm to get the job done. I like relief pitchers who throw strikes and don't walk people.

 

Very well said.

 

I couldn't agree more.

[Bellhorn04]

Ain't that the truth. It is why that as much as I like Kelly's power arm, I am never really comfortable with him. It is also a reason why I would never consider having Wright in the bullpen.

 

Ah, let's face it, there's no reliever that really makes us feel comfortable outside of Kimbrel, and even he makes people nervous at times.

[moonslav59]

Relief pitchers often come in during high leverage situations.

 

I'd be nervous with Chris Sale on the mound in the 8th with the tieing run on 2nd base.

[Bellhorn04]

Relief pitchers often come in during high leverage situations.

 

I'd be nervous with Chris Sale on the mound in the 8th with the tieing run on 2nd base.

 

Good point.

[cp176]

Ah, let's face it, there's no reliever that really makes us feel comfortable outside of Kimbrel, and even he makes people nervous at times.

 

You are probably right about that. Maybe - I might start (oh boy) to feel more comfortable with Smith than most of the rest of the guys. Let's face it - most of these guys are pitching relief because they couldn't make it as starters. I disagreed and continue to disagree with the idea that we absolutely needed to add more starters to back up the guys we already have. When Pomeranz and E-rod come back, we are going to have 3 guys that could still become very useful for us going forward. Johnson isn't going anywhere as long as he continues to pitch well and if he gets moved to the bullpen, I really like the looks of it. I kind of like our overall potential depth and I'm glad that we didn't sign anymore slugs.

[a700hitter]

You are probably right about that. Maybe - I might start (oh boy) to feel more comfortable with Smith than most of the rest of the guys. Let's face it - most of these guys are pitching relief because they couldn't make it as starters. I disagreed and continue to disagree with the idea that we absolutely needed to add more starters to back up the guys we already have. When Pomeranz and E-rod come back, we are going to have 3 guys that could still become very useful for us going forward. Johnson isn't going anywhere as long as he continues to pitch well and if he gets moved to the bullpen, I really like the looks of it. I kind of like our overall potential depth and I'm glad that we didn't sign anymore slugs.

No Dumpster Diving is needed.

[Kimmi]

Ah, let's face it, there's no reliever that really makes us feel comfortable outside of Kimbrel, and even he makes people nervous at times.

 

Kimbrel made me nervous last night.

 

One of the best things about Koji is that he didn't mess around. I'm sure he made me nervous in some games as well, but what I remember about him is how he would usually get the job done quickly and without any drama.

[Kimmi]

No Dumpster Diving is needed.

 

There's a long way to go in the season. Even if it turns out that Dumpster Diving is not needed, and I really hope that it's not, there is literally almost no downside or risk to signing these guys to minor league deals. OTOH, the reward could potentially be very good.

 

Insurance, just in case, is a good thing.

[mvp 78]

There's a long way to go in the season. Even if it turns out that Dumpster Diving is not needed, and I really hope that it's not, there is literally almost no downside or risk to signing these guys to minor league deals. OTOH, the reward could potentially be very good.

 

Insurance, just in case, is a good thing.

 

Many dumpster dives either want a clear path to the majors or an MLB contract. Sox don't fit either scenario, IMO.

[Kimmi]

Many dumpster dives either want a clear path to the majors or an MLB contract. Sox don't fit either scenario, IMO.

 

I get that. And I get that Dombrowski has been trying but has been unsuccessful.

 

That doesn't mean that he should rest on his laurels in terms of trying to acquire more starting pitching depth, even if it currently appears that we won't need it.

[Bellhorn04]

Kimbrel made me nervous last night.

 

One of the best things about Koji is that he didn't mess around. I'm sure he made me nervous in some games as well, but what I remember about him is how he would usually get the job done quickly and without any drama.

 

2013 Koji, yes. That Koji was unbelievable.

[mvp 78]

I get that. And I get that Dombrowski has been trying but has been unsuccessful.

 

That doesn't mean that he should rest on his laurels in terms of trying to acquire more starting pitching depth, even if it currently appears that we won't need it.

 

I doubt he actually rests on his laurels though. We think he does, but I bet he's a pretty busy guy.

[Kimmi]

I doubt he actually rests on his laurels though. We think he does, but I bet he's a pretty busy guy.

 

Actually, I don't think he rests on his laurels at all. I think he and his FO team are continuously looking for ways to improve the team.

 

My post was more for the posters who have given me the impression that they think we're good to go and Dombrowski can rest on his laurels as far as starting pitching is concerned.

[cp176]

Actually, I don't think he rests on his laurels at all. I think he and his FO team are continuously looking for ways to improve the team.

 

My post was more for the posters who have given me the impression that they think we're good to go and Dombrowski can rest on his laurels as far as starting pitching is concerned.

 

I think that we are good to go from a pitching perspective but not for one minute do I think that DD isn't constantly looking for ways to improve this team. I understand that there are some here who aren't as impressed with him as I might seem to be but I really hope that they understand that he is working. If there are people that think he is just sitting around doing nothing, sorry but they are numbskulls.

[Spudboy]

I get that. And I get that Dombrowski has been trying but has been unsuccessful.

 

That doesn't mean that he should rest on his laurels in terms of trying to acquire more starting pitching depth, even if it currently appears that we won't need it.

 

I think part of a GM's job is to always be looking to make the team stronger. DD must be on top of which guys are where and what their status is. He needs to be "shopping" all year long. If not, he is not doing his job completely.

 

Keeping an eye out for talent, in this case replacement pitching, is wicked important.

[Kimmi]

I think that we are good to go from a pitching perspective but not for one minute do I think that DD isn't constantly looking for ways to improve this team. I understand that there are some here who aren't as impressed with him as I might seem to be but I really hope that they understand that he is working. If there are people that think he is just sitting around doing nothing, sorry but they are numbskulls.

 

Well, as you know, I am not as impressed with Dombrowski as others are. But even with that being the case, I know that Dombrowski is a smart baseball man and I know that he is constantly looking for ways to improve the team.

[Kimmi]

I think part of a GM's job is to always be looking to make the team stronger. DD must be on top of which guys are where and what their status is. He needs to be "shopping" all year long. If not, he is not doing his job completely.

 

Keeping an eye out for talent, in this case replacement pitching, is wicked important.

 

Agreed. Dombrowski has so much more information and resources available to him than we could ever hope for.

 

He's on top of it.

[Maxbialystock]

Ted Williams said, probably more than once, that the most difficult skill in all sports, not just baseball, was being able to hit a round ball with a round bat squarely.

 

Me, I think pitching is a really close second because command of pitches is so important, and you have do that in addition to having great stuff and throwing so hard you put your arm at risk (Tommy John surgery is edging toward preventive surgery for little leaguers these days).

 

The above to me translates into a simple reality that it is not easy to build a great bullpen before the season starts. So far this season, short as it is, Carson Smith looks awful and rookie Poyner looks pretty darn good (1 runs in 4.2 innings, most by any Sox reliever), mostly because of his location (in my view). Kimbrel, our $13M closer, has pitched four innings and in three of them had two, two, and three baserunners before getting the third out.

 

Right now I'm pretty happy with this bullpen even though it's the rotation that has been so insanely good. And it is unarguable that the pitching staff is carrying this team.

Edited April 6, 2018 by Maxbialystock

[jung]

All I can say about this pen so far is thank God for Poyner. We have seen most of these guys for so long now that we really do know what they are. There are no upside surprises to be had in Kelly or Barnes. I like Hembree as long as a manager for this team can just keep from using him up the way Farrell did. Smith is now a major disappointment that I would not even allow to take the mound again until he figures out what is going on. If Cora can get comfortable with letting the starters go maybe one more inning into games than he is allowing them, it would at least give us some time to get this figured out. Trying to cover even innings 7 and 8 to get to Kimbrel is something of a problem at the moment and covering 6,7 and 8 with this pen is enough to send one running for the liqueur cabinet. Hopefully Thornburg comes back and can contribute.

 

There are no perfect teams, but as the thread title suggests this pen as hovering between bad and flat terrible so far and I just have lost patience with the idea that guys like Kelly and Barnes are going to "come around". Smith.....who knows....When a relief pitcher is wild in the middle of the plate with pitches that have nothing on them whatsoever....I just don't know what to expect until he proves he can get over that hump.

[Bellhorn04]

Ted Williams said, probably more than once, that the most difficult skill in all sports, not just baseball, was being able to hit a round ball with a round bat squarely.

 

Me, I think pitching is a really close second because command of pitches is so important, and you have do that in addition to having great stuff and throwing so hard you put your arm at risk (Tommy John surgery is edging toward preventive surgery for little leaguers these days).

 

It's true. Hitting and pitching at the MLB level are both highly specialized and difficult skills.

[mvp 78]

https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/984504512911237121

 

I'm sorry. I need to apologize for hating on Joe Kelly's straight fastball.

 

The dude is clearly good for the clubhouse. He's a funny guy. His entrance music is the Walmart kid singing Lovesick Blues. He stands up for his teammates.

 

He's great.

[Kimmi]

https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/984504512911237121

 

I'm sorry. I need to apologize for hating on Joe Kelly's straight fastball.

 

The dude is clearly good for the clubhouse. He's a funny guy. His entrance music is the Walmart kid singing Lovesick Blues. He stands up for his teammates.

 

He's great.

 

Kelly is my new favorite Red Sox reliever.

 

Good on him.

[mvp 78]

@ByChrisMason

 

Kimbrel: “Analytics are great but you still can’t measure what it takes to get those last three outs of the game.”

 

Extend Kimbrel NOW!

[harmony]

@ByChrisMason

 

Kimbrel: “Analytics are great but you still can’t measure what it takes to get those last three outs of the game.”

 

Extend Kimbrel NOW!

Anything can be measured ... the question is the predictive relevance.

 

My younger daughter's university this week announced a new major in data science, which "combines cognitive science, computer science and engineering, and mathematics to train students in predictive modeling, data analysis and computational techniques." The goal is to prepare "students for a career in the data-centric society."

 

Big Data apparently is here to stay, whether it's Cambridge Analytica harvesting our personal data or MLB front offices trying to gain an edge (I recommend Big Data Baseball: Math, Miracles, and the End of a 20-Year Losing Streak by Travis Sawchik and The Extra 2%: How Wall Street Strategies Took a Major League Baseball Team from Worst to First by Jonah Keri.).

[FredLynn]

@ByChrisMason

 

Kimbrel: “Analytics are great but you still can’t measure what it takes to get those last three outs of the game.”

 

Extend Kimbrel NOW!

 

This ^^^

 

(As long as the contract is reasonable)

[SoxnCycles]

Anything can be measured ... the question is the predictive relevance.

 

My younger daughter's university this week announced a new major in data science, which "combines cognitive science, computer science and engineering, and mathematics to train students in predictive modeling, data analysis and computational techniques." The goal is to prepare "students for a career in the data-centric society."

 

Big Data apparently is here to stay, whether it's Cambridge Analytica harvesting our personal data or MLB front offices trying to gain an edge (I recommend Big Data Baseball: Math, Miracles, and the End of a 20-Year Losing Streak by Travis Sawchik and The Extra 2%: How Wall Street Strategies Took a Major League Baseball Team from Worst to First by Jonah Keri.).

 

Ohh, the resident "get off my lawn" types are going to like that!

[Bellhorn04]

Anything can be measured ... the question is the predictive relevance.

 

Anything in the physical world can be measured.

 

The metaphysical world is a different story.

[cp176]

Anything can be measured ... the question is the predictive relevance.

 

My younger daughter's university this week announced a new major in data science, which "combines cognitive science, computer science and engineering, and mathematics to train students in predictive modeling, data analysis and computational techniques." The goal is to prepare "students for a career in the data-centric society."

 

Big Data apparently is here to stay, whether it's Cambridge Analytica harvesting our personal data or MLB front offices trying to gain an edge (I recommend Big Data Baseball: Math, Miracles, and the End of a 20-Year Losing Streak by Travis Sawchik and The Extra 2%: How Wall Street Strategies Took a Major League Baseball Team from Worst to First by Jonah Keri.).

 

thats good really good but I'm more inclined to actually listen and believe what Kimbrel has to say about pitching in the 9th as opposed to anything data driven might have to add.

[MADSTORK]

Hembree 8IP 8H 5ER

 

Reed 8IP 1ER 9K

 

Priceless